He'd pop for coke and get suspended by USADA.
HotSteppa - I posted about Bruce being overrated as a FIGHTER, year's ago on here and got lambasted!
Here is the proof that he was never a complete fighter:
Judo Gene Lebell easily beat him - he just ducked behind him and choked him out. Bruce could do nothing and had to give up.
Was he an incredibly talented man? Yes? Did he push for change? Yes. But no evidence that he would have been anything but an average fighter.
Let's look at this way. During and before Bruce's time, there was already a 60 tradition of carnival/ring fighting using striking and grappling. All those guys would have destroyed him.
He could have easily flown to Thailand and fought some Muay Thaiers. But of course, he would have been destroyed.
What he was good for was to make traditional Chinese martial art practitioners realize that change is necessary to become better.
That's about it.
Did Gene say he choked Lee out?
Of course he easily could, just like he could any striker, but I missed that one.
I have read one where he says he picked him up using a firemans carry and walked around with him on his shoulders while Lee threw a tantrum at being stuck there lol
Gene would have killed most people in the mid 60s though. If the UFC existed he would have even champion.
Regarding other countries though, it was a different time and place and travelling around to fight against other arts wasn't Lee's goal - becoming famous was.
Ok ok ok......
So Bruce Lee was born in 1940, and started traing martial arts a young age. During the 60's he re-worked how we (the 20th century) look at martial arts. By 1973 he passed away at 32 years of age.
Almost 45 years later we see a men like Conor Mcgregor, GSP, Anderson Silva etc.., using the same style movements to be successful champions.
Would Bruce be successful in todays UFC....not so hypotheticaly speeking.... FUCK YES HE WOULD !
Would/ could he be successful taking on all weight classes like a mythological martial art ninja assassin..... HELL NO YOU DAFT PRICK !
This is to much like a debate I had when I was 5..... now give me back my marbles, I wanna go home ya poo face's!
FingerorMoon -HotSteppa - I posted about Bruce being overrated as a FIGHTER, year's ago on here and got lambasted!
Here is the proof that he was never a complete fighter:
Judo Gene Lebell easily beat him - he just ducked behind him and choked him out. Bruce could do nothing and had to give up.
Was he an incredibly talented man? Yes? Did he push for change? Yes. But no evidence that he would have been anything but an average fighter.
Let's look at this way. During and before Bruce's time, there was already a 60 tradition of carnival/ring fighting using striking and grappling. All those guys would have destroyed him.
He could have easily flown to Thailand and fought some Muay Thaiers. But of course, he would have been destroyed.
What he was good for was to make traditional Chinese martial art practitioners realize that change is necessary to become better.
That's about it.Did Gene say he choked Lee out?
Of course he easily could, just like he could any striker, but I missed that one.
I have read one where he says he picked him up using a firemans carry and walked around with him on his shoulders while Lee threw a tantrum at being stuck there lol
Gene would have killed most people in the mid 60s though. If the UFC existed he would have even champion.
Regarding other countries though, it was a different time and place and travelling around to fight against other arts wasn't Lee's goal - becoming famous was.
People like Draeger or Bluming, actual high level mixed martial artists, could have drank a fifth of vodka and then proceed to destroy tiny dancer and Gene back to back in under two minutes. Ruska or Dolman would have ripped the tiny dancer into a jigsaw puzzle. Fast Billy would have kicked his head off and pancaked him into bolivia. Lee is a myth that has morphed into a religion whose virtues are parroted by zealots and the uniformed. There's a reason why he never tried himself again after the busboy incident.
By all accounts the dude was an insanely gifted athlete, and he actively sought out cross training in different disciplines when almost no one else was doing this. He also was very cognizant of what looks good on screen versus what works in reality.
If he were born 30 or 40 years later and had trained in MMA, he'd have done quite well at it I think. How well, I have no idea, because his actual combat sports competition record is pretty sparse, and he never trained in BJJ or Muay Thai, so we don't know.
And obviously fighting a UFC fighter in an MMA fight with his 1972 skillset would leave him on the wrong side of an ass whooping.
"he actively sought out cross training in different disciplines when almost no one else was doing this."
This is what i mean by uninformed
PorkJackhammer - He is the lone standing pillar of the traditional martial arts myth of absolute combat dominance.
Fuck that's well said.... vu
You have to think about the time he did all this stuff and his contribution to martial arts.
Bruce was a better dancer than fighter he was the Cha cha cha champion.
He only studied Wing Chun with Ip Man for 6 months. Wing Chun guys go on and on about Bruce but he did more Praying mantis and other styles of Kung Fu before moving to Western boxing.
Bruce brought hybrid training to the masses. Without him martial arts would be very different today. Would he beat top guys now? No but if he was born in this time period he would be innovative and be doing stuff similar to Anderson i would suspect.
He was the Godfather of MMA we have a lot to thank and respect him for
every icon has fans that will make you hate them. Bruce was a great philosopher and one of the first big name martial artist to lose the ego and promote cross training multiple disciplines. a win/loss record doesnt define a mans principles and value to those seeking enlightenment.
Bruce Lee would beat 5 fighters at a time from any weight class apart from heavyweight then he'd only be able to beat 4 at a time.
FingerorMoon -HotSteppa - I posted about Bruce being overrated as a FIGHTER, year's ago on here and got lambasted!
Here is the proof that he was never a complete fighter:
Judo Gene Lebell easily beat him - he just ducked behind him and choked him out. Bruce could do nothing and had to give up.
Was he an incredibly talented man? Yes? Did he push for change? Yes. But no evidence that he would have been anything but an average fighter.
Let's look at this way. During and before Bruce's time, there was already a 60 tradition of carnival/ring fighting using striking and grappling. All those guys would have destroyed him.
He could have easily flown to Thailand and fought some Muay Thaiers. But of course, he would have been destroyed.
What he was good for was to make traditional Chinese martial art practitioners realize that change is necessary to become better.
That's about it.Did Gene say he choked Lee out?
Of course he easily could, just like he could any striker, but I missed that one.
I have read one where he says he picked him up using a firemans carry and walked around with him on his shoulders while Lee threw a tantrum at being stuck there lol
Gene would have killed most people in the mid 60s though. If the UFC existed he would have even champion.
Regarding other countries though, it was a different time and place and travelling around to fight against other arts wasn't Lee's goal - becoming famous was.
Yes. IIRC, when Bruce was square off with him, he did a duckunder or something, went behind, and put him in a chokehold. This, in part, made Bruce know the value of grappling.
ricker - Ok ok ok......
So Bruce Lee was born in 1940, and started traing martial arts a young age. During the 60's he re-worked how we (the 20th century) look at martial arts. By 1973 he passed away at 32 years of age.
Almost 45 years later we see a men like Conor Mcgregor, GSP, Anderson Silva etc.., using the same style movements to be successful champions.
Would Bruce be successful in todays UFC....not so hypotheticaly speeking.... FUCK YES HE WOULD !
Would/ could he be successful taking on all weight classes like a mythological martial art ninja assassin..... HELL NO YOU DAFT PRICK !
This is to much like a debate I had when I was 5..... now give me back my marbles, I wanna go home ya poo face's!
This is ABSOLUTE nonsense. Guys like Connor are using movements from boxing, kickboxing, Muay Thai, BJJ, wrestling. Almost ZERO of this is influence has anything to do with Bruce. The tradition came from combat sports, some which are hundreds and thousands of years old, and the Vale Tudo traditions that started in Brazil in the 1920s. Do you realize that Carlson Gracie was fighting in Vale Tudo when Bruce was like a kid, correct? None of this stuff has ANYTHING to do with Bruce.
Sure, some people find have found him "insprational". Who didn't like Bruce in the '70s? Kung Fu was the shit back then. But we liked him for his fast movie Kung Fu moves, not because he a great fighter who exposed the myths of tradition, etc.
Here's the thing: If Bruce was soooo innovative and so concerned with real fighting, he could have flown to any numbers of countries and fought full contact fighters ad tested his teachings, he could have travelled to tough boxing gyms in the Bronx and beaten all those guys. He literally could have gone to any city in the U.S. and done this. He had a HUGE ego, and seeing his ass kicked wouldn't have gone well with him.
It does do a diservice to the guys who actually train to fight in their particular styles, and is does an even bigger diservice to the many martial artists who tested their styles and techniques in Brazil in the Vale Tudo and carnival circuits, especially the Japanese Judoka who didn't talk a lot of theory about fighting, but actually fought. That is the real influence on MMA and real fighting. Not some movie actor.
Bruce Lee is the samurai sword of martial artists
Ghengiseanie -HotSteppa - I posted about Bruce being overrated as a FIGHTER, year's ago on here and got lambasted!
Here is the proof that he was never a complete fighter:
Judo Gene Lebell easily beat him - he just ducked behind him and choked him out. Bruce could do nothing and had to give up.
Was he an incredibly talented man? Yes? Did he push for change? Yes. But no evidence that he would have been anything but an average fighter.
Let's look at this way. During and before Bruce's time, there was already a 60 tradition of carnival/ring fighting using striking and grappling. All those guys would have destroyed him.
He could have easily flown to Thailand and fought some Muay Thaiers. But of course, he would have been destroyed.
What he was good for was to make traditional Chinese martial art practitioners realize that change is necessary to become better.
That's about it.Y a Bruce doesnt know grppling at al;l...
Yep, and judging by his moves in the John Wick movies, I'd venture to say Keanu Reeves is probably a judo/BJJ black belt and looks to have better small-arms skills than most ST6 guys.
There's no doubt Bruce Lee was a trailblazer for the martial arts. Being asian, he used his martial arts knowledge to get into movies, then used his pop culture popularity to mainstream the martial arts.
If I had to guess, I'd say he was a devout martial arts hobbyist and had enough legit skill to be a solid trainer-type in the Greg Jackson/Danaher-mode for his time period.
As for his fighting skills, Bruce, himself, fell into the trap of "I don't like competition, b/c it doesn't allow me to use all by most deadliest technigues, but let me do these really cool demos where no one is actually fighting back", lol And we still don't know if he could actually take a punch.
The fact is he built his hollywood reputation on being this invincible martial artist. If he didn't look like a superman, it would hurt his reputation and ability to make money.
^That's why there were no more busboy incidents and he would remove himself from the proximity of anyone who would call him out so as not to be seen being forced to back down or take a horrific beating..
HotSteppa -Ok ok ok..... you daft twit #?....ricker - Ok ok ok......
So Bruce Lee was born in 1940, and started traing martial arts a young age. During the 60's he re-worked how we (the 20th century) look at martial arts. By 1973 he passed away at 32 years of age.
Almost 45 years later we see a men like Conor Mcgregor, GSP, Anderson Silva etc.., using the same style movements to be successful champions.
Would Bruce be successful in todays UFC....not so hypotheticaly speeking.... FUCK YES HE WOULD !
Would/ could he be successful taking on all weight classes like a mythological martial art ninja assassin..... HELL NO YOU DAFT PRICK !
This is to much like a debate I had when I was 5..... now give me back my marbles, I wanna go home ya poo face's!This is ABSOLUTE nonsense. Guys like Connor are using movements from boxing, kickboxing, Muay Thai, BJJ, wrestling. Almost ZERO of this is influence has anything to do with Bruce. The tradition came from combat sports, some which are hundreds and thousands of years old, and the Vale Tudo traditions that started in Brazil in the 1920s. Do you realize that Carlson Gracie was fighting in Vale Tudo when Bruce was like a kid, correct? None of this stuff has ANYTHING to do with Bruce.
Sure, some people find have found him "insprational". Who didn't like Bruce in the '70s? Kung Fu was the shit back then. But we liked him for his fast movie Kung Fu moves, not because he a great fighter who exposed the myths of tradition, etc.
Here's the thing: If Bruce was soooo innovative and so concerned with real fighting, he could have flown to any numbers of countries and fought full contact fighters ad tested his teachings, he could have travelled to tough boxing gyms in the Bronx and beaten all those guys. He literally could have gone to any city in the U.S. and done this. He had a HUGE ego, and seeing his ass kicked wouldn't have gone well with him.
It does do a diservice to the guys who actually train to fight in their particular styles, and is does an even bigger diservice to the many martial artists who tested their styles and techniques in Brazil in the Vale Tudo and carnival circuits, especially the Japanese Judoka who didn't talk a lot of theory about fighting, but actually fought. That is the real influence on MMA and real fighting. Not some movie actor.
Your first parigraph is "almost" total mombojumbo my dear sir !.... You have some minor relitive facts that fail to note one simple truth between people like the Gracies and Bruce.
Bruce unlike the affirmentioned, had a world paying attention to him and his philosophys reguarding combat practices.
And anyone who read a book knows that Bruce did infact take from the best of all genres of martial arts, grappiling, strikinng,.. etc...
All fighters over the past 45 years were influanced by him in a major way .... shit man just ask them yourself.
Again this is a total playground debate...... shakes head !
Anyone know the USADAs stance on heroin here?
Stin - If Bruce got his ass kicked in ufc1, you'd better believe he's be much better prepared the next time he entered the octagon.
If you know anything about Bruce Lee, you know he had an incredible work ethic.
He'd have done well in anything he wanted.
He didn't even spar.
Bruce was a movie star who would never step up. He knew full well when he lost he'd have no value as a martial arts star.
He was all about looking like a fighter. He never trained as one. WIng Chun kung fu? LOL
Ghengiseanie -HotSteppa - I posted about Bruce being overrated as a FIGHTER, year's ago on here and got lambasted!
Here is the proof that he was never a complete fighter:
Judo Gene Lebell easily beat him - he just ducked behind him and choked him out. Bruce could do nothing and had to give up.
Was he an incredibly talented man? Yes? Did he push for change? Yes. But no evidence that he would have been anything but an average fighter.
Let's look at this way. During and before Bruce's time, there was already a 60 tradition of carnival/ring fighting using striking and grappling. All those guys would have destroyed him.
He could have easily flown to Thailand and fought some Muay Thaiers. But of course, he would have been destroyed.
What he was good for was to make traditional Chinese martial art practitioners realize that change is necessary to become better.
That's about it.Y a Bruce doesnt know grppling at al;l...
Yup, that's solid evidence he knew nothing about grappling.
Every "technique" in that video is embarrassingly wrong.
This video is what happens when you get a guy who saw a grappler do an armbar or kimorra once, and tries to replicate it for film.
Later in Life Gene showed him a few basic holds to help him mimick grappling. But Bruce never rolled once in his life from what we can gather.
Maybe a time or two. He took an intro to judo class at the University of Washington. Which he declared "bullshit"