Hi, I am wondering what your oppinion on the two contraversial judges decision are?
Personally, the way I see it, Renzo probably should have gotten the nod against Newton as Pride seems to be finally enforcing their criteria. (which means that Arona might have to totally revamp his game and actually use all of his skills)
The Newton vs. Takase match had neither guy hurt each other, and was basically very similar to Ricco vs. Mino IMO. The fact that Takase won (well personally annoying to me as a Canadian) shows some consistency.
The fight with Ryan vs. Minowa was a much better indication of this IMO. Minowa winning would have meant that positioning and point-fighting should win (as it does under Nevada rules), but Gracie getting the win for going for the FINISH numerous times in the first (longer) round won him the fight as Minowa never attempted to GNP Ryan to a TKO IMO.
Both decisions were consitent with each other, and would have gone the other way in the UFC. I am not sure which way is better, but I am wondering what your thoughts are as you say that Japan usually screws the foreign fighter, but Minowa lost the close won this time.
Mind you, Ryan G disagrees with me, he says
"The difference is that Newton didn't do much (or any?) damage to Takase on the mat, whereas Minowa landed a ton of punches from Ryan's guard. Newton was passive, Minowa was aggressive.
Actually, neither Takase nor Newton deserved the decision. It was a draw. Too bad Pride doesn't allow draws. It's just that if I HAD to vote for one guy, I'd vote for Takase for his attempts to finish, and the fact that he landed the cleaner shots standing. Though neither guy did much standing, either. The fight was a draw...
Minowa really pulled out the win in the last 6 or 7 minutes, IMO. Again, this fight probably would've been better to vote a draw, but without that option, I'd give it to Minowa."--Ryan G
Oh, and for some stupid reason, Pride generally doesn't update the weights on their telecast. So Ryan and Minowa are both listed at the weights that they first weighed in for at Pride. However, the commentators said that Minowa was 10kg lighter at the weigh-in, but he elected to allow knees on all fours anyway. That is an area of production that must be addressed IMO.
personally, Ryan only looked heavier as he seems to be in bad shape compared to before?
ttt
Sothy I thought that Newton won the fight until Matt Hume started telling about the importance of trying to end the fight. He also said how they use stopwatches to monitor the time people are on the attack, in control of their opponents etc.
Using this criteria Takase won because he was very active from the bottom in going for submissions. Carlos never tried to end the fight. This is the same reason why I said Renzo should have beat Carlos. I am glad you finally agree with me.
I must say I was very surprised when Ryan got the win. In a semi close fight the nod always goes to the Japanese fighter. Well this time they made a liar out of me.
IN my opinon Ryan won 10 minutes of this 15 minute fight. He won the first 9 minutes of round 1 and the first minute of round 2. He scored all of the takedowns. He tried several subs. He also tried to finish with punches from the mount a few times.
Minowa did nothing accept punch from the guard. The only thing I thought was fishy was how Minowa was allowed to use the corner/ropes. Every other fight was moved to the center. For some reason this one wasn't.
If Pride continues to consistently judge in this fashion then I will have no complaints. Right now they have stuck to this criteria in every fight but the Renzo/Newton fight. Hopefully they will remain consistent so we fans have a clue at what they actually are looking for during the fight.
Well, they did move hte Minowa/Ryan fight to the middle a few times, but Minowa always worked his way back there, which is legal, it is just a question of how quickly one should get reset. I thought that it wasn't that bad as Ryan was allowing Minowa to do that to him, if Ryan was actively trying to resist it, the resets may have been faster/not needed. Ryan did dominate by minutes, but that doesn't factor in how dominant you are in those minutes (by Ryan had his back, got a pretty tight choke in, etc., so he was doing good). That boy needs more cardio if he is going to rematch Sakuraba though, he won't get the easy takedowns in that case.
Yeah, I am happy that Ryan got the win as it sheds a good light on the organization IMO. The thing I am annoyed about is that if Carlos had lost to Renzo, he probably would have opened up more against Takase (unless Takase is just that good)...then again, he may not have gotten his last fight in the UFC or this Pride if he had lost, so that is tough.
GC, how well does Renzo know the criteria? As a fighter, does he keep it in mind when he is preparing? (his commentating didn't seem to reflect it)
thanks btw
Sothy,
Sorry it took so long. You are correct. He doesn't worry about the judges too much. Renzo trains to finish the fight.
As you can see he is very laid back. He gets himself in shape and tries to finish the fight. He doesn't count on a judges decision.
Renzo is aggressive in the ring. Even in the Ohara and Oyama fights Renzo was always moving forward. It wasn't his fault both of those guys didn't want to fight.
I'm happy that I checked this thread again. Btw, are you planning on competing in MMA anytime soon? Now that you are 270 and a brown belt, doesn't that make you marketable?