in a lot of fights i see the loser getting pummled while being mounted high up on the chest with the knees right under the armpits. it seems very hard to upa them off you, so what would be the safest, most effective way to escape from this without getting your head knocked in?
I always do a back escape hear. Right into an ankle lock.
what is the backdoor escape. is that pushing him over your head? sometimes that can be hard to get them all the way over and with a flurry of punches coming.
you use your legs to push the guy up and you slide out the back.
i like to just benchpress the guy off of me by grabbing his belt with both hands, and then put him in the guard. however, this only works against beginners with a weak mount or smaller guys that you can move easily.
One way to do the backdoor escape is to put your hands in his armpits and throw him forward in the direction your head is pointing. When he is forward enough you put one or both of your feet in his armpits and keep pushing him forward as you come out between his legs. You end up both face down with you on top where you can ankle lock him.
Doesn't pushing into his armpits with your arms open you up to an armbar?
Yeah i would think so too. I do andrews escape but i grab at least one sleeve. That way if the post with their hands you can just pull one or both arms towards you and continue the movement.
Andrew is much better then me though, so hopefully ill learn something new ;)
Also, sometimes if you suprise them you can just take them right back with your legs so the land on their back. This can be a dog fight though, and you might be open for ankle attacks.
If someone has a really high tight mount, I know my arms can't really move at all and just kinda flop around my face. I wouldn't want to extend them because that'd be like saying "hi, please armbar me" and don't think they could really bend to grab the belt...this is interesting, I'll have to work on that tomorrow in class.
Well, if the top guy is sitting upright he can armbar you, but if he is leaning forward at an acute angle,it is difficult for him to throw his leg over. But anyways, I don't even like doing the backdoor that much, it's kind of a desperation escape because if it doesn't work you've given up even more posture.I prefer to shoulder crawl back and get my elbows into posture. See link
Escapes are probably different when the person is TRIANGLING you from the mount. *cough* But yes, making the person fall forward is good. I'm glad I read that link but should have finished it... but I got out! hahaha
If they're punching, then sometimes just baiting them for the armbar works, stick one arm staight up and grab for their neck, they usually take it, keep your other arm by your face to guard for punches and stop the armbar. When you feel them take your arm and swing their leg over, use your free hand (the one by your face) to stop their leg from getting over your head, you'll end up in guard position.
If they're so high that you can't really use your arms for anything, turning your back actually works (see Sakuraba :o)
1) Tuck into them slightly, and turn into a turlte position, keep your chin tucked and protect your neck
2) not that you're in turtle, GET THE HELL OUT! Don't stay on your knees for more than a second AT THE ABSOLUTE LONGEST, exposively come up to your feet with your forehead still on the ground, this will shift their center of gravity farther forward than it already is
3) duck and try to get out the back door, but watch leaving your arms behind,
Best case, I've gone from mount to getting rear mount on them, worst case, they usually stop punching the back of my head and go for a rear naked choke, something I can defend easier on the ground.
Yeah baiting armbar or giving up your back is much better than getting your face caved in.
Interesting point I would like to have considered. In light of a baiting arm for an armbar, why not isolate one of the legs at the same time. By this I mean, if you are giving the left arm, snatch their left leg with the right arm when they move their hips and when the attempt for the arm comes off it is halfway escaped already. There is danger of a cross-body if the oponent feels or sees the escape, but depending on the ability to isolate the leg and your ability to pull through before the isolated leg can regain position, you are in guard and can work on a pass. It is risky but will be a good deception if you are quick-witted enough and you don't expend the energy that a forced backdoor escape might warrant. Does this make sense? I need a camera...
faxiamonkey, you have to be careful reaching across to grab his knee like that before he commits to the move. If they see you reach across, many times my opps just grab my arm and beat the shite out of me while tying up that arm. Usually they go for the armbar quick when they're punching, their adrenaline is running and they usually try to swing into it without controlling your head, that's when this works well. If they go for a more controlled slow and tight approach to the armbar, it probably won't work, but tapping to an armbar hurts a lot less than taking a shitton of punches to the dome.
BTW, for anybody doubting the armbar "gift" move. I owe Roy Harris two bits for that one, it's right off his BJJ 101 tape and his description on this forum, I haven't used it in a ring or cage yet, but I have done it in heavy training with my own guys before. It's worked on them... mostly.... but we'll not talk about the times it didn't.....
Well it is not necessarily a reach across as much as it is keeping the isolated leg from completing the lock on the arm that is extended. I may have described it incorrectly but if they are mounted high, their left leg will be directly under your right arm. Isolation of that leg was what I was getting at, not so much as grabbing it or attempting to manipulate it, but isolation can be as little as an elbow placed where an attempt at the armbar has that leg run into the point of your elbow. I definately do not recommend allowing enough space to be hit so grabbing that leg and extending the baited arm at the same time would be as close to suicide as jumping off the empire state bldg. and reconsidering halfway down. This is an escape that I have used quite a few times, though, and it has been very successful as it is very deceptive. Again, I really need a camera, but I do see your point Skpotomus, if you were to cross your arms you would be decimated with the opponent's high position. I just butchered my previous description.
This is exactly why I come here. Thanks guys.
faxia, I think we're saying the same thing, in a different way, when I give up the arm, as they take it, my other arm comes up to control their knee, keeping it off of my head, without the leg over the head I sit up into their guard.