Hope I don't catch too much crap for starting this thread...this is a legitimate question for some of the more experienced guys in Eddie Bravo's system:
After watching Kendall Grove submit his opponent with a D'arce choke at UFC 69 this past weekend, it got me thinking about defending that choke.
If you are on the bottom, have your opponent in half gaurd, lock down, double underhooks, whip up to your side in preperation to sweep... at that moment, it seems like a good opponent on top might take that opportunity to go for the D'arce choke.
With that said, how do you defend from the bottom? Do you bail on the double unders and defend your neck, do you let go of lock down, fall back and try to retain full gaurd?
If you have double underhooks like Eddie Bravo tells you to have in half gaurd, That choke will not work because your arm will be in the wrong position for it.
"...double underhooks, whip up to your side in preperation to sweep"
At this point you don't have double underhooks anymore (if I understand you correctly). It is at this point that you've whipped up and you are basing with one arm on the mat and your other arm is underhooked around your opponent's back. I think that's what you're referring to when you are most vulnerable. However, even in this position - if your arm/hand is around your opponent's back and hugging the other side (like eddie says), it would be pretty difficult to pull that choke off.
Of course, while I've used his system alot (and pulled it off in a fight b/4) I am FAR FROM AN EXPERT. Anyone else please chime in as I may be missing what Morgz is referring to.
Yeah, I was totally missing / forgetting the point of the arm being in for that choke to work.
Of all the Eddie Bravo stuff I have read, the half guard sweeps have been what's worked for me so far. I train under a Renzo BB, and we happened to be working the D'arce last night. Then when we rolled, I went to half guard and pretty quickly got "new moved" by an advanced blue belt. In hindsight, I think I had already released the double underhooks in a failed attempt to whip up to one side...got half way there, had an arm in (technically overhooked, I guess) and got choked.
Anyway, it just got me thinking since I am by no means skilled at the half guard stuff, and was immediately exposed last night.
you can hit the darce when your opponent has double unders.
the way you stop it is if i have my opponents right leg, then i am going to take my left hand and control my opponents right wrist from the inside. i then have two sweeps from there: the mechanic and the jiffy lube. they are not easy to explain on the internet
Yes, you are definitely vulnerable to the D'arce after the whip-up. But like CUO said, you can defend by grabing the wrist, or by releasing lockdown and turning to face your opponent. As the top man, your best decision at this point (when your opponent whips up)is to pummel for the underhook to settle your man down rather than going for the D'arce against a skilled opponent. Lets just say you won't catch CUO in too many D'arces (the bastard!).
I don't recall seeing the mechanic or the jiffy lube in either of the Bravo books...but I have not read them thouroughly yet, either.
For now if I end up in that position again with top guy going for D'arce, I at least know to immeditately go for/control the wrist.
I also think I can move my head straight back to avoid the choke. But that exposes my neck, and also makes feel like I am losing balance and am vulnerable to being flattened out on my back. Of course that is better than tapping froma choke, but still not an ideal position...lol.