Did Marvel just go full retard?

From http://www.cbr.com/marvels-secret-empire-fcbd-final-page-leaks/

paw comments: Emphasis Mine.

Though it’s not scheduled to be released until Saturday, May 6, copies of Marvel Comics’ big 2017 Free Comic Book Day offering has already found its way into the hands of fans. And, as expected, the issue’s big “Secret Empire” twist then quickly ended up online.

The final page, initially reported on by Bleeding Cool, represents a major turn in the story of a Captain America whose reality has been altered in such a way that he’s been a Hydra agent from day one. His agenda was fully revealed in last week’s “Secret Empire” #0, and will be furthered in issue #1, which arrives in stores several days before the leaked FCBD chapter.

The closing image of the issue, illustrated by Andrea Sorrentino, reveals that Hydra-loyal Steve Rogers, in his Captain America uniform, is worthy enough to lift Thor’s hammer Mjolnir high above his head.

Of course, without context, it’s difficult to draw conclusions regarding the splash page reveal. Not only are there multiple realities in play in the Marvel Universe, “Secret Empire” alone features two; one in which everything happened the way we, the readers, remember, and another in which Cap’s life has been one of subterfuge and lies.

And while fans will have to wait a little bit longer to read the story for themselves, “Secret Empire” architect Nick Spencer seems pleased with the early reactions… even if they are arriving a little ahead of schedule.

“Secret Empire” kicked off earlier this month with Issue #0. Issue #1 arrives in stores May 3, three days ahead of Free Comic Book Day (May 6). The nine-issue event will conclude in August.

 

 

Just when you think they cannot screw up any worse marvel editorial is like, 'Hold my beer a second...'.

WOW

BigWilliam - Just when you think they cannot screw up any worse marvel editorial is like, 'Hold my beer a second...'.

WOW


Yeah...I don't see how this can end well and Captain America can be redeemed.  How on earth was this storyline ever approved is beyond me.



 

paw - 
BigWilliam - Just when you think they cannot screw up any worse marvel editorial is like, 'Hold my beer a second...'.

WOW


Yeah...I don't see how this can end well and Captain America can be redeemed.  How on earth was this storyline ever approved is beyond me.



 


Same with Captain Marvel at this point for me. Though admittedly they have dragged Captain America WAY deeper into the shit than Carol.

BigWilliam - 
paw - 
BigWilliam - Just when you think they cannot screw up any worse marvel editorial is like, 'Hold my beer a second...'.

WOW


Yeah...I don't see how this can end well and Captain America can be redeemed.  How on earth was this storyline ever approved is beyond me.



 


Same with Captain Marvel at this point for me. Though admittedly they have dragged Captain America WAY deeper into the shit than Carol.


Agreed.

Inasmuch as he has been ret conned by an external force, I'm unsure why people think he can't be redeemed, either via following the path of villain to anti villain to hero or by some discovery and ret conning him back or some other CA avatar challenge going it all. Another retcon will be a load of crap, but in the vein of many loads of crap that have been foisted on comic book readers via multi dimension shenanigans.

Wildcard - Inasmuch as he has been ret conned by an external force, I'm unsure why people think he can't be redeemed, either via following the path of villain to anti villain to hero or by some discovery and ret conning him back or some other CA avatar challenge going it all. Another retcon will be a load of crap, but in the vein of many loads of crap that have been foisted on comic book readers via multi dimension shenanigans.


It's not a retcon.  As per Marvel, this Captain American was always Hydra.  This is not a case where Steve Rodgers was corrupted by an external force like mind control or somesuch. 



Steve was always, and has always been Hydra.

What doesn't make sense (besides the entire story not making sense) is what has Captain America actually accomplished for hydra?

Over the years he fought and beat hydra, fought and beat hydra allies, Many Hydra lives lost, not to mention the cost in property damage. So what did Captain America actually do that would be considered a benefit to hydra? 

 

kung_pow - 

What doesn't make sense (besides the entire story not making sense) is what has Captain America actually accomplished for hydra?

Over the years he fought and beat hydra, fought and beat hydra allies, Many Hydra lives lost, not to mention the cost in property damage. So what did Captain America actually do that would be considered a benefit to hydra? 

 



It doesn't make sense, and no one can explain it.



I believe the in-story explanation is that Cap fought the Nazis who aren't Hydra and are a perversion of Hydra.  But anyone with two brain cells to rub together know the in-story explanation doesn't make any sense at all. 



 

paw - 
Wildcard - Inasmuch as he has been ret conned by an external force, I'm unsure why people think he can't be redeemed, either via following the path of villain to anti villain to hero or by some discovery and ret conning him back or some other CA avatar challenge going it all. Another retcon will be a load of crap, but in the vein of many loads of crap that have been foisted on comic book readers via multi dimension shenanigans.


It's not a retcon.  As per Marvel, this Captain American was always Hydra.  This is not a case where Steve Rodgers was corrupted by an external force like mind control or somesuch. 



Steve was always, and has always been Hydra.


Whatever you call it, he was in the marvel world re-written by Kobik. That is the retcon. Captain America as we knew him isn't this same character, it is a new reality of him.

Wildcard - 
paw - 
Wildcard - Inasmuch as he has been ret conned by an external force, I'm unsure why people think he can't be redeemed, either via following the path of villain to anti villain to hero or by some discovery and ret conning him back or some other CA avatar challenge going it all. Another retcon will be a load of crap, but in the vein of many loads of crap that have been foisted on comic book readers via multi dimension shenanigans.


It's not a retcon.  As per Marvel, this Captain American was always Hydra.  This is not a case where Steve Rodgers was corrupted by an external force like mind control or somesuch. 



Steve was always, and has always been Hydra.


Whatever you call it, he was in the marvel world re-written by Kobik. That is the retcon. Captain America as we knew him isn't this same character, it is a new reality of him.


Nope.  First off, read:  http://screenrant.com/captain-america-steve-rogers-hydra-explained/



Secondly, that's not what retcon means.  Retcon is retroactive continuity.  Nothing in Steve's past was changed for this.  In essence, Steve as we knew him and loved him, died.  This current version of Steve is, essentially a brand new character, with a completely different background and past.  It's more like the classic "someone from a different dimension replaced me" trope.



It may seem like a nitpick, but from where I'm sitting, it's a very important distinction.  Steve Rodgers, the current one running around in Secret Empire, cannot be redeemed by "it was mind control" or somesuch - because this isn't mind control.  Even if this Steve Rodgers can be redeemed (and frankly, I don't believe he can), he is still completely responsible for all the death and destruction he has caused (and will cause in the future). 



 

Ok. I disagree with you. Retcon can be employed in numerous context. Your definition is a valid use, but not the only one. Nothing else really to be said.

Inasmuch as he has literally had his existence rewritten, he has been retconned. In this case he has been retconned by an actor within the fictional world, as opposed to the retcon happening only outside it. Double the meta.

It doesn't really change the substance. Yes, this reality of Rodgers is evil and can't fully be redeemed. I think the classic 'It's all been a dream' return to original Rodgers would suck equally. They are in a quandary due to short term money making attempt. That said, obviously at some point they'll set some author to bring a non-Hydra Rodgers back through whatever storyline they choose. It may suck, it may not. They'll alas do it for economic reasons. I presume part of this storyline is looking forward to the movie franchise and giving them something 'edgy', since that's primarily what the comics represent to Disney/Marvel now and where their big money is.

Scrap the story,don't even bother to conclude it. Have the next issues first page have an apology from editorial and that it never happened.

warmonky - Scrap the story,don't even bother to conclude it. Have the next issues first page have an apology from editorial and that it never happened.

YES! A thousand times this!

JohnMc1 - 
warmonky - Scrap the story,don't even bother to conclude it. Have the next issues first page have an apology from editorial and that it never happened.

Is the current administration at Marvel capable of admitting they're wrong. Its seems like everytime they're proven wrong they dig their heels in deeper.

The intelligent thing to do would have been 1) scrap their politicizing from their books [No people are not going to pay for you to demonise them] fire any writers and artists who can't or won't drop it. 2) Scrap Secret Empire entirely and come up with a story to change Cap back to normal.


I think Marvel is capable and has admitted they are wrong.  (see "Generations" for one example).



As for scrapping Secret Empire, I think that ship has sailed.  I was reading one article this morning were Breevort claimed Secret Empire was plotted out as early as 2014.  Even if that's not entirely true, the point is Marvel has a significant lead time on major events like this and may not be able to change future plans that are based on the ending of Secret Empire.



As for myself, I am not going to give Marvel a cent for anything Secret Empire related.  Nor would I buy any of the Captain America titles or anything by Spencer.  I want to make it very clear to Marvel that I will not support this event in any way, shape or form.

paw - 
JohnMc1 - 
warmonky - Scrap the story,don't even bother to conclude it. Have the next issues first page have an apology from editorial and that it never happened.

Is the current administration at Marvel capable of admitting they're wrong. Its seems like everytime they're proven wrong they dig their heels in deeper.

The intelligent thing to do would have been 1) scrap their politicizing from their books [No people are not going to pay for you to demonise them] fire any writers and artists who can't or won't drop it. 2) Scrap Secret Empire entirely and come up with a story to change Cap back to normal.


I think Marvel is capable and has admitted they are wrong.  (see "Generations" for one example).



As for scrapping Secret Empire, I think that ship has sailed.  I was reading one article this morning were Breevort claimed Secret Empire was plotted out as early as 2014.  Even if that's not entirely true, the point is Marvel has a significant lead time on major events like this and may not be able to change future plans that are based on the ending of Secret Empire.



As for myself, I am not going to give Marvel a cent for anything Secret Empire related.  Nor would I buy any of the Captain America titles or anything by Spencer.  I want to make it very clear to Marvel that I will not support this event in any way, shape or form.


While I would LOVE to see secret empire scratched I agree that is nearly impossible. By the time the first issue is in print way too many resources are committed to the project. But yes, the boycott is real. No Cap, no secret empire. If it infects a book I am buying I will not buy it.

In another year we'll have the next major multiverse shakeup and things will go back to the way they originally were. 

 

Wolverine will look like he's in his 30's. Captain America will be a good guy. Thor will have a dick. Hulk will be Bruce Banner. Peter Parker will be a teenager again. Professor X will lead the X-men. 

Or, you know, they'll say fuck it and double down on gender/race bending every single character and shitting all over anyone that's been popular for the past 10 decades. 

https://www.yahoo.com/gma/marvel-captain-americas-turn-hydra-hear-concerns-130507983--abc-news-celebrities.html

Good news, marvel says they 'hear our concerns' and ask us to be patient.

Dear marvel,

Allow me to retort. Go fuck yourselves.

Signed,
The Fans

BigWilliam - https://www.yahoo.com/gma/marvel-captain-americas-turn-hydra-hear-concerns-130507983--abc-news-celebrities.html

Good news, marvel says they 'hear our concerns' and ask us to be patient.

Dear marvel,

Allow me to retort. Go fuck yourselves.

Signed,
The Fans


Nice post.



FOR THE LOVE OF ALL THAT IS GOOD, DO NOT financially support Secret Empire!