Don't read too much into this, if i meant this to be about anyone or any incident in particular i'd name names right off the bat.
Now i feel accountability is a good thing, that perhaps some sort of system of letting people know why their stuff was deleted would be a great idea.People at times will honestly do or post something against the rules unbeknownst to themselves.Or perhaps a normally sane person might lose it for a few minutes and let the written word get to them uncharacteristically and slip up temporarily.
That said do you feel someone who is deliberately trolling, being a pain in the ass, and creating problems and work for the mods while stressing out and/or annoying other forum members, also deserves that courtesy?
**edit** re-title of my previous thread
agreed. ttt for accountability!
You didn't answer the question though ;-)
NO!!
Trolls deserve little to no courtesy. Those who go looking for trouble all of the time shouldn't be surprised at all when there posts get deleted. Even when their intentions aren't all bad, if there is any "grey" area in their intent then it is like the boy that cried wolf, and if their post gets deleted, then oh well.
If they stopped looking to start shit, then "shit" wouldn't find them, now would it??!!!
Adam
That said do you feel someone who is deliberately trolling, being a pain in the ass, and creating problems and work for the mods while stressing out and/or annoying other forum members, also deserves that courtesy?No, they don't necessarily deserve the benefit (though the line between deliberately trolling and not can be in the eye of the beholder). But everyone else does deserve that benefit. When threads and posts disappear, I want to know who did it and why. I bet KOFighting (site advertiser) would be happier to see:"X deleted by Spankenstyne on 4/1/2003 for a violation of rule 23.4: being an ass"then having to wonder what on earth happened to his post that's been sent to the bit-box in the sky.I think it would just be much less work for the mods if there were an automatic trail of moderator activity. It would cut down on conspiracy theorizing, finger pointing, and Kirik mailing.
"That said do you feel someone who is deliberately trolling, being a pain in the ass, and creating problems and work for the mods while stressing out and/or annoying other forum members, also deserves that courtesy?"
deliberation is subjective. King Yoshida may be a troll to many here, but that's simply because his views are out of the gracie-nuthugging party line. Gracie nuthuggers see him as a troll, while judo lovers see him as being rational. I think this place needs to be conscious or aware of its extreme bias towards BJJ and improve it from the root of the problem.
I have nothing against BJJ btw, but when threads that simply contain Yoshida's words are deleted, the bias is obvious and this problem has to be dealt with.
Require any moderator who takes an action against another to post a thread explaining their action. Wouldn't prevent a rogue mod. He would just fail to do so.Either that or have a place that logs moderators actions that is open to public view.That's a great idea. :)
You want to be reasonable, but you continue to use inflamatory wording: "Gracie nuthuggers". Part of the problem.
Either that or have a place that logs moderators actions that is open to public view.
good idea, but probably won't happen.
Knowing who deletes posts only hurts the sport!
"You want to be reasonable, but you continue to use inflamatory wording: "Gracie nuthuggers". Part of the problem."
that's what they are! When you censor and delete reasonable non-trolling posts that support Yoshida or expose royce, you are in fact a gracie nuthugger! There is nothing wrong with what I am saying.
If you can't handle hearing "grace nuthuggers" I think you should get off the internet and try and get some skin.
If you know someones a troll, then why would anything they say bother you?
There is nothing wrong with what I am saying.Technically, maybe not. But are you going to get reasoned discussion with that tone? I don't think so.You are just another person adding a small stick to the fire. There are enough people here to burn a small town down if they are not careful.
The Gracie supporters aren't even man enough to read Yoshida's words regarding his injuries, that's why my thread was deleted. THe BJJ-nuthuggers erased my harmless thread "Kondo exposes Sperry's skull," which was a fact, but that got erased as well because the mods here couldn't stand the fact that a karateka laid the beatstakes on a BJJ legend.
If those not nuthugging actions, you need to check you noodle NWS.
When the grand poobah is of the type of character as Kirik is, there is no hope for this place.
"Technically, maybe not. But are you going to get reasoned discussion with that tone? I don't think so."
You are absolutely correct with this one. But this tone that you accuse me of is used against Yoshida w/ 10x more venom. You have to adjust yourself to the level of whom you are speaking to, IMO.
If you can't handle hearing "grace nuthuggers" I think you should get off the internet and try and get some skin.I can handle it just fine, but it leads to flame wars which do no one any good. I like some good smack talk, but in a text based medium like this, it tends to blow up into nonsense if people aren't careful and civil.Just look at the whole BJJ/Judo thing. The bad feelings are a result of years of small bashes of just this kind (yocheata, gracie-nuthugger). BJJ v Judo is foolish and destructive. Anyone with two brain cells to rub together can see how both are useful and effective arts. But years of recriminations have left both sides raw and hypersensitive.This is no good for anyone.
If those not nuthugging actions, you need to check you noodle NWS.I might think it, but I wouldn't say it. That requires restraint, and I try to practice it. I often fail.You have to adjust yourself to the level of whom you are speaking to, IMO.Rise above, man, rise above!
If there isn't a consequence for doing a bad job as a moderator, NOTHING will change in the end.Simply true.
Do non-paying members get access to mma.tv mail?
Either way, an easy way to deal w/ it is to have an automatic message when a post is deleted or thread is deleted sent to either the individual or people who posted on the thread with the following info:
1. When it was deleted.
2. Who deleted it.
3. Reason it was deleted (this is probably a couple word description by the moderator).
That creates accountability.