Hitler a Christian?

Hitler said this in a speech on April 12, 1922 (Norman H Baynes, The Speeches of Adolf Hitler, April 22-August 1939, Oxford University Press 1942).

"My feeling as a Christian points me to my Lord and Saviour as a fighter. It points me to the man who once in loneliness, surrounded by a few followers, recognised these Jews for what they were and who, God's truth! was greatest not as a sufferer but as a fighter....as a Christian and as a man I read through the passage which tells us how the Lord at last rose in His might and seized the scourge to drive out of the Temple the brood if vipers and adders. How terrific was His fight for the world against the Jewish poison...as a Christian I have also a duty to my own people".

this doesn't square with what anyone has said on this board, any ideas?

rev

Hitler may in public have claimed to be doing the will of God, but records of his private conversations show otherwise. Many of these were recorded by his secretary and published in a book called Hitler's Table Talk (Adolf Hitler, London, Weidenfeld & Nicholson, 1953). I have lifted the text of these from the soc.religion.christian newsgroup's Hitler FAQ.
Night of 11th-12th July, 1941

"National Socialism and religion cannot exist together....
"The heaviest blow that ever struck humanity was the coming of Christianity. Bolshevism is Christianity's illegitimate child. Both are inventions of the Jew. The deliberate lie in the matter of religion was introduced into the world by Christianity....
"Let it not be said that Christianity brought man the life of the soul, for that evolution was in the natural order of things." (p 6 & 7)

10th October, 1941, midday

"Christianity is a rebellion against natural law, a protest against nature. Taken to its logical extreme, Christianity would mean the systematic cultivation of the human failure." (p 43)

14th October, 1941, midday

"The best thing is to let Christianity die a natural death.... When understanding of the universe has become widespread... Christian doctrine will be convicted of absurdity....
"Christianity has reached the peak of absurdity.... And that's why someday its structure will collapse....
"...the only way to get rid of Christianity is to allow it to die little by little....
"Christianity the liar....
"We'll see to it that the Churches cannot spread abroad teachings in conflict with the interests of the State." (p 49-52)

19th October, 1941, night

"The reason why the ancient world was so pure, light and serene was that it knew nothing of the two great scourges: the pox and Christianity."

21st October, 1941, midday

"Originally, Christianity was merely an incarnation of Bolshevism, the destroyer....
"The decisive falsification of Jesus' doctrine was the work of St.Paul. He gave himself to this work... for the purposes of personal exploitation....
"Didn't the world see, carried on right into the Middle Ages, the same old system of martyrs, tortures, faggots? Of old, it was in the name of Christianity. Today, it's in the name of Bolshevism. Yesterday the instigator was Saul: the instigator today, Mardochai. Saul was changed into St.Paul, and Mardochai into Karl Marx. By exterminating this pest, we shall do humanity a service of which our soldiers can have no idea." (p 63-65)

13th December, 1941, midnight

"Christianity is an invention of sick brains: one could imagine nothing more senseless, nor any more indecent way of turning the idea of the Godhead into a mockery.... ....
"When all is said, we have no reason to wish that the Italians and Spaniards should free themselves from the drug of Christianity. Let's be the only people who are immunised against the disease." (p 118-119)

14th December, 1941, midday

"Kerrl, with noblest of intentions, wanted to attempt a synthesis between National Socialism and Christianity. I don't believe the thing's possible, and I see the obstacle in Christianity itself....
"Pure Christianity-- the Christianity of the catacombs-- is concerned with translating Christian doctrine into facts. It leads quite simply to the annihilation of mankind. It is merely whole-hearted Bolshevism, under a tinsel of metaphysics." (p 119 & 120)

9th April, 1942, dinner

"There is something very unhealthy about Christianity." (p 339)

27th February, 1942, midday

"It would always be disagreeable for me to go down to posterity as a man who made concessions in this field. I realize that man, in his imperfection, can commit innumerable errors-- but to devote myself deliberately to errors, that is something I cannot do. I shall never come personally to terms with the Christian lie."
"Our epoch in the next 200 years will certainly see the end of the disease of Christianity.... My regret will have been that I couldn't... behold ." (p 278)

I think Hitler was a master politician...he used whatever he could to pander and control the masses

thanks Sherm, I have no interest in the man at all so I just don't know.

rev

Hitler was an occultist as were many of those close to him.

The 'funny' thing is that Hitler had a lot of 'Christian' support before the war. The Jews were unpopular, and no-one hated them more than the Christians.

sorry, don't think that is funny at all.

rev

^^ Rev,

Hence the apostrophes around funny.

It was disgusting.

These Christians are the same groups of people still running the major churches today.

no problem john, I wasnt trying to argue or anyhting...I do however think this thread will get alot of posts.
I am a big WW2 buff...both my grandfathers fought the Nazi's in WW 2

I'm not interested in Hitler either...but i am facinated with what makes evil men tick....i guess..."know your enemies"

but Hitler was also not an athiest

"We were convinced that the people need and require this faith. We have therefore undertaken the fight against the atheistic movement, and that not merely with a few theoretical declarations: we have stamped it out".
"For their interests [the Church's] cannot fail to coincide with ours [the National Socialists] alike in our fight against the symptoms of degeneracy in the world of to-day, in our fight against a Bolshevist culture, against atheistic movement, against criminality, and in our struggle for a consciousness of a community in our national life".

Both of these quotes are from Norman H. Baynes, ed. The Speeches of Adolf Hitler, April 1922-August 1939, Vol. 1 of 2, Oxford University Press, 1942, cited in an Internet article by Doug Krueger.

Another interesting quote from Hitler is found in a book by Albert Speer, Hitler's Minister of Armaments:

"I often feel that we will have to undergo all the trials the devil and hell can devise before we achieve Final Victory....I may be no pious churchgoer, but deep within me I am nevertheless a devout man. That is to say, I believe that he who fights valiantly obeying the laws which a god has established and who never capitulates but instead gathers his forces time after time and always pushes forward--such a man will not be abandoned by the Lawgiver. Rather he will ultimately receive the blessing of Providence. And that blessing has been imparted to all great spirits in history." (Albert Speer, Inside the Third Reich : Memoirs. Bonanza Books ; Distributed by Crown Publishers, 1982, cited in an Internet article by Kevin Davids).

These sentiments are obviously neither atheist nor Christian.

In conclusion, I think that Hitler was not an atheist, but he was not a Christian either. While he was materialist and rationalist in a lot of things, he also talked a lot about "Providence", or "Nature", as a sort of mystical force of fate, and he saw himself as somehow destined for victory even when the war was going badly for him, simply because of the purity of his purpose, his strength of will, and his feeling of destiny. I have even read that he believed in reincarnation. To me, some of his quotes and writings make it sound like he worshipped the German national identity; some make it seem like instead of God he worshipped or idealised or divinised Providence / Nature / Fate, with his glorious destiny assured no matter what; and in some ways it seems to me like he worshipped himself.
For a more detailed analysis of Hitler's thinking and his Christianity or otherwise, I strongly recommend Kevin Davids' excellent article on the subject.

Finally, two last points. The first is not very compelling, but I found it interesting. The first time I found Hitler's Mein Kampf on-line was at a White Supremacy hate site whose homepage had a litany of Hitler's anti-Christian quotes.

The second point is that even the Atheism Web highlights the difference between Hitler's public speeches before he came to power, and his attitude after 1935 when he saw Christianity as a threat to Nazi domination.

Oh yeah bro, I was truly thankful. When I read that quote I was really taken aback because of what I had read here. So I figured I would ask you guys who have actually studied it. I was mentioning that I probably could have looked it up myself, but that I don't care enough to do that. Thanks again guys

rev

so from what i gather Hitler was a Spiritist

;)

look i think Hitler was grossly misunderstood, he was a vegetarian so clearly he was not a vicous meat scarfing carnivore like the rest of you vile savages.
i seriously doubt he did all these horrible things attributed to him, i mean how could he get so aggressive that he conqured all of europe, i mean shouldn't he be all immaciated and weak with no will power and a total pacifist.

he was framed i tell ya!! Framed

which just proves vegetarianism is an evil which must be stomped out

Hawker is correct

like i said hitler was a politician...he was doing what ALL politicians do...pander to the group of people he was speaking to at the time...and then sneaking a bit of his idiology into it...desceretly

hitler=

mask I am quite aware of that, I posted this here because the guys here talked about how anti faith he was, but then I read this quote and was shocked. No thought for a moment that he was actually a follower of Jesus.

rev

Many believe that Hitler was harvesting the crop of anti-semitism that Luther planted at the Reformation.

' Many believe that Hitler was harvesting the crop of anti-semitism that Luther planted at the Reformation'

Interesting thought. hawker has some points but that is some interesting points to ponder. Germany may have been a perfect place to 'harvest' the anti semitism. So many pieces fell into place in germany that are just bordering on otherworldly.

I always thought he was an occultist that was trying to bring about a new Aryan religion. Maybe even based off of Nordic mythology. Anybody ?

Indeed you are correct.

And not that I'm proud of this fact but for the record Hitler was raised Catholic and in fact was rejected as a candidate for the seminary.