I have done a bit of strength training but it's always been on and off. I am also a bit naturally gifted to lift stuff (for my size) (5'7 around 150-160 lbs).
Right now I went onto a program which includes one heavy full body lifting day a week. I've done this 3 weeks now. It is the first times I systematically DL after 2 years when my 1 rep max was 330 lbs but I also pulled my back a little doing it.
DL 5x5
1 arm KB press 5x5
Pullups 5x5 (been doing L-pullups lately)
Some abwork (45 deg bench with weights)
I always try to pay very strict attention to DL form. To lift with the legs, push the heels to the ground, keep the back locked and not rounded etc etc.
However after working out on wednesday - my back muscles are still sore (getting better every day though). I think I maxed out on 3rd and 4th set with 242 lbs x5. Hard but technical reps IMO. The muscles are not killing me they are just sore - the surface and deeper ones around my spine in lower and midback.
The question:
Is there a problem with my lifting form OR is just my back/core relatively weaker than my legs?
I can squat around 265 for 5 reps - haven't tried 1 RM and will not as I fear for my knees:)
Thanks.
I do not have a camera right now:( so can't film myself lifting.
I'm trying to go through Crossfit and other video materials about DL so maybe I can find smth.
What would be considered "good" numbers to lift for 5 reps for someone who hasn't DL'd 2 years, and weighs 155? 310? I do feel my legs would be able to lift loads more but then my back would get rounded and I fear injury... I used to have back problems (I pulled it 2-3 times a year in MMA class or opening a window, lifting a cupboard etc) a few years ago but now they are in the past due to coretraining and being concious about my back:)
Like Leigh said, 'who knows without seeing your form?'But if your low back is that sore for that long, I'd guess that the problem is with your form. Alot of guys come out of the hole great, but break form when lowering the bar. You may be rounding your back or swinging the bar away from your shins without even realizing it. Keep your head and chest up throughout the entire lift. And when you lower the bar, push your ass back first (like in back squats). When the bar reaches your knees, then bend your knees to finish the lift. Also, it may be a flexibility issue. Stretch your hams and hips before and after your workout.
EDIT -> If you're looking for an EXCELLENT resource on DLs (and other Oly lifts), pick up Starting Strength by Mark Rippetoe.
Get a trap bar. Trap bar deadlifts are much easier on the back.
I think I'm getting the problem. When I put the bar down I probably bend my knees first. Also I am rather not-flexible.
Thanks again guys:)
Try to do what you can to get a video posted, do you have a cell phone that takes video? Or a friend who does? The constructive criticsm that people can provide after seeing you lift can really go a long way to helping correct any mistakes.
By looking at some videos I am 99% sure I have found the problem:
By focusing on keeping my back straight and locked I have kept it too upright resulting in me initiating the pulling motion with my back and not using my legs as much as I should. The same goes for when I put the bar down.
This is without a doubt my favorite lift.
By not rounding the back, you may be inadvertently hyperextending it.
Check your form to see if your back is pretty much a straight line or if it's curved inward.
Lowering the bar with control is also a back killer if you're working near your max. If you can, just shoot your but back and drop the thing while still holding on to it.
Your legs and your back should also straighten at the same time as well. So if your knee is straight and your back is still bent, then you're going to have back problems.
Yes, Liyon is right on money:)
But now comes another question - I will correct my pulling motion. However - putting the bar back down controlled - me wanting to have a stronger back anyway - is this a BAD thing?
I have to put the bar down with control because my gym kinda sucks & people get thier shit in an uproar when you drop the weights. I've never had any problems lowering the bar in a controlled fashion.
Are you doing this workout (Deadlift 5x5) once a week? If so are you squatting the same workout?
Additionally if you are plateauing out play around with a DL 5x3 for a break in intensity (volume) or a 5x1.
Linear progression on a DL 5x5 is very very damn hard systemically.
Uncanny Sage:
Yes, once a week. I wouldn't imagine doing any major leg exercise 5x5 more than once a week:)
No, no squatting at all for now.
Do you have recurring knee problems that have been diagnosed by a physician? Why the aversion to squatting Jorx?
1armesScissor - there's no aversion to squatting. I have just found that when I strength train once a week full body then it works the best if I use ONE heavy lower body exercise at a time. Either squat, DL or power clean.
Right now it's DL time. If I amange to squeeze in another workout with enough rest inbetween I use front squat in the 2nd workout.
After 6-8 weeks I'll probably take the power clean and then back to squat again.
There's aversion to testing my 1RM with squat though. Am just a bit scared and usually do not have enough plates or spotters. I used to have a slight tear in my right knee which started to hurt when running or squatting (I was able to box squat though) but it seems okay now as I am running again and all is good.
Leigh - I am using metal plates on judo mats:P I can organize extra hard rubber sheets under it as well. Will try.
Jorx - 1armesScissor - there's no aversion to squatting. I have just found that when I strength train once a week full body then it works the best if I use ONE heavy lower body exercise at a time. Either squat, DL or power clean.
Right now it's DL time. If I amange to squeeze in another workout with enough rest inbetween I use front squat in the 2nd workout.
After 6-8 weeks I'll probably take the power clean and then back to squat again.
There's aversion to testing my 1RM with squat though. Am just a bit scared and usually do not have enough plates or spotters. I used to have a slight tear in my right knee which started to hurt when running or squatting (I was able to box squat though) but it seems okay now as I am running again and all is good.
Leigh - I am using metal plates on judo mats:P I can organize extra hard rubber sheets under it as well. Will try.
Do you squat in a cage or rack with pins? I do and never squat with spotters, the rack is my spotter. If I'm not going to get the lift then I just bring it down in a controlled motion until the bar hits the pins. Also are you finding that only 1 day per week of strength training is working for you? Are you happy with your current strength and are just in maintenance mode or are you trying to get stronger?
I am in maintenance mode as I am planning to compete in 144 lbs weightclass in beginning of october and am nearing 160 right now. I feel that I have enough fighting-strength. Cardio is much more of an issue as is flexibility.
This is an amateur MMA event held over 2 days and you have to weigh in BOTH mornings. The plan is to cut the last 8 lbs with water.
No squatrack in my gym where i
I train systematically:(
Leigh - i was inspired to have a go at weights on the weekend. haven't lifted since march. did some dumbells and then benched a few reps at 220, followed by 4 reps at 375 on deadlift. a couple of days later and i ache like a motherfucker. i'm not an overly muscled guy but my pecs and lumbar seem to painfully bounce every time i take a step
Been awhile I guess? You used to DL 3+ x your bodyweight no?
Jorx - I am in maintenance mode as I am planning to compete in 144 lbs weightclass in beginning of october and am nearing 160 right now. I feel that I have enough fighting-strength. Cardio is much more of an issue as is flexibility.No squat racks or cages???? Shit you need to get a new gym sir!
This is an amateur MMA event held over 2 days and you have to weigh in BOTH mornings. The plan is to cut the last 8 lbs with water.
No squatrack in my gym where i
I train systematically:(
2 days? Is this a tournament or something? You're potentially fighting more than once, weigh ins are on the same day as the fights and you're planning on cutting 8lbs? Really?
Hey!
For DL technique I suggest you check out the articles under the tag Deadlift at stronglifts.com - they helped me a lot.
As you asked for numbers, just for comparison (because you know my body type), I've DL-ed for about 2 months for now after not having done it for over 5 years and on my last workout I did 264 (120kg) for 5X5. With your bodytype I guess you should be able to DL more.
Cheers
Indrek