I'd love to get a recording of that interview with McCain and Ken.
Wow thanks for that read, ttt for a video of that debate. Back in '95 I was just a kid and did not pay attention to politics, so I did not know Mccain was doing this or even knew who he was. In 2000 I went to his rally for gop nomination here in AZ and even shook his hand. I was a big supporter of his.
Then I joined the ug in 2000 and learned what he had done to our favorite sport. It was like a kick in the balls for me. I still respect him for what he has done for his country and I still believe he is one of the better politicians out there, but I can't forgive him for what he did. I'm sure he was being pressured to do it even though he had little education on the subject, but money talks.
SwampRocker....Do you have the original show, or the rerun they ran months later? One of the episodes seemed like it didn't have some of the same stuff as the other, like some things had been chopped. I don't remember which one.
QTyp....I don't know that he was being pressured in any way. I think someone may have brought him a tape of the UFC along with his coffee, he watched 20 seconds of it, and figured he had a new platform. Especially as uneducated as he was about it. Every politicain needs an edge. Maybe he figured that speaking out against the "human cockfighting" would be his.
If to say that he might have been pressured by boxing insiders, I doubt it. McCain once said that the UFC would never be sanctioned by any major state athletic associations, especially Nevada's. Vegas is where it's at, as far as boxing is concerned. So if boxing was worried about MMA becoming big enough for Vegas (which NO ONE ever thought it would), I think they would've lobbied a Nevada senator, not one from Arizona.
I think it was just a case of McCain riding his own high horse on that one.
Anyone who votes got McCain in 08 is voting the the death of MMA.
NewEngland, I disagree. As stated earlier on this thread, McCain has accepted MMA as a sport, for the most part. I think he'll always have it under his own microscope, but MMA is far beyond one politician at this point.
McCain would have to argue it's safety and legitamacy against another combative sport....boxing. And when you compare the two, MMA's safety record is impeccable compared to boxing's. At least, so far it is.
Hopefully (knock on wood), no one is ever seriously injured, and especially killed, competing in MMA. Then no one has a political leg to stand on if they choose to take an opposive stance in regards to MMA.
That was awsome seeing Ken, an MMA fighter who McCain was trying to portray as a barbarian, absolutely SCHOOLING him in a debate on national TV. Anyone watching, no matter which side they were on, would have to admit that Ken made him look silly. It was after that episode that I became a big Shamrock fan.
McCain was looking to destroy MMA, he has friends in the boxing commision, he is on of the key people on the boxing scene.
He is not a factor anymore, mma is much safer than boxing, IMO.
from http://www.motherjones.com/news/special_reports/coinop_congress/stock_congress/john_mccain.html
"Sen. McCain and his wife own over one-million dollars worth of stock interest in Hensley and Company--Cindy Hensley McCain's family firm (Ms. McCain is a Vice-President and Director in the firm). Hensley and Co. is the Phoenix area distributor of Anheuser-Bush beers. And according to Modern Brewery Age (2/28/94), Hensley and Co. is the 2nd largest Anheuser-Bush wholesaler in the United States."
Now if you weren't aware, Anheuser-Bush is a huge sponsor of boxing..... you do the math.
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From: Kirik
I read a quote by him where he said the sport appeared regulated now, or words to that effect.
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no offence but that's the equalivent of hitler coming out at the end and saying that "Well, maybe the jews aren't so bad"
I was around during the dark ages of the UFC thanks to his lobbying, where it was sattellite only, because of the pressure he and his constituents put on the cable companies to remove the "Human Cock Fighting" from the airwaves.
Back when we had to huddle in sportsbars in bowling alleys like lepers to watch UFC's. Back when every state and it's brother banned mma events. Back when the serious talent in MMA was forced to persue other carrers because buy rate went down, and promoters didn't have the coin to pay the top talent..
It's only lately (last few years) that MMA come around, and no thanks to him.
And it was purely a cash/beer/boxing thing. he had no answer for the arguement against the gloves that allow boxers to get pummeled into brain damage arguement, of the fact that there were hundreds of boxing deaths and no serious incedents in mma...
yep my memory goes way back...
They guy deserves respect for his miliraty record, and outside the fact that it seems that money talks in regards to his public opinion on things, he seems like a nice enough guy, but yep.... my memory goes way back...
I just have a hard time believing that it was boxing acting through him. I mean, I agree that he probably had a few guys in his ear. But if he was truly doing it on boxing's behalf, by it's request, you would have thought that he would have laid out his arguments a little bit better. It would be like hiring someone to clean your carpet, only to have the guy rub dog shit all over it. I just don't think he'd be that uneducated and argue so ignorantly if he was representing someone else, and being payed for it.
I look at it this way: If I'm a boxing insider, and I lobby to get McCain on my side, after I see that Larry King debate, I don't give that bastard another dime. If I was McCain, and I blew it the way he did, and I'm not getting anymore kickbacks, I move on. He didn't. He rode that horse for years. He's not riding it so much anymore, but that fucker's still in his stable, I'm sure.
And don't get me wrong. I'm not a big fan, and I'm by no means saying that he wasn't a threat and a pain in the ass for our sport. I'm just still unsure of his motives.
Hell, when he ran against Bush in 2000, the first thing I said was "Fuck McCain. He tried to shut down the UFC".
Bob....it would've been nice if Hitler had said that! I still dislike McCain for all of that shit, but hey, if he's changed his tune, then it's good for the sport. I think when the UFC reached Vegas, he realized that it was for real, and that his fight was over.
I couldn't resist adding to this thread.
I was reading an article on McCain a year or so ago and he is married to a woman who has HUGE interests in Budweiser beer company. Budweiser has huge stakes in boxing.If MMA took off, (like its going to),it would take advertising dollars away from boxing and Budweiser. So in a snowball effect, the McCain's would be losing money in stocks. Its just a matter of time.
Maybe Budweiser should jump on the MMA bandwagon before Miller reaps all the benefits.
David Vitkay Murder City Fight Team!!
i wish anyone was pres.
Fuck McCain and his Budweiser wife.
goku....I know how Congress works. And I'm not saying that what you think couldn't be, or even aren't, possibilities.
Aside from financial agendas, politicians also seem to act on what they consider to be their own moral agenda's. Let us not forget what Tipper Gore did for our wonderful censorship laws. I'm just saying that it's also a possibility that McCain was a huge boxing fan, with some financial ties, and he chose to take a stand against something he didn't understand, for whatever reasons. Maybe because, simply enough, he was a boxing advocate, and by opposing MMA, he thought he could easily gather support on the issue, and give himself his own platform.
Most politicians crave recognition. And from that recognition often comes more power. For some reason, the hardest thing for me to believe is that boxing lobbied McCain to take the position he did. Why McCain? Because he's a fan? Because of his ties to Budweiser?
For all I know, that could very well be what happened. I just never really understood why the hell he was so against it.
Hey BrianMeyers,
Why is it the hardest thing for you to believe??
It was probably a combination of McCain being a huge boxing fan, having big $$ in Budweiser, not to mention his wife's whole family probably has even more $$ invested.
If you think about it, if you or I were in his situation, and didn't know a damn thing about MMA, we would probably do the same thing.
Hopefully in the next 10-15 yrs, MMA will be more mainstream than boxing. Its already blowing up in California. A few more states have recently legalized mma.
David, you're combining everything into one issue.
I'm only saying that it's hard for me to believe that boxing ITSELF actually sought out, actually lobbied, for McCain to shut down the UFC and MMA.
I believe that he acted for more personal reasons, and quite possibly financial one's with his wife's ties to Budweiser. It was a package deal.
What I find hard to believe is that McCain sat down in a room with two or three top boxing executives, they threw some cash at him and, and then said "We gotta' shut down this UFC thing. Take care of us, and we'll take care of you".
Especially at the time when McCain was so outspoken about it. It was in the UFC's first few years that McCain was so opposed. I doubt very seriously that boxing considered MMA a threat any more than the Toughman shows that have been going on for years.
If McCain had started in after the UFC became sanctioned in Nevada, THEN I could see something more deviant between him and boxing officials. But that's just not the case. As MMA's popularity has grown, and major athletic associations have sanctioned it and deemed it to be safe for it's contesants, McCain has become far less outspoken against it. He's basically a non-factor at this point.
guys Budweiser sponsers boxing meaning they are putting money into it for advertising, which means they can care less if nhb becomes more popular all they will do is start sponsering nhb as well. They dont care aboput either of the sports just the advertising. So the conspiracy theory that mcain owns stock in budweiser and so he was pressured by the company and boxing and the one armed man is ridiculous. Mccain did it on his own. He was uneducated about it, thought it was brutal, and did what he did.
I guess I am combining everything in one issue. But if you think about it, it is one issue. MMA is bad for boxing and Budweiser. What if boxing ratings go way down and mma ratings go through the roof. That would hurt Budweiser and help Miller.(I saw a Miller advertisement in the middle of the octagon) Brian, I think they are the same issue. They ARE tied together.
I am not a particularly political person, I agree on some things McCain purposrts and disagree with some of his political views. In regards to his past comments he did make some good points regarding the brutal spectacle of the early UFC's. It is now regulated like boxing and a bonafide sport now so there is not much he can disagree with.
McCain is a true American Hero who showed uncommon valor during his imprionment during the Vietnam war, he is a man who lived unquestioned principles at one time ( he could have been released from his captivity much earlier if he wanted to turn his back on his country and his fellow soldiers at that time, but he didn't))....he is a survivor of extraordinary events and life circumstances, he spilled his blood and risked his life and defended the rights and freedoms you and i are priveleged to enjoy....in a way he did the sport of MMA a favor and was instrumental in it eventually moving from spectacle barbaric combat to the sanctioned sport it is today...
I agree maybe McCain isn't totally educated as to where the sport is now and has probably made some comments that were offbase. There is a possibility he was against the potential brutality of ULtimate fighting in the early days because of the physical butality he personaly experienced as a prisoner of war, violence and torture of humans of unspeakable horror of which most of us cannot possibly fathom... his military record alone warrants him at least enough respect to respect his right to disagree....he paid dearly for the right to disagree, and for yours and ours as well...