What the fuck is Yves doing. That was stopped way too soon. Tony got up, covering his face, defending himself. Fight stopped. Worst ref in the business.
No question Darb. Interesting to me the history of Yves with this crew. Ask Tony's corner people about it if you get an opportunity. Unfortunate state of affairs.
Magnus - No question Darb. Interesting to me the history of Yves with this crew. Ask Tony's corner people about it if you get an opportunity. Unfortunate state of affairs.
Hey Magnus. I trained at Shah's for years and now train at Loaf's club.
Tony got hit solid for sure but he popped right back up with his guard up and was defending himself. Yves should have let it go on longer.
Look at the fight immediately following Tony's. Winner knocks his opponent down hard with a knee and follows up with 7 undefended punches. After seven undefended punches Yves stops the fight. Not consistent.
Yves fucked up.
Tony will be back. 
I love Carvalho in the UFC. Having said that, it wasn't going to get any better for him at that point. Up until that point he was looking fantastic.
Poor form blaming Yves imo.
I think it was a quick stoppage but I don't think it would have mattered. That being said, other than Big John, I think Yves has been the most consistent ref out there, very few fuck ups for the amount of fights he has done.
Unless the criterion has changed i.e. not intelligently defending oneself - then this was a fast stoppage. A fast stoppage is a mistake. People make mistakes and that is fine as long as we recognize it as such.
There is no way ANYONE including myself (or even Tony) knows what would have happened if the fight would have been left. It did not look good for Tony, no question. This in no way detracts from the fact that immediately standing in front of your opponent with your hands up IS intelligently defending oneself.
Yves has a tough job. But the test is tolerably objective. This is why I believe one often sees fights go one too long when someone is on the ground and being hit. They turn away - it is done. In this instance - again - Tony was up immediately - with his hands ready to go.
Edited - Tony is all class and I'm sure he wouldn't want to see people debating or second guessing what happened in the ring. He'll be back.
Dougie -
I love Carvalho in the UFC. Having said that, it wasn't going to get any better for him at that point. Up until that point he was looking fantastic.
Poor form blaming Yves imo.
How do you know how it would have gone after that Dougie? Have you ever seen a fighter take a shot, get rocked, and then recover and do well in a fight? I have. I don't have a crystal ball, and I am certainly not saying that Tony would have won after those shots. What I am saying is that he deserved the opportunity to continue fighting. He was quite clearly still in the fight at this point.
I am not blaming Yves for how well Tony did or did not do. I am not blaming him for the loss. I am blaming him for stopping the fight too early. If the criteria for stopping the fight in that case was whether or not Tony was intelligently defending himself, then the ref made a mistake. To err is human certainly, however Yves is a professional and should be held to a high standard in the performance of his job. Giving him a free pass to make mistakes that affect peoples careers is bad form, imo.
Darb -Dougie -I love Carvalho in the UFC. Having said that, it wasn't going to get any better for him at that point. Up until that point he was looking fantastic.
Poor form blaming Yves imo.
<br /> How do you know how it would have gone after that Dougie? Have you ever seen a fighter take a shot, get rocked, and then recover and do well in a fight? I have. I don't have a crystal ball, and I am certainly not saying that Tony would have won after those shots. What I am saying is that he deserved the opportunity to continue fighting. He was quite clearly still in the fight at this point.<br /> <br /> I am not blaming Yves for how well Tony did or did not do. I am not blaming him for the loss. I am blaming him for stopping the fight too early. If the criteria for stopping the fight in that case was whether or not Tony was intelligently defending himself, then the ref made a mistake. To err is human certainly, however Yves is a professional and should be held to a high standard in the performance of his job. Giving him a free pass to make mistakes that affect peoples careers is bad form, imo.</blockquote>
Well, apparently I know nothing. I've never watched any mma fights ever. This was my first one.
My opinion is different. Tony was wobbled once, then wobbled a second time where he went down. He's obviously in fantastic shape as he recovered so quickly, but it looked bad. It was a reason to stop it.
To claim Yves is the worst ref in the business on the basis of one fight though, you must have watched a lot of MMA!
That's all I have to say I guess. I can't wait until I can watch some more MMA!
Aside from that, I hope that Carvalho is paired up with some top notch competition in the UFC soon. That fight did not give him a chance to showcase his skills.
I remember another fight where Yves stood a fighter up from mount. n=2 isn't a huge sample size, but I'm sure there are other examples that could be found.
Dougie -Darb -Dougie -I love Carvalho in the UFC. Having said that, it wasn't going to get any better for him at that point. Up until that point he was looking fantastic.
Poor form blaming Yves imo.
<br /> How do you know how it would have gone after that Dougie? Have you ever seen a fighter take a shot, get rocked, and then recover and do well in a fight? I have. I don't have a crystal ball, and I am certainly not saying that Tony would have won after those shots. What I am saying is that he deserved the opportunity to continue fighting. He was quite clearly still in the fight at this point.<br /> <br /> I am not blaming Yves for how well Tony did or did not do. I am not blaming him for the loss. I am blaming him for stopping the fight too early. If the criteria for stopping the fight in that case was whether or not Tony was intelligently defending himself, then the ref made a mistake. To err is human certainly, however Yves is a professional and should be held to a high standard in the performance of his job. Giving him a free pass to make mistakes that affect peoples careers is bad form, imo.</blockquote>
Well, apparently I know nothing. I've never watched any mma fights ever. This was my first one.
My opinion is different. Tony was wobbled once, then wobbled a second time where he went down. He's obviously in fantastic shape as he recovered so quickly, but it looked bad. It was a reason to stop it.
To claim Yves is the worst ref in the business on the basis of one fight though, you must have watched a lot of MMA!
That's all I have to say I guess. I can't wait until I can watch some more MMA!
Aside from that, I hope that Carvalho is paired up with some top notch competition in the UFC soon. That fight did not give him a chance to showcase his skills.
Yep, I've watched lots of MMA. I am sure you have too and I don't mean to suggest that you don't know what you are talking about. You are taking my comments more personally than I had hoped but that is the problem with written communication; it leaves many of the nuances of body language and such open to the imagination. In any case it was not my intention to insult you but based on your reply you obviously took it that way.
Who knows how that match would have ended if it had gone on. You don't and I don't. Tony did get wobbled, and he did recover immediately. To me, and I suppose to many others, it seemed like he was intelligently defending himself and that always seems to be the gold standard as to when a fight is stopped. I guess we can agree to disagree on whether it was a good stoppage or not and I am willing to bet neither of us will lose any sleep over that.
I've never reffed MMA, though I am sure it is a thankless job, and I am sure that Yves thought he was doing the right thing. That said, no matter how many times I watch the replay, he ended the match at a point where Tony was defending himself.
I also hope he has another match soon.
PS - My opinion that Yves is the worst ref in the business was not formed based on one fight alone, but rather reinforced by that fight. If you like Yves and disagree that is fine. We are all entitled to our opinions.
Well, it's obvious you're a communist who hates freedom, maple syrup, back bacon, and probably you use the Canadian flag as tp but all that aside, I like you.
Pato...he got wobbled twice in a row. I think he could have fought through the first one, and wow, he must have been in great shape because he wobbled and dropped and got up again super quickly. I am under the impression that it was going into that direction again and that was why it stopped.
If you look at fights like Jay Herion vs GSP where GSP KO'ed Jay 2 times before the 3rd KO, that to me seems like a lot of punishment to take.
What really makes me bummed out here is Carvalho has so much potential to really lay some serious work in the 145lbs division and he got caught here. I am hoping that the UFC knows this and Joe Silva puts Carvalho back on the horse and in another fight soon. His prior two fights were great and I think people are sleeping on him.
In my betting pool I lost money on Pato because I was sure that he was going to take this fight. I think he just got caught. When he fights again, I will bet on him winning again. Thatis how sure of his talents I am.
Yves is consistantly one of the best refs in the business doing a job that he is either hated or loved for. His screw up ratio is ridiculously low for the amount of fights he has done and he ALWAYS has the fighter's health in mind. In this case, I think that was the reason he stopped it.
Despite this disagreement over the stoppage and Yves' skills as a ref I am sure that you and I would get along great. I could overlook the fact that you probably drink heavily and soil yourself while you beat orphans and shove little old ladies into on-coming traffic, but let's just agree to disagree on Yves and we'll go with the fact that I am right and you're wrong and possibly the kind of guy who sleeps in jammies with feet in them.
All my best,
Your new friend,
Dougie!
Things that are true in this thread:
1. Yves is a good ref.
2. Dougie has never watched MMA.
3. Antonio is the sexist fighter in the UFC.
4. Darb hates bacon.
5. While I may be ugly I'm still trustworthy.
it seemed premature to me. Nice ass ^
Sigh...
That whole scenario plays out in my head constantly. Lol. I really don''t know what would have happened after that. The first punch actually hit my under my jaw and on the left side of my neck (the only part that is sore on my body). So I knew what happened and knew I was losing control of my body. Hence why I was doing the funky chicken :) The only thing I was trying to tell myself was to keep your hands up.
Then Elkins pounced on me and hit me with a good combo and the right dropped me. The thing was, that one actually woke me back up and I stood up as quick as I could. However, Yves had seen enough and jumped in. I told him I was ok, but then knew that he had already made the decision and that is final.
Could I have continued? I ask myself that question all the time now. I honestly don't know...
The thing is, Yves will he criticized regardless, whether he stops the fight too quick or if he lets it go too far. As much as I would have loved to have had a incredible comeback, Ala Congo/Berry; the scenario could have also played out Ala Curran/Warren. (Not pretty!)
Ultimelely for me, I accept the loss. My guard dropped and he landed a good punch. I should have had a better guard and not allowed such a thing to happen in the first place. I am disappointed in myself; It was a technical error on my defense and my opponent was the better man landing his strike that started the sequence of events. Trust me, I wish I could turn back the clock. However, this is the game we play.
As far as Yves, we spoke after and he knew that he was going to be criticized regardless. Being a ref ain't easy. They are there for our safely. Every fight the ref that will be in the cage with us will always come over and discuss what he expects from us and what his job will be. It's exactly like I said in the video above; I gave Yves a reason to protect me. I gave him an excuse to stop the fight. I blame no one but myself and give credit to my opponent.
Antonio
Tony,
You can shower at my house anytime you want. Just make sure you're facing the webcam. Dougie complained the last time that you lathered up with you back to the camera.
Jonathan