Doesn't Shamrock vs Jackson have to be considered

Magic8 - 
Rickson's Aura - Frank gave excellent wrestlers like Kevin Jackson and Dan Henderson a lesson in submissions and he gave the much bigger and stronger Tito Ortiz a lesson in technique and cardio. On top of all that, he could work the mic like nobody else and is one of the rare fighters to draw outside the UFC/Pride.

<b>ECW had been trying to recruit him for a while after his UFC title run </b>and I'm sure if he did a pro wrestling stint and came back, he would have been an even bigger draw.

 Really?   Never heard that.


I have to admit I was into pro wrestling in those days. Ken had made the switch and was in the WWF. Frank had the Shamrock name and he had the reputation as the top guy in the UFC. Paul Heyman tried hard to recruit him just as he tried with Kurt Angle. Everybody knows what happened to Kurt. I remember hearing interviews of Frank years after and he said that he had respect for the toughness of pro wrestling considering how hard it is on the body, but at the end of the day he was a competitive guy and wouldn't have that same passion for something that isn't the real thing. That was why he never did professional wrestling.

Anyone remember Ken's debut on Raw? It was hilarious. They introduced him at the beginning. He was sitting wit his wife in the front row. Then Ron Simmons err....Farooq came out at some point with his music playing and his cronies (Nation of Domination). Then he went to Ken and said that he saw that cage fighting stuff, but if Ken was really tough he would need to prove himself in a pro wrestling ring. Then Ken gets in his face and says he's down to "fight" anytime if Vince can put it together. Pro wrestling was great fun years ago.

thanks for the clip, SCT. A fine educational resource for newbs like me.

EvilMaster - I remember rewinding my bootleg VHS tape of that armbar and watching the submission like 20 times in a row. Frank Shamrock was definitely "THE" man in those days.

Lol, I just did the same thing on here, but maybe five times instead of 20.

Rickson's Aura - Frank Shamrock a true legend and pioneer of MMA that the UFC fails to recognize and noobs will never know about.


 THATS THE NOOBS FUCKING FAULT..HOW THE FUCK YOU GONNA BLAME dana???

skinnywussy - 
Rickson's Aura - Frank gave excellent wrestlers like Kevin Jackson and Dan Henderson a lesson in submissions...




Whoah... I was getting ready to post "HEY HENDO AND SHAMROCK NEVER FOUGHT FAGGOT!!" when I did I quick search first. I'd never seen that grappling match before. Badass.



 

Rickson's Aura - Frank Shamrock a true legend and pioneer of MMA that the UFC fails to recognize and noobs will never know about.


x3 True legend

Still wish I saw Frank vs Saku in Pride though :(

I didn't think at the time that an armbar could be slapped on that quick after the takedown.

4 lata

Zinoviev had previous back injuries, just pointing that out. Still a very legit win over a VERY scary opponent. Igor Z was a beast. But he had bad back and never fought professionally again after that nasty slam by Frankie...

Frankie was indeed the man and really should've fought Saku back when it mattered. IMO.

Frank is a legend, but unfortunately he's on the zuffa hit list and you know what that means

That said, can you imagine if Frank stayed active and went to Pride circa 2001-02? So many dream fights we never got see. Frank vs. Saku, Frank vs. Silva etc.

Wasn't DSE trying to get Frank at some point?

noobs/Zuffa shills ...you might want to leave this thread at this point....

With like 6-9 months worth of training Frank took on Carlson Gracie blackbelt Allan Goes. Back in those days a black belt (that too from Carlson) meant you're legit and your sub offense was something to watch out for. Nowadays black belts are given to guys who are primarily sub defenders. The match was a draw since neither guy was finished. Rope breaks were allowed and they saved Frank and Goes. Goes (a bigger version of Royce with better BJJ credentials in my view) controlled the action and position, but a rookie Shamrock was able get an ankle lock that ended up injuring Goes's leg before the rope break. Very impressive in those days.

Frank had like 5 fights in the UFC and each one is memorable in its own way. The first two fights have been mentioned. Before Sonnen/Anderson, there was Frank Shamrock/Jeremy Horn (the guy who has tapped Sonnen like 3 times). It was a short notice fight with Frank not knowing how good Horn was. It was an entertaining grappling show with Jeremy Horn winning position and Frank attacking with subs. They go at it till the time-limit. Then in overtime, Frank pulls out a kneebar to retain the title.

Fight#4 vs. John Lober...Frank avenges his only loss in MMA rules (not counting Pancrase). Frank fought him first right after leaving the Lion's Den and he said he wasn't accustomed to MMA rules. Lober talks trash and says crap about Shamrock's family. He also has a brash up and coming wrestler named Tito Ortiz in his corner. Shamrock dominates from start to finish and takes his time beating Lober and making him quit.

Fight#5 vs. Tito Ortiz. Tito has beaten and insulted Lion's Den members Mezger and Bohlander. He put on the "Gay Mezger is my bitch" shirt after his fight with Guy. He says Frank is ducking him and he will finish him off like the rest of the Lion's Den (although Frank had left long ago). After a year of fighting out of the UFC, Frank accepts the challenge and out talks Tito in all the interviews and promotion. Being outweighed more than 20 lbs, Frank sticks to a gameplan of cardio/stand-up/ground defense. Tito dominates positions and cuts Frank Shamrock early on. As the rounds go on, Frank's words "I'm gonna wear him out" to his corner after round 1 prove to be true. Frank dramatically reverses position in round 4 and the two throw punches on the feet till Tito takes it to the ground and eventually Frank makes him QUIT with elbow strikes to the head as Tito is holding on to Frank's foot. It was similar to the way the Tito/Mezger 2 ended except that was a TKO. Tito ends up wearing a pro Frank Shamrock shirt after the fight. Frank taught Tito a lesson in respect.

I can't think of another champion that has had a run quite like this in terms of good opposition and dramatic fights all in a row.

 about the jackson armbar, fank said he had drilled the armbar for him so many times that when he got it in the fight it felt just like the drill.

he also armbarred tamura the second he hit the ground, but tamura got a rope escape

Kevin Jackson was a beast. He totally dominated Lober.



Win Sam Adkins Submission (Arm Bar) EC 18 - Extreme Challenge 18 5/15/1998 1 4:21

Loss Jerry Bohlander Technical Submission (Armbar) UFC 16 - Battle in the Bayou 3/13/1998 1 10:23

Loss Frank Shamrock Submission (Armbar) UFC 15.5 - Ultimate Japan 1 12/21/1997 1 0:16

Win Tony Fryklund Submission (Choke) UFC 14 - Showdown 7/27/1997 1 0:44

Win Todd Butler TKO UFC 14 - Showdown 7/27/1997 1 1:27

Win John Lober Submission (Arm-Triangle Choke) EF 4 - Extreme Fighting 4 3/28/1997 2 1:12

 Frank was the man

What happened to Franks gym?

William Colosimo - 
cluster - Controversial finish though that tarnishes it.

Doubtful it would have ended any differently if it had been allowed to continue, but all the same....


wtf fight did you watch? there was no controversial finish. Jackson tapped. He didnt deny it. what more do you want?


Fuuuuggg. For some reason I remembered the finish to the Bohlander fight with Frank's head on Jerry. My bad.

Rickson's Aura - Frank Shamrock a true legend and pioneer of MMA that the UFC fails to recognize and noobs will never know about.




this is true and a fucking shame frank is truely a legend and a pioneer!

Has anyone else ever got a title shot with their first fight in the UFC?

Bobby Lupo - 
TheFirstDragon - Ahh!



Those were the days...





Thanks for this thread.





Frank Shamrock is the man who single handedley brought the UFC through the "dark times" when they were becoming bankrupt.



He is the man that the UFC should recognize as one of their true pioneers, yet refuses to acknowledge the fact that he even exists.



Shame on Zuffa and the Fertittas. And especially shame on Dana White.





 That was Tito, Chuck and ultimately TUF. Frank was great, the Anderson/GSP of his day, but Tito was the face of the UFC who bridged the gap between old and new and sold the hell out of his fights.
I think he was talking about the dark era when UFC wasn't being shown on cable anymore and politicians like John McCain were working to ban the entire sport.    waaaay before Chucks rise and TUF.



iirc it was UFC's 22-30.

Frank X TIto was UFC 22



but you're right though, Tito deserves most of the credit and became Zuffa's immediate posterboy right after they bought UFC from SEG.

   

 Frank Shamrock was the first SUPER STAR ATHLETE of MMA



He was on another level



I mean look at Jackson in that clip, he seriously looks like some kind of "beast man" from parts unknown, straigh freak.



I saw this event, and fight live, it's fucking legendary