gary gyrax never juiced and he is a fringe sport god!
Guy Fawkes - If you don't have proof than you sound like a whiny little baby making excuses.
I think Roger Clemons should use this in court next week.
Guy Fawkes - If you don't have proof than you sound like a whiny little baby making excuses.
Except that Terra won his weight class.
Hmmm...
I don't understand why people in this thread are criticizing Fabio for not addressing the issue of steroid use in BJJ, or for trying to sweep it under the rug. His statement clearly says:
"I never took any steroids in my life, and that’s what I tell my students to do. If this gentleman knows everything about everyone, he should point his finger and put out names. Don’t try to make the sport looks (sic) bad because this is not true. Probably some competitors take steroids but they are not the majority as he says."
So Fabio acknowledges that some competitors use steroids, and is pretty clear in saying that he does not approve of those who do. It's also worth noting that Fabio does not make the claim that none of his students have ever used steroids before a competition.
It seems to me that his intent in writing this was not address to broad issue of steroid use in BJJ, but to refute Caio's thinly veiled claim that his students, who of course never use steroids, are only losing to students from teams like Alliance because those other teams are all juicing. Throwing claims around that the majority of the top competitors are using steroids, without offering any proof whatsoever, makes the entire sport look bad. Fabio's statement in response seems perfectly reasonable to me.
I bet 80 percent of Brazilians who compete at a high level, no matter what the belt are on the juice.
TTT for Caio keeping it real.
Lets keep pretending that its only a few people.
Kneeblock - Fabio spoke out as a direct refutation to Caio because Caio's interview where he made the accusation took place directly after he beat Bruno Malfacine who is an Alliance fighter. The implication seemed to be that Caio was saying Malfacine was one of the steroid users, but I don't think that's what he was saying at all. In the follow-up interview, he clearly praises Bruno, but just says this was his moment to have an open forum and he took it. I can see why Fabio would be a little butt-hurt because it looks like Caio was putting the juicer tag on Bruno, but that's not exactly what happened.
I think there's more to it than that. In a follow-up interview, Caio is specifically asked about Alliance head coach Jacare' Cavalcanti's criticisms of his original statements. In response, Caio stated that the people who have a problem with him accusing the entire sport of juicing "are only saying this because most of them use steroids."
http://www.insidebjj.com/2011/04/16/caio-terra-vs-steroids/
I don't think it's much of a stretch to interpret this statement as at least implying that most members of Team Alliance use steroids, even if he wasn't directing his accusations at Malfacine or any other fighter in particular. This actually seems like a much more serious accusation - one fighter being found out using steroids is bad enough, but if entire teams are using them, that's a scandal.
In that light, I think Gurgel's response was perfectly reasonable.
Interesting exchange.
Thirteen - They're really taking the shine off of what used to be a team most of us admired.
All they would have to do to look like the good guys is say "Yeah Caio brings up a great point. We denounce steroids and anyone who uses them. They're bad for your health and bad for the sport."
Instead they're using 3rd grade logic like "ohh he can't prove it so he should be quiet" and "he's a baby for talking about steroids".
Depressing really.
Yeah
My thoughts / questions.
How much could steroids really do for you in BJJ? If you do too much you're going to move up in weight, and the weigh ins are same day before your matches. So no time to beef on strength and cut the weight then recover. Aside from recovery from injuries, I just don't see it helping too much.
steroids certainly can't help your technical game.
FenceGrab - My thoughts / questions.
How much could steroids really do for you in BJJ? If you do too much you're going to move up in weight, and the weigh ins are same day before your matches. So no time to beef on strength and cut the weight then recover. Aside from recovery from injuries, I just don't see it helping too much.
steroids certainly can't help your technical game.
I've never took steroids- so I may be speaking out of turn.
But from what I have read, steroids allow you to recuperate much faster. If that is the case, people could conceivably train a couple of hours each day more than they could without them.
This extra mat time, makes a huge difference on the mat.
Additionally, they just wouldnt be sore and hurt all the time compared to other competitors.
I've heard numerous high level black belts tell me how beat down their bodies were- neck, back, joints, etc. I'm assuming if these guys were using steroids, there bodies would be feeling much better.
In terms of Fabio's response, I also didnt see too much back peddling with it.
If Ciao knows Alliance people (or others) that actively use steroids, then Fabio is saying he should name them.
That seems like strong support from Fabio to NOT use them.
Fuzzy Badfeet -FenceGrab - My thoughts / questions.
How much could steroids really do for you in BJJ? If you do too much you're going to move up in weight, and the weigh ins are same day before your matches. So no time to beef on strength and cut the weight then recover. Aside from recovery from injuries, I just don't see it helping too much.
steroids certainly can't help your technical game.
this was my response in another thread to someone that had a similar statement, just copied and pasted here:
ive juiced and it gave me a huge advantage.
If you know how to train properly, and eat properly, and you take steroids, EVERYTHING will improve.
The amount of time you can train is ridiculous.
As far as this knucklehead saying that juice hurts your cardio....
People tend to just think of juice as ONLY testosterone boosters, but that isnt the case.
DONT YOU THINK THERE IS A REASON THAT PRO ATHLETES WITH MULTI MILLION DOLLAR CAREERS AND ENDORSEMENT DEALS PUT IT ALL AT RISK TO TAKE STEROIDS???
do me a favor and do a couple cycles of epogen and tell me how you feel. spend a year on high dose of HGH and tell me how you feel.
in terms of "preventing injury", its just steroids, not an adamantium endoskeleton ala wolverine....
However, your body will feel so good and recovered, that it is basically the same thing. In my case I always had a super sore back that would prevent me from sleeping and i would be really lethargic all day as a result. this went on for a LONG time when i left the army. With hgh, and some other substances, my pain literally vanished. I could sleep so well that i could train allot better. I was training harder than ever, and recovering as soon as my workout was over. Im talking I could do a hardcore olympic lifting session at near-max weights and 20 minutes later feel like I had never lifted that day and could do it all over again if i wanted.
Its true that if you just take testosterone and go do bench press and squat, and eat a 100 lbs of steak a month, then sit around like a jackoff that your cardio will suffer. but if you didnt do steroids and had that same routine your cardio would suffer too. You may be surprised, but if you are in running shape, and continue to run while even on test, you will improve greatly.
While in the army I was a medium distance runner. I was fast as hell, and my lung capacity was pretty unbelievable, and the only thing that would slow me down was how tired my legs would get. I took my first cycle while I was in very good running shape. my times got ALLOT faster, because in a 5 mile race my legs would literally NOT get tired.
ULTIMATELY, i wound up with negative effects. the steroid use was just a catalyst, but the ultimate problem was my own lack of discipline.
If you are taking some random roids that your buddy offered you, dont know how to train properly, dont eat properly, etc then no, you will not reap all the benefits.
A common misconception is that you dont have to train as hard or eat as clean if you are on juice. maybe. However, most people that are willing to possibly sacrifice their health for an edge are typically willing to eat clean and train hard. The ability to train harder and harder more and more often MAY offset some unclean eating though obviously.
weight cutting. Ive cut 10 pounds in 5 days using only clenbuterol and not doing a single minute of exercise or cutting calories. admittedly different people are affected in different ways to all of the steroids out there. but if I could cut that much when i was at low bodyfat while doing no exercise and not changing my diet how much do you think someone with a good work ethic, and an ACTUAL REASON to lose weight could get rid of.
I can say that i know FOR A FACT that at least 3 ADCC absolute champions have used juice in preparation. 1 of them i bought from, one of them I hooked up with a friend so they could get some, and another im just friends with and we talked about it.
If you are taking juice (in the test booster sense) and starving yourself to cut weight, then expecting to have any strength, then... well... youre an idiot. A big part of the reason that steroids will never be legal is because silly fan boys do dangerous things because they are clueless and unwilling to do the research or unwilling to ask someone who knows better than they do.
BUt fuzzy, you lose it all when you go off cycle. hahaha. you may be surprised at how much you can keep if you are:
A: doing the right drugs
B using post cycle therapy (what most fanboy steroid users dont do)
Like i said, I was medium distance runner. I had absolutely no muscle at all. i could not put on any weight no matter what I ate. here are the big numbers that I remember. when I started juicing I could do flat bench dumbbell press with 55 lb weights. 2 sets of 6 and i was RUINED. in 6 weeks I had gained 28 solid pounds. in 8 weeks I could bench 100 lb dumbbells on the incline bench for 7 sets of 13 reps. I dont remember exactly how long it took me just to get to the 100 lb'ers, but pretty much every time i did a bench workout i was adding a set and a rep and feeling fine. I could do a single shitty rep on the squat for about 300 lbs when I started, and within about 6 weeks i was well over 400. At the time I was in iraq and had literally nothing to do except lift weights, run, eat and sleep. When i went off cycle i lost about 5 lbs. I was allot less motivated to lift, but pushed myself and kept pretty much all of my strength for about a year untli i just stopped working out completely.
If you think that steroids dont work then you are lying to yourself.
I do bjj now as a career. If I wanted to make a serious run at any kind of worthwhile title i would have to be on juice and I know that. there is no way to train hard enough to win against someone on steroids unless you are on as well. dont be silly.
Great post- thanks for sharing!
deleted.... Fuzzy said it all better than I did and with first hand testimonial.
THANKS Fuzzy for taking the time, I wish people would read that 100 times. BJJ players don't take the same stuff or cycles to be like Ronnie Coleman. They don't call them designer drugs because they are one size fits all. If you want to become huge there is a cycle and a protocol for that, if you want to be lean and mean they can help with that, if you want to have endless abilities to train and recover they can do that. BALCO didn't exist to produce testosterone, it existed to enhance performance period. I love that people judge PED usage by bicep size.
We know pretty much every cyclist has or would use PED's if possible. Any huge cyclists? Any cyclists with good cardio and great abilities to train?
As I mentioned before in another thread with PEDs legal in some countries and even in the US you can get prescriptions for a lot of them and very few rules against them in BJJ tournaments; WHY WOULDN'T YOU USE THEM? It doesn't make sense.
Interesting about the ADCC absolute champs. Not too many of those running around.