attn MS: eating blood...

MS, the Jewish disciples of Jesus wrote the following to Gentiles who converted to their particular brand of Messianic Judaism:

Act 21:25 As touching the Gentiles which believe, we have written [and] concluded that they observe no such thing, save only that they keep themselves from [things] offered to idols, and from blood, and from strangled, and from fornication.

Can you give me more insight into "keeping oneself from blood"? Can I order a steak MR, or is the injunction against blood saugage or cherriso (Mexican Sausage) or what? I'd be interested in hearing your perspective on this from Judaism. Thanks!

When an animal is slaughtered in the kosher fashion (and likely the halal fashion as well), all the blood is drained. This is done for two reasons. 1- Blood is the carrier of the animal portion of the spirit, you do not have the right to eat a spirit, it belongs wholly to G-d. 2- Blood is the most common source of infection, removing it decreases the chances of contamination greatly.

I am not strictly kosher (because my parents aren't). I do believe that meat should have its blood drained.

MS

So can I eat a steak MR?

1- Since you are not Jewish, the law does not apply to you. The only law concerning food for you is making sure the animal was dead before you cut out flesh for the purpose of food.

2- The steak can be eaten raw as long as no blood is in it.

What if I was Jewish? Can food ever be raw and w/out blood? I grill a steak and it's got some blood in it? Not trying to pester you, I'm just trying to understand how approximately this is defined.

Chorizo does not contain Blood. Pendejo ;)

When an animal is slaughtered in the kosher fashion (and likely the halal fashion as well), all the blood is drained.Yeah, that's how we do it too.its clear to me that no blood means nothing that has blood, however i'm sure its interpreation is adjusted appropriatly to allow meat eating.Both the Bible and the Quran clearly state that you can eat meat - with certain exceptions.

lueng, not only did I spell chorizo wrong, but I thought it had blood in it...and I'm Mexican. Sheesh!

"When an animal is slaughtered in the kosher fashion (and likely the halal fashion as well), all the blood is drained. This is done for two reasons. 1- Blood is the carrier of the animal portion of the spirit, you do not have the right to eat a spirit, it belongs wholly to G-d. "

 

Interesting MS, so in Judaism you aknowledge that animals have "souls" or "spirits"?

Fudo: Yes, human beings have 5 levels to their soul. The lowest two are found in animals; however, this does not mean that animals go to Heaven since they rely enitrely on instinct and are incapable of making moral choices.

Rooster: If you were Jewish and religous, your meat and milk products would only come a kosher store. No ands ifs or buts. The meat must contain NO blood. First it is drained, then dried, then salted. Modern scientific investigation has shown this can get rid of 98.7% of the blood in a cow- for all purposes, it is bloodless. Note that this is in effect for mammals like cows and sheep, for birds like chickens and turkeys but not for fish! We can eat fish blood! YEAH!

MS

Interesting, thanks for your answer MS. What are those 5 levels of the human soul?

The first and least inclusive is Nefesh; this is the level of soul that operates according to the dictates of nature, the dimension we call Assiyah. Nefesh tells your heart to beat and your lungs to breath. The second level is Ruach, instinct and primal emotion.
Ruach tells you to duck when a stone flies by your
head. It is Ruach that takes your breath away in a state of wonder. This is the dimension of life known as Yetzirah. Ruach and Nefesh are preconscious in that they operate without a sense of self. Full self-consciousness arises with the third level of soul, Neshamah. It is Neshamah that says I, me, and mine. It is Neshamah that insists it is separate and self-contained. Neshamah reveals the dimension of life called Beriah, the world of the ego. The fourth level of soul is Chayya, life consciousness, the level of consciousness that is aware of the interconnectedness of all things. This is the dimension of life called Atzilut. Atzilut reveals the realm of Ayn, while Beriah reveals the realm of Yesh. Chayya consciousness
still maintains a slight sense of self, but it does not see itself as separate from other selves. Chayya
sees itself as a knot in an infinitely knotted net, unique and yet at one with all other knots. Chayya knows itself as part of God but does not yet see itself as God. The fifth level of soul is Yechida, unity consciousness. Here there is no Yesh or Ayn, just a pure contentless knowing without knower or known. Yechida is completely at one with God. When the great kabbalist Abraham Abulafia [1240–1291] proclaimed at the height of mystic revelry, Ani hu! (I am He), he was speaking from the perspective of Yechida where everything is known as a manifestation of the one thing, God. This is the dimension of Adam Kadmon, primal reality, in which the totality of God's shlemut, nonduality, is manifest. All five levels of consciousness and all five dimensions of reality are present in each of us at all times. We tend to focus on one dimension or another depending on which level of consciousness is called into play. For example: We become aware of Assiyah and Nefesh when something is wrong with us physically. A broken leg demands we focus on Assiyah and pulls us away from other modes
of knowing to concentrate and deal with our pain.
We become aware of Yetzirah and Ruach when we are confronted with unexpected danger or an overwhelming
emotion. We become aware of Beriah and Neshamah every time we say I, me, mine. This is the world that occupies most of our attention. It is the world in which we feel most at home. It is also the world from which most of our suffering comes. We become aware of Atzilut and Chayya when we sleep, when we are deep in prayer or selfless meditation, or when we are gifted with a sudden insight or intuition that comes from beyond our Neshamah. Both sleep andThe first and least inclusive is Nefesh; this is the level of soul that operates according to the dictates of nature, the dimension we call Assiyah. Nefesh tells your heart to
beat and your lungs to breath. The second level is Ruach, instinct and primal emotion. Ruach tells you to duck when a stone flies by your head. It is Ruach that takes your breath away in a state of wonder. This is the dimension of life known as Yetzirah. Ruach and Nefesh are preconscious in that they operate without a sense of self. Full self-consciousness arises with the third level of soul, Neshamah. It is Neshamah that says I, me, and mine. It is Neshamah that insists it is
separate and self-contained. Neshamah reveals the dimension of life called Beriah, the world of the ego.
The fourth level of soul is Chayya, life consciousness,
the level of consciousness that is aware of the
interconnectedness of all things.

This is the dimension
of life called Atzilut. Atzilut reveals the realm of Ayn, while Beriah reveals the realm of Yesh. Chayya consciousness still maintains a slight sense of self, but it does not see itself as separate from other selves. Chayya sees itself as a knot in an infinitely knotted net, unique and yet at one with all other knots. Chayya knows itself as part of God but does not yet see itself as God. The fifth level of soul is Yechida, unity consciousness. Here there is no Yesh or Ayn, just a pure contentless knowing without knower or known. Yechida is completely at one with God. When the great kabbalist Abraham Abulafia [1240–1291] proclaimed at the height of mystic revelry, Ani hu! (I am He), he was speaking from the perspective of Yechida where everything is known as a manifestation of the one thing, God. This is the dimension of Adam Kadmon, primal reality, in which the totality of God's shlemut, nonduality, is manifest. All five levels of consciousness and all five dimensions of reality are present in each of us at all times.

ms: Rooster: If you were Jewish and religous, your meat and milk products would only come a kosher store. No ands ifs or buts. The meat must contain NO blood. First it is drained, then dried, then salted. Modern scientific investigation has shown this can get rid of 98.7% of the blood in a cow- for all purposes, it is bloodless. Note that this is in effect for mammals like cows and sheep, for birds like chickens and turkeys but not for fish! We can eat fish blood! YEAH!

me: that's really interesting. Would we then be violating the Jewish Christians admonition concerning blood?

Very interesting thanks.

this Yechida-level seems very similar to the concept of Oneness that Scrap often talks about.

Scrap and I have had a few conversations about stuff like that. It seems his philo and my philo are very similar even though he applies Buddism and I apply Jewish Renewalism.

Fish blood doesn't count for much.

Cool info guys. Hey I've got a question about blood and the biblical references to it... Does this "keeping from... blood" also mean blood transfusions? A Jehovas Witness, buddy of mine, seems pretty sure that it does in fact refer to blood of any type. Apparently, if he or anyone in his family needed blood, their medical records would allow some saline (sp?) solution only, but no blood. I thought it was only referring to eating animal blood, but I'd like to hear some other interpretations. Thanks in advance guys!



Puzzled

Does this "keeping from... blood" also mean blood transfusions? A Jehovas Witness, buddy of mine, seems pretty sure that it does in fact refer to blood of any type. Apparently, if he or anyone in his family needed blood, their medical records would allow some saline (sp?) solution only, but no blood. I thought it was only referring to eating animal blood, but I'd like to hear some other interpretations.Only people with extreme views believe that blood transfusions are forbidden. Most Muslims, Jews and Christians think they're fine. It's only eating blood which is considered to be haram/[opposite of Kosher*] by Muslims and Jews.* MS - what's the Hebrew word for that?

The Bible in dozens of places says you can violate most laws for health purposes. You can violate most laws (kosher, sabbath, etc.) for health reasons. A few years ago, some Orthodox Jews raised a ruckus because someone had to have a pigs heart transplanted into them. They eventually went to a Rabbi of some standing who showed them the law- for health purposes it is allowed.

MS

So, based on what James (Jewish Christian) wrote about the blood, are we gentiles not fufilling properly the jewish understanding of eating blood?