Dean lister is the shizz. Worked with one of your black Belts in Austin, so good. 
excellent response. thanks Dean
Naderhood,
I'm not a blackbelt anymore I think... Its a little worn and looks a bit more grey now hehe,
caseharts,
You work with Ben in Austin?
onlythestrongsurvive,
Yes I have heard from several people he's a maniac in training
Shawnthebadger,
thanks
DeanLister - Naderhood,
I'm not a blackbelt anymore I think... Its a little worn and looks a bit more grey now hehe,
caseharts,
You work with Ben in Austin?
onlythestrongsurvive,
Yes I have heard from several people he's a maniac in training
Shawnthebadger,
thanks
I went to his new gym east side elite over this summer. Him and Derrick garza are awesome. I wish I lived closer I was spending 300 bucks in gas just to train there and I have a little car. Now I'm looking for something closer or moving to Austin.
If Ben is any reflection on your ability and teaching you are fantastic.
Also toby imada is there and is a bad ass.
DeanLister - OK i'll put in my 2 cents..Hey dead, if you read this I would love for you to expand on your thoughts that he held on too long.
No it wasn't appropriate for Palhares to hold that long on the submission... It really wasn't, he did similar to my friend Thomasz Drwal from Poland as well, Thomasz ended up ok but yeah he was hurt... With that said I must say that Palhares is really nice guy, just he's a bit "different headwise" lets just say, I don't think he was trying to be a bad sport, of course he was trying to take opponents knee home with him, his intentions were to win the fight, I don't "think" he was trying to be a bad sport (or i may be wrong, someone said he had beef with opponent). He isn't a very complicated guy, I know him, he's really cool guy and I'm sorry to see him banned from UFC. He as a person doesn't deserve it but his actions have set this in stone looks like. UFC needs to/will use this as an example.. So Yes I think he held on grossly too long and that behavior cannot be tolerated especially after this already happening before. It would prove in UFC's mind a liability to UFC.
Should he have released the hold from one of the taps?
Or hold until the ref stops you?
I'm on the fence about this due to history, but also thinking logically, IF you hold until ref stops the fight, the ref coming from a blind spot, 1.08 seconds is a reasonable amount of time to recognize the ref and releasing the hold IMO.
However if you think he should have let go from taps, then it's a different conversation.
ShowtimeWreckedMyLeever -DeanLister - OK i'll put in my 2 cents..Hey dead, if you read this I would love for you to expand on your thoughts that he held on too long.
No it wasn't appropriate for Palhares to hold that long on the submission... It really wasn't, he did similar to my friend Thomasz Drwal from Poland as well, Thomasz ended up ok but yeah he was hurt... With that said I must say that Palhares is really nice guy, just he's a bit "different headwise" lets just say, I don't think he was trying to be a bad sport, of course he was trying to take opponents knee home with him, his intentions were to win the fight, I don't "think" he was trying to be a bad sport (or i may be wrong, someone said he had beef with opponent). He isn't a very complicated guy, I know him, he's really cool guy and I'm sorry to see him banned from UFC. He as a person doesn't deserve it but his actions have set this in stone looks like. UFC needs to/will use this as an example.. So Yes I think he held on grossly too long and that behavior cannot be tolerated especially after this already happening before. It would prove in UFC's mind a liability to UFC.
Should he have released the hold from one of the taps?
Or hold until the ref stops you?
I'm on the fence about this due to history, but also thinking logically, IF you hold until ref stops the fight, the ref coming from a blind spot, 1.08 seconds is a reasonable amount of time to recognize the ref and releasing the hold IMO.
However if you think he should have let go from taps, then it's a different conversation.
count one mississippi, it's long enough in BJJ to do major damage when a sub is already pushing ripping or breaking something
ChaosOverkill -I get that. And I understand I really do. But if we're talking holding until the ref jumped in. And then his reaction time of recognizing what happened. 1.08 is not THAT bad of a reaction time to fully let goShowtimeWreckedMyLeever -DeanLister - OK i'll put in my 2 cents..Hey dead, if you read this I would love for you to expand on your thoughts that he held on too long.
No it wasn't appropriate for Palhares to hold that long on the submission... It really wasn't, he did similar to my friend Thomasz Drwal from Poland as well, Thomasz ended up ok but yeah he was hurt... With that said I must say that Palhares is really nice guy, just he's a bit "different headwise" lets just say, I don't think he was trying to be a bad sport, of course he was trying to take opponents knee home with him, his intentions were to win the fight, I don't "think" he was trying to be a bad sport (or i may be wrong, someone said he had beef with opponent). He isn't a very complicated guy, I know him, he's really cool guy and I'm sorry to see him banned from UFC. He as a person doesn't deserve it but his actions have set this in stone looks like. UFC needs to/will use this as an example.. So Yes I think he held on grossly too long and that behavior cannot be tolerated especially after this already happening before. It would prove in UFC's mind a liability to UFC.
Should he have released the hold from one of the taps?
Or hold until the ref stops you?
I'm on the fence about this due to history, but also thinking logically, IF you hold until ref stops the fight, the ref coming from a blind spot, 1.08 seconds is a reasonable amount of time to recognize the ref and releasing the hold IMO.
However if you think he should have let go from taps, then it's a different conversation.
count one mississippi, it's long enough in BJJ to do major damage when a sub is already pushing ripping or breaking something
ShowtimeWreckedMyLeever -ChaosOverkill -ShowtimeWreckedMyLeever -DeanLister - OK i'll put in my 2 cents..
No it wasn't appropriate for Palhares to hold that long on the submission... It really wasn't, he did similar to my friend Thomasz Drwal from Poland as well, Thomasz ended up ok but yeah he was hurt... With that said I must say that Palhares is really nice guy, just he's a bit "different headwise" lets just say, I don't think he was trying to be a bad sport, of course he was trying to take opponents knee home with him, his intentions were to win the fight, I don't "think" he was trying to be a bad sport (or i may be wrong, someone said he had beef with opponent). He isn't a very complicated guy, I know him, he's really cool guy and I'm sorry to see him banned from UFC. He as a person doesn't deserve it but his actions have set this in stone looks like. UFC needs to/will use this as an example.. So Yes I think he held on grossly too long and that behavior cannot be tolerated especially after this already happening before. It would prove in UFC's mind a liability to UFC.Hey dead, if you read this I would love for you to expand on your thoughts that he held on too long.<br /> <br /> Should he have released the hold from one of the taps?<br /> <br /> Or hold until the ref stops you?<br /> <br /> I'm on the fence about this due to history, but also thinking logically, IF you hold until ref stops the fight, the ref coming from a blind spot, 1.08 seconds is a reasonable amount of time to recognize the ref and releasing the hold IMO.<br /> <br /> However if you think he should have let go from taps, then it's a different conversation. <img alt="Phone Post 3.0" border="0" src="/images/phone/apple.png" style="vertical-align:middle;" /></blockquote> <br /> <p> count one mississippi, it's long enough in BJJ to do major damage when a sub is already pushing ripping or breaking something</p> </blockquote> I get that. And I understand I really do. But if we're talking holding until the ref jumped in. And then his reaction time of recognizing what happened. 1.08 is not THAT bad of a reaction time to fully let go <img alt="Phone Post 3.0" border="0" src="/images/phone/apple.png" style="vertical-align:middle;" /></blockquote>
Maybe so but Palhares being a repeat offender 1 second is inflated by the scrutiny, it just is.
ChaosOverkill -ShowtimeWreckedMyLeever -ChaosOverkill -ShowtimeWreckedMyLeever -And that's where I'm conflicted. We have clearly seen a pattern develop with him.DeanLister - OK i'll put in my 2 cents..
No it wasn't appropriate for Palhares to hold that long on the submission... It really wasn't, he did similar to my friend Thomasz Drwal from Poland as well, Thomasz ended up ok but yeah he was hurt... With that said I must say that Palhares is really nice guy, just he's a bit "different headwise" lets just say, I don't think he was trying to be a bad sport, of course he was trying to take opponents knee home with him, his intentions were to win the fight, I don't "think" he was trying to be a bad sport (or i may be wrong, someone said he had beef with opponent). He isn't a very complicated guy, I know him, he's really cool guy and I'm sorry to see him banned from UFC. He as a person doesn't deserve it but his actions have set this in stone looks like. UFC needs to/will use this as an example.. So Yes I think he held on grossly too long and that behavior cannot be tolerated especially after this already happening before. It would prove in UFC's mind a liability to UFC.Hey dead, if you read this I would love for you to expand on your thoughts that he held on too long.<br /> <br /> Should he have released the hold from one of the taps?<br /> <br /> Or hold until the ref stops you?<br /> <br /> I'm on the fence about this due to history, but also thinking logically, IF you hold until ref stops the fight, the ref coming from a blind spot, 1.08 seconds is a reasonable amount of time to recognize the ref and releasing the hold IMO.<br /> <br /> However if you think he should have let go from taps, then it's a different conversation. <img alt="Phone Post 3.0" border="0" src="/images/phone/apple.png" style="vertical-align:middle;" /></blockquote> <br /> <p> count one mississippi, it's long enough in BJJ to do major damage when a sub is already pushing ripping or breaking something</p> </blockquote> I get that. And I understand I really do. But if we're talking holding until the ref jumped in. And then his reaction time of recognizing what happened. 1.08 is not THAT bad of a reaction time to fully let go <img alt="Phone Post 3.0" border="0" src="/images/phone/apple.png" style="vertical-align:middle;" /></blockquote>
Maybe so but Palhares being a repeat offender 1 second is inflated by the scrutiny, it just is.
I honestly think the only way to stop this is by having an official out side the cage watching on a monitor who had the authority to stop the fight with a horn when he sees a fighter tap.
ShowtimeWreckedMyLeever -ChaosOverkill -ShowtimeWreckedMyLeever -ChaosOverkill -ShowtimeWreckedMyLeever -And that's where I'm conflicted. We have clearly seen a pattern develop with him.DeanLister - OK i'll put in my 2 cents..
No it wasn't appropriate for Palhares to hold that long on the submission... It really wasn't, he did similar to my friend Thomasz Drwal from Poland as well, Thomasz ended up ok but yeah he was hurt... With that said I must say that Palhares is really nice guy, just he's a bit "different headwise" lets just say, I don't think he was trying to be a bad sport, of course he was trying to take opponents knee home with him, his intentions were to win the fight, I don't "think" he was trying to be a bad sport (or i may be wrong, someone said he had beef with opponent). He isn't a very complicated guy, I know him, he's really cool guy and I'm sorry to see him banned from UFC. He as a person doesn't deserve it but his actions have set this in stone looks like. UFC needs to/will use this as an example.. So Yes I think he held on grossly too long and that behavior cannot be tolerated especially after this already happening before. It would prove in UFC's mind a liability to UFC.Hey dead, if you read this I would love for you to expand on your thoughts that he held on too long.<br /> <br /> Should he have released the hold from one of the taps?<br /> <br /> Or hold until the ref stops you?<br /> <br /> I'm on the fence about this due to history, but also thinking logically, IF you hold until ref stops the fight, the ref coming from a blind spot, 1.08 seconds is a reasonable amount of time to recognize the ref and releasing the hold IMO.<br /> <br /> However if you think he should have let go from taps, then it's a different conversation. <img alt="Phone Post 3.0" border="0" src="/images/phone/apple.png" style="vertical-align:middle;" /></blockquote> <br /> <p> count one mississippi, it's long enough in BJJ to do major damage when a sub is already pushing ripping or breaking something</p> </blockquote> I get that. And I understand I really do. But if we're talking holding until the ref jumped in. And then his reaction time of recognizing what happened. 1.08 is not THAT bad of a reaction time to fully let go <img alt="Phone Post 3.0" border="0" src="/images/phone/apple.png" style="vertical-align:middle;" /></blockquote>
Maybe so but Palhares being a repeat offender 1 second is inflated by the scrutiny, it just is.
I honestly think the only way to stop this is by having an official out side the cage watching on a monitor who had the authority to stop the fight with a horn when he sees a fighter tap.probably not a bad idea. Even in WWE (I know silly and fixed) they clang that bell in that situation (Even though it's for show), and they do it in boxing when the ref waves the fight off
It would solve the fake tapping issue. That's for damn sure
ShowtimeWreckedMyLeever - It would solve the fake tapping issue. That's for damn sure
yeah the wave above the head in the other two should signal "LOUD NOISE GO NOW"
ShawnTheBadger -
Voted UP OP, the quote, and Mr. Lister. Thanks gentlemen.
What I appreciate the most about this forum is the genuine, no-bullshit, been-there, done-that expertise. Where the fuck else can I discuss MMA with actual professionals?
All of this. This is why I love this place. Thanks OP for making thread and Dean responding. VTFU everyone!
Dean:
In MMA fights they are instructed to not let go at the tap, rather wait for the ref to call the fight. Knowing that and watching both the Drwal and Pierce endings in real time, do you really feel he held it "way too long"?
Being a leg lock man yourself, do you think his intention is to try and cause serious damage? My thoughts would be that if he really wanted to cause serious damage, he would. Yet every UFC opponent has been fine and fought again like normal (4-6 months).
Thanks for your thoughts and taking the time to talk to us here on the UG!
UGCTT_Fillthy -Yeah that's the bit that annoyed me. It wasn't that he held on till the ref jumped in, but that extra crank looked dirty.
am i the only one who saw the crank after the ref intervened? It's not that he 'held it' - he gave it one last crank after he saw the ref, and then let go.
UGCTT_Fillthy -
am i the only one who saw the crank after the ref intervened? It's not that he 'held it' - he gave it one last crank after he saw the ref, and then let go.
Agreed. It's the most damning thing about it. I understand all the arguments about holding 1-2 seconds based on reaction time, adrenalin, noise, etc...but the last crank, after it's obvious the ref is in there...that's what makes it punishable imo.
DeanLister - OK i'll put in my 2 cents..
No it wasn't appropriate for Palhares to hold that long on the submission... It really wasn't, he did similar to my friend Thomasz Drwal from Poland as well, Thomasz ended up ok but yeah he was hurt... With that said I must say that Palhares is really nice guy, just he's a bit "different headwise" lets just say, I don't think he was trying to be a bad sport, of course he was trying to take opponents knee home with him, his intentions were to win the fight, I don't "think" he was trying to be a bad sport (or i may be wrong, someone said he had beef with opponent). He isn't a very complicated guy, I know him, he's really cool guy and I'm sorry to see him banned from UFC. He as a person doesn't deserve it but his actions have set this in stone looks like. UFC needs to/will use this as an example.. So Yes I think he held on grossly too long and that behavior cannot be tolerated especially after this already happening before. It would prove in UFC's mind a liability to UFC.
Thanks, Dean. I appreciate you taking time out to answer this question. Did a leg lock seminar with you some years ago and still think about the "wet sock". I think your recent ADCC results speak for themselves. Congrats.