Read this on another thread and I thought it might be a good topic.
Some instructors don't teach escapes? Has anyone experienced this? Advantages? Disadvantages?
It seems like escapes can get very complicated because subtle changes in the top person's postioning can totally change the escape. I can see why this might be one of those things that just needs to be learned with mat time and personal experience. I had just never heard of it before. Comments?
w. t. f. !!??!!
I would like to hear someone defend this theory of teaching/learning in BJJ.
Check out "Great Escapes" by Gustavo Machado...
There was a movie once . . . called "The Great Escape"
There can be no bjj without escapes. An instructor who does not teach escapes is probably not a good instructor.
I hear Del La Riva doesn't teach escapes.
A couple years ago i was watching Eddie Bravo teach a class on video, he was teaching moves step by step (which i think is an EXCELLENT way to teach), so i e mailed him and asked him if he taught his escapes that way....he emailed me back and said "I don't teach escapes".
I don't know if he still doesn't teach escapes, but thats what he wrote me.
that seems a little backwards to me ...how can u teach a offensive strategy without having a defensive contingency plan???!!
The not teaching escapes thing is kinda TMAish.
You know, "We have groundfighting!" because they show a bad armbar once a month, but never anything around the armbar,or how to get out of the armbar?
Max
I've never heard about this. I'd be interested to hear the theory behind it, although I can't think of a logical reason for it off the top of my head. Maybe it's like the old school TMA people who wouldn't teach grappling because "I would knock them out before they could take me down". Instead it's "I never let them get me in a bad position to begin with, so I don't have a need to escape" :)
James
www.fosterbjj.com
RockinNonStop - I hear Del La Riva doesn't teach escapes.
I read this in another thread on here and I dont' belive it for a second...
Maybe he takes a different approach to teachning escapes or something, but I find it EXTREMELY hard to believe he doesn't teach how to escape positions at all.
Are we talking about teaching escapes from positions, or from submissions?I could see not teaching white belts to, for example, escape an arm bar because they might get injured in the process, they might not be able to recall the more complicated escapes in the heat of the moment, and their attention should be focused on the larger moves, i.e., not giving up an arm bar in the first place, and getting arm barred is the best way to learn that.Not teaching escapes from positions is silly.I have a feeling Eddie Bravo was joking when he said he doesn't teach escapes.
I've been at a lot of schools and I've never heard of people not teaching escapes. I mean, something as simple hipping out and recovering guard after getting stuck in side control qualifies as an escape. Removing the hooks when someone has your back, escaping a triangle, etc. Even the basic upa bridge when being mounted is an "escape"...
There is no way any teacher out there could not teach escapes to moves, absolutely no way.
"You're late."
Royler Gracie
Me:
"Shit happens. Here's how you get out."
when i first started training, i remember john will saying that he would show a position and not show the counter.
the reason was because if he showed the counter, then people would practice the move but because the counter was shown they wouldn't believe in the technique.
he mentioned that during rolling, counters to the moves shown would come about and that this would make students understand the concepts.
or something like that. maybe one of the oz machado guys can chip in coz i'm not with machado anymore.
watching how many people "escape" mount i wouldnt doubt it if people have stopped teaching it.
Our instructor teaches everything. There just isn't time enough to teach it all at once, so sometimes it seems like we are "only learning" one thing.
There doesn't seem to be as strong an effort on escapes as there are on teaching subs and sweeps. Most of my escapes were learned from Roy Harris BJJ101, and Thornton's FJKD2. Everyone get taught the UPA, and recomposing guard, but you need at least 2 escapes from every position IMO.
My impression was that they meant positional escapes. That's why I wanted someone who has been exposed to this to answer some questions.
I mean do they not consider getting guard an escape? Because I know everyone has to at least be taught that!
RockinNonStop - I hear Del La Riva doesn't teach escapes.
If you hang around here long enough you'll hear all kinds of other dumb shit too.
DLR has taught me several escapes from every position and is a master at recomposing guard.
dojo stormer - when i first started training, i remember john will saying that he would show a position and not show the counter.
the reason was because if he showed the counter, then people would practice the move but because the counter was shown they wouldn't believe in the technique.
I have met a few teachers who feel this way. It kind of makes sense not to show the move and the escape together, at least for beginner students. It's hard enough for a novice to get a new submission without the opponent knowing the escape. It may be better to teach the sub, let everyone get caught in it that day sparring, then they will all pay extra attention to the escape when you teach it next class.