Tito vs Frank on a co-promoted Affliction/Strikeforce card would pull some good on CBS. Just make sure the marketing is solid and the rest will follow.
Tito's elbows from the guard would turn frank into a grease spot on the canvas.
Renzo took frank down at will, the tito that fought forrest would have mauled frank, cmon guys......
Tito only lost the first one due to poor conditioning. If he got back on his old routine he'd dominate frank
Tito would crush Frank.
In the last 9 YEARS Frank has:
--5 fights
--3 wins. KO of Baroni, Sub of Pardoe whose record is
12 - 13, and a KO of Cesar Gracie who had ZERO
mma experience.
--2 losses. TKO by Cung Le who hasn't beaten anyone of
note, and a DQ loss to Renzo who was controlling Frank
the entire fight.
Yeah, Tito should just go ahead and retire rather than face Frank.
I think one thing stands out.... what weight would this be at. Tito hasn't fought at MW in years. Would frank meet him at a catch weight? Can Tito, who looks as if he walks at 230lbs make 186 and be effective?
I wouldn't mind seeing it though!
Tito was not 'dominating' 80% of the first fight. He was on top, yes, but not doing any damage and tiring himself out for the impending beatdown.
bryanand - The only way I would want to watch this fight is with no time limits.
Frank's takedown defense is crap and Tito's sub defense is too good. Tito would lay on Frank for 3 rounds unless Frank catches him while Tito is shooting.
yup
I guess if you count Tito digging into Frank's cut and having top position as dominating the fight...then yeah sure...but in the end it did not matter. Tito was the one tapping the mat.
IBendo4Hendo - "Tito dominated 75-85% of that fight but in a rematch, I don't think Tito would last 2 rounds.
Cindy"
I respectfully disagree. Tito + New Back >>> Fringe Top 10 MW.
I think Tito is going to be dangerous for anyone now. And if we really look at his past performances through a clear perspective:
He split decisioned Forrest with bad knees
He got caught by Chuck, who had a huge mental advantage over him
He drew with Rashad, despite a bad back
He got decisioned by Machida
I think it would be ridiculous to put Tito out of the top 5, ability-wise. Now that he has a new back, I think he is going to be even more dominant.
I see big things for Tito, if only he and Zuffa could put their pride down and realize Money >>> Pride
Tito doesn't know how to simply STFU, train and fight. He thinks he's a businessman and has made the game more about money and conflict than competing. I just don't think he cares too much anymore but will step up for a paycheck... if he can find someone to offer him one. If he still had his old school mentality I believe he could take Frank in the rematch but he doesn't.
Frank has a big mouth but shows up to scrap each and every time. Frank would slaughter Tito, IMO. I'd love to see it happen while both guys are still competitive so perhaps Coker will put it together.
Cindy
i'd love frank t o win, but hes easy to takedown and keep there, tito is good at that. and u know who showed tito how to train for insane cardio? frank did. after they fought and frank out cardio'd him. without the cardio advantage, frank for sure woulda lost the decision. and he will today
CindyO -FingerorMoon - I think Frank would beat him worse now than he did back then.
For the last few years Tito has stood still and just covered up while people strike. Every now and then he shoots from long range to try a takedown.
But who knows, maybe his back surgery will bring back the old agressive Tito ?
Tito dominated 75-85% of that fight but in a rematch, I don't think Tito would last 2 rounds.
Cindy
I think we're basically agreeing but I wouldn't say Tito dominated 80+% of that match.
It was the perfect gameplan by Frank, letting Tito wear himself out and getting up with 30 seconds to go in each round to throw strikes and make Tito work without expending too much energy.
FingerorMoon -CindyO -FingerorMoon - I think Frank would beat him worse now than he did back then.
For the last few years Tito has stood still and just covered up while people strike. Every now and then he shoots from long range to try a takedown.
But who knows, maybe his back surgery will bring back the old agressive Tito ?
Tito dominated 75-85% of that fight but in a rematch, I don't think Tito would last 2 rounds.
Cindy
I think we're basically agreeing but I wouldn't say Tito dominated 80+% of that match.
It was the perfect gameplan by Frank, letting Tito wear himself out and getting up with 30 seconds to go in each round to throw strikes and make Tito work without expending too much energy.
I wouldn't imagine Frank went into that match with the idea of letting Tito wear himself out because Tito was a freakin' cardio machine back in the day, as was Frank. You have piqued my interest in recalling the specifics so I think I'll pop in the VHS of 22 tomorrow and watch it again=)
Cindy
I wonder if they can do a 5-Round Superfight..
since it is a non-title.. most likely a catch weight..
I wonder if the CSAC would OK something like this..
parklife - I wonder if they can do a 5-Round Superfight..
since it is a non-title.. most likely a catch weight..
I wonder if the CSAC would OK something like this..
They did with Royce vs Hughes but the gap was less than 10 pounds. Not sure what the gap would be for Tito vs Shammy-Lite.
Cindy
CindyO -FingerorMoon -CindyO -FingerorMoon - I think Frank would beat him worse now than he did back then.
For the last few years Tito has stood still and just covered up while people strike. Every now and then he shoots from long range to try a takedown.
But who knows, maybe his back surgery will bring back the old agressive Tito ?
Tito dominated 75-85% of that fight but in a rematch, I don't think Tito would last 2 rounds.
Cindy
I think we're basically agreeing but I wouldn't say Tito dominated 80+% of that match.
It was the perfect gameplan by Frank, letting Tito wear himself out and getting up with 30 seconds to go in each round to throw strikes and make Tito work without expending too much energy.
I wouldn't imagine Frank went into that match with the idea of letting Tito wear himself out because Tito was a freakin' cardio machine back in the day, as was Frank. You have piqued my interest in recalling the specifics so I think I'll pop in the VHS of 22 tomorrow and watch it again=)
Cindy
Wow, you're UFC history is way off today :)
This is the match that changed Tito and turned him into a cardio machine. Frank's plan revolved almost solely around out lasting Tito and making him wear himself out.
After Frank beat him, Tito went to him and asked him to teach him the magic that is cardio...and from THEN on we got Tito Ortiz cardio machine.
This has been confirmed by both Frank and Tito many many.....many times :)
^^^agreed, always interesting and good inside info
Frank was gassed in the Baroni fight. He had the tools to take Baroni out early; but didn't and Baroni stayed in the fight. I don't think he will outlast Tito, if Tito is serious.
Soren001 - Frank was gassed in the Baroni fight. He had the tools to take Baroni out early; but didn't and Baroni stayed in the fight. I don't think he will outlast Tito, if Tito is serious.
frank blew out his knee and didnt train for about 2 weeks before the fight
I don't really know why people would pick Frank. Frank's takedown defense has never been that great, and Tito would have the size advantage. Tito Ortiz would take him down over and over, and win a decision.
FingerorMoon -CindyO -FingerorMoon -CindyO -FingerorMoon - I think Frank would beat him worse now than he did back then.
For the last few years Tito has stood still and just covered up while people strike. Every now and then he shoots from long range to try a takedown.
But who knows, maybe his back surgery will bring back the old agressive Tito ?
Tito dominated 75-85% of that fight but in a rematch, I don't think Tito would last 2 rounds.
Cindy
I think we're basically agreeing but I wouldn't say Tito dominated 80+% of that match.
It was the perfect gameplan by Frank, letting Tito wear himself out and getting up with 30 seconds to go in each round to throw strikes and make Tito work without expending too much energy.
I wouldn't imagine Frank went into that match with the idea of letting Tito wear himself out because Tito was a freakin' cardio machine back in the day, as was Frank. You have piqued my interest in recalling the specifics so I think I'll pop in the VHS of 22 tomorrow and watch it again=)
Cindy
Wow, you're UFC history is way off today :)
This is the match that changed Tito and turned him into a cardio machine. Frank's plan revolved almost solely around out lasting Tito and making him wear himself out.
After Frank beat him, Tito went to him and asked him to teach him the magic that is cardio...and from THEN on we got Tito Ortiz cardio machine.
This has been confirmed by both Frank and Tito many many.....many times :)
Ahhhh! You're 100% right. I do remember now and this match was the turning point for Tito taking cardio more seriously. Good stuff, but yeah, you're right=)
Cindy