Hey guys like gama or Brucel I wanted to ask about catch. I have done BJJ for little while now and have bought the LAOC from Tony and am amazed with the stuff on it. My question is how have you, and any other rep of catch done against bjj reps. I have had a hard time useing alot of the catch stuff on others that do bjj. Granted Im a bjj'er myself and have only seen the catch stuff on tape and have not had the time to really drill and learn the details.
Has there been, or when will there be a catch rep in grappleing comps or mma ?? I really believe this stuff is going to start to kick peoples asses pretty soon.
A Catch Wrestling camp would kick ass!!!
I think that Catch Wrestling works very well against BJJ stylists. I also find quite a bit of the BJJ game plan leads right into Catch setups and finishes. I studied BJJ for over 3 years while studying Catch from Tony's tapes on the side and what I learned from Tony was very effective against BJJ and became the meat and potatoes of my grappling.
alot of people really dont think catch works if you want proof go post something on the usa forum ,they think we are trolling or something,cant wait till a fighter wins using this stuff.
Of course the gi changes things.
But having said that, there are very fundamental differences between to two. The single biggest mistake that most people make is that they look at Tony's tapes and try to do just the hooks, all the while use a BJJ base. Catch is wrestling. And without the wrestling and the proper ride, you are never going to get it right. The way Catch moves and the way BJJ moves is very different.
Then there is the mental aspects and the philosophical approach to fighting. BJJ and Catch are almost polar opposites to each other.
The tapes are great, but you really have to embrace the entire game to get the most out of it.
Gama,
You are a lucky guy to get to train with Tony and crew so much! He's having a seminar here in NJ this weekend, and I can't wait. Catch is some of the best stuff I've ever seen or trained in.
How much would it cost to host a Cecchine Catch seminar?
"How much would it cost to host a Cecchine Catch seminar? "
Portuguese2002, send me an email to bill@icwa.tv and I'll send you a seminar information package if you are seriously interested.
I think tony would beat silva even with his health condition,the reason I think this is I watched pride and yoshida was fighting silva and had top position he could have got the doublewrist lock a couple dfferent timesand also he was inside silvas halfguard and could have got a toehold many,many,times weather it would have worked or not who knows but he had the chance to try a dozen times,anyway I had yoshida way ahead the first round,and didnt feel silva won the fight I thought it was a draw plus when the bell rang yoshida got the top position once again.
I've talked to Bruce a number of times about moving to DC to open up a Catch school so I can train and learn Catch from him.
He has so far been uncooperative. The jerk!
OK, seriously, I really truly would love to learn Catch, but I have never had the opportunity to train with anyone who knew anything about it. Pisser, eh?
I've heard it suggested before (and some make references to it above) that the best way for me, as a wrestler, to learn submissions is to learn Catch since it is essentially wrestling with some extra ingredients, rather than learn something like BJJ that has a different mentality and style of movement from wrestling.
I would like to test that theory!
Tony and Bruce! Seminar! DC! Pronto!
*tapping foot and waiting impatiently*
Chip,
Get the "Lost Art of Hooking" series on DVD or VHS. Seriously. It is a goldmine and the best investment you can make in learning Catch.
Neckcranku
you've got mail!!!
rampage, I'd love to get it, but with money being tight in a crappy economy and a baby on the way, $200+ is just more than I can spend.
:(
isn't there only like 5 catch guys in the USA, one of them being Fury?
Chip you can keep your mentality and use you wrestling in BJJ. I used to wrestle and I love BJJ, in fact I think it's the best grappling combo, way better than judo/bjj or wrestling/catchwrestling, or whatever. Look at Matt Hughs, wrestling & BJJ, same with Sherk and most other wrestlers that kick ass have done BJJ.
macdawg - I see what you're saying. But please don't misunderstand me - I'm not saying that a mix of wrestling and bjj is "bad" - just that I've heard that catch wrestling is good too. Different, but still very good. My understanding of catch (someone please correct me if I'm wrong) is that it is basically American Folkstyle, but you can win by a pin OR by a submission.
My thinking is just that learning the "catch" part of folkstyle wrestling will not be much of a stretch for me, and I could probably pick those components up more quickly than I have with bjj.
"Chip you can keep your mentality and use you wrestling in BJJ."
I'm not so sure about this one though. I'm not experienced enough in bjj yet, but wrestling and bjj are philosophically quite different.
"you can keep your mentality and use you wrestling in BJJ."
There is a big difference between the wrestling mentality and the BJJ mentality. The most obvious is that wrestlers don't want to go to their backs (and rightfully so). That being said, Catch does have some submissions from the back, but the best option is to simply escape or reverse.
I did BJJ and am studying Catch and I don't feel that BJJ can be applied to aggressive wrestling. Besides, the submission holds in Catch are a lot more effective, painful, and damaging than what BJJ has.
"isn't there only like 5 catch guys in the USA, one of them being Fury?"
Furey is not a legit Catch guy. He only studied with Tony C. for a very short while, same with Gotch.
rampage68 is correct!
Thanks, Bill.
See you on Sunday?
Unfortunately I had a knee operation on Wednesday and won't be attending this one. I'll be at the next for sure though!