Is BJ really a prodigy?

There are other jiu-jitsu freaks out there that come along, but BJ Penn is definitely worthy of being called a prodigy.

def a prodigy but also a EXTREMELY hard worker. He got his bb in 3 yrs and 4 months (he said so himself in a grappling mag interview).

Money and access to trainers helps of course, but it really is BJ's training intensity that has taken him to where he is at now. He said that he used to take two moves he learned in class and drill them after class with someone, on each side of his body, no less than 200 times before he would move on to a new move. Now seriously, how many people do you know who have THAT level of dedication there? Not many, and those that do are the ones who shoot through the ranks quicker then those who have been at the academy for years and years but don't have that level of work ethic.

lol @ haters looking for reasons to hate.

A significant percentage of people who train are in similar positions where they do nothing but train. They train every day, many times multiple times a day. I see them all the time.

Yet you don't see hundreds of BJs running around.

lol @ thinking the only reason you aren't BJ is because you only have time to train 3 days a week.

"Technically, a prodigy is someone who has attained adult-level proficiency in a specialized field as a child. So, no, BJ is not a prodigy."

If your 18-20 and your competing at a champion level in a sport that's not female gymnastics, I'd say you meet that requirement.

"A significant percentage of people who train are in similar positions where they do nothing but train. They train every day, many times multiple times a day. I see them all the time."

that's funny, because every time I read about what most fighters outside of the UFC elite level are doing, it usually involves juggling their job + possibly school with fighting.

BJ is undoubtedly a prodigy, but I think there would be a quite a few more prodigies on his level if more fighters had his level of funding for training.

Didn't he take gobs of privates when he was starting out?

I've managed to get halfway decent technique-wise as a beginner at boxing pretty quickly despite not being able to train much and being fairly unathletic, simply because I was working with a REALLY good coach who taught me one-on-one for most of my training.

The proof of The Prodigy is shown before his career ever started, before he even had a black belt, but the very first moment he stepped on the mat.

He was damn good just starting out, before the relentless training.

He IS the Prodigy.

If I had his money and the time he had to train, maybe in 5+ years I would be as good as he was after 1. FACT.

Let me answer that question with a question. If you all you had to do all day is study physics, would you be the next Einstein?

Even with unlimited training or funding for training or whatever, there still aren't going to be a lot of guys running around at BJ Penn's level. You probably have guys at your own gym who go almost everyday but don't advance as quickly as guys who go only two times a week. Some people are just naturally talented. I don't know why that's so hard for some people to accept.

"that's funny, because every time I read about what most fighters outside of the UFC elite level are doing, it usually involves juggling their job + possibly school with fighting."

And I train with all kinds of people that do nothing but train. Yet they aren't out winning the Mundials.

Besides, once you show aptitude like BJ, teachers tend to want you around, as you will end up representing them, so they'll teach you even if you're a broke-ass motherfucker.

Take a look at the Underground.

Most people here went to high school for about 6 hours a day for four years.

The vast majority here could be generously described as 2 stripe whitebelts in the thinking department.

BJ is a prodigy

well imo hes very good at striking, wrestling, and bjj, and combining them in a fight



to me, thats a prodigy.



he does things i dont like too, but thats not part of this thread

Manny really is an anvil, I know this is true. He's short. He just lays there to do his job.

"Not everyone can do what BJ did, but more could if they had his resources."

exactly. that is what I am saying.

"And I train with all kinds of people that do nothing but train. Yet they aren't out winning the Mundials."

you train with all kinds of people who dedicate their lives 24/7 to training? How are they paying for a roof over their heads unless they are already an elite pro, already loaded, or have someone supporting their JJ habit?

and again, I am not saying everyone with unlimited training time is going to turn into the next BJ, just that a LOT more would.

"Besides, once you show aptitude like BJ, teachers tend to want you around, as you will end up representing them, so they'll teach you even if you're a broke-ass motherfucker."

maybe, but most teachers I have seen are not going to give the same level of attention (constant privates, etc.) to someone who can't pay shit in this modern era of MMA. You can make far more catering to the people who can pay, and many students are notoriously mercenary, the Carlson Gracie/BTT debacle should be proof enough of that.

once you are at a high level you aren't gonna have problems finding good training partners, though.

I hear what you're saying, and yeah, obviously more diamonds in the rough would be found if everyone had unlimited training.

But as far as teachers go, they tend to favor their talented students whether they're paying or not. Because it's an investment that pays off a hundred times over if that guy becomes "known", and it's known you were his teacher.

Why do you think Ralph was so angry when BJ left? I assure you it wasn't because of the money.

I was actually a naturally occurring black belt in BJJ and possessed total competence by my early teens.

My prodigious abilities slowly eroded as I began formal lessons, however. My training perseverance only sapped my skill over the years and that is why I now possess the skills of someone who has never trained.

BJ Penn's younger brother won the blue belt Mundials as a 6 month white belt. That family was gifted by the grappling gods...

"Most young guys around 19-20 have very few obligations and if they really wanted their lives to revolve around training they can find a way to do it relatively easily.

Which is why Joe Lauzon, undoubtedly one of the biggest up and comers in MMA, is still working a 9-5 IT job.

"Come on, you can get by on $15,000-20,000 a year if you're really thrifty"

you could do that in the South and Midwest if you had housing already provided or were sharing low-cost housing like shitty apartments or a trailer.

you're gonna have a hard time doing that in any city with abundant training partners, outside of maybe the area around MFS.

I'm working in CA right now, your ass is going to be homeless if you are expecting to live off that much money here. I think even illegals make more than that around this area, and a lot of those guys live 10+ people for a 2 bedroom home.

I was making about $10/hour for one job I was doing in Georgia, I had a friend in CA say that he wouldn't get out of bed for that money. After living out here for a while I see his point.

"Wouldn't many people be equally skilled if they had no financial obligations and were able to train full-time under the best instructors?"

Not equally, but damn good.. Some people are more fortunate than others, better get used to that.

Look at the guys that were born into fighting (Gracies are one example) with far more training experience than him. Most aren't on his level.

BJ is the prodigy. Not everyone can be like him. They need heart, dedication and talent.

actually the comparison to the Gracie family is valid...you will note that not all of the Gracies are equally good. Some guy named Rickson was said to be better than his bros/cousins.

can we all become skilled? Hell yeah, you managed to learn how to read, write, do math, etc.

we can get a BA, MSc, etc. With enough tuition/drive, maybe we could all get a PhD in physicis, but we won't all win a Nobel in Physics...that is the difference between Penn and a regular top 10 fighter.