"for anyone who downplays the impact of throws, I just had a good week of 4 good training sessions on the mats. Then I fell out of a bed about 3 ft off the ground and hit cement covered by minimal carpet. My hip bone says concrete hurts... a lot. There is a lot of concrete out there in real life. The world isn't covered in mats. Those are my thoughts about it"
Excellent post!
This question reminds me of the eternal debate as to whether jiu-jitsu evolved from judo or vice versa.
My response:
Who cares? Go ahead and believe whatever you want to believe. Whatever the truth is, it really doesn't affect me. Both are fantastic and both can teach you a lot.
When you eat an egg, do you really care if the chicken or egg came first? (I don't know if that last question was incredibly insightful or incredibly stupid.)
-David Jacobs
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When you eat an egg, do you really care if the chicken or egg came first? (I don't know if that last question was incredibly insightful or incredibly stupid.)
-David Jacobs
=======
I'm pretty sure any egg you get to eat these days comes from a chicken. Unless you get to eat "The Primordial Egg". Then you can start contemplating this ultimate question.
Tomas
lol
So far, both of the men who've taught me "judo" have taught me both sport and non-sport techniques as "judo". Stuff like attacking a turtled opponent is sport, because in real life I think I'd just leave a fetal foe alone. Kicking a guy in the head or breaking a finger as an armbar opening is not for sport.
So, I'd have to disagree with that statement, MM-who-is-not-Machine-May.
I would not eat Primordial Egg,
I would not eat beak,wing or leg,
I would not eat it on tatami,
I'd let it hatch and call me mommie.
"judo is just a sport" ... like
a gun is just a few pieces of metal (or plastic if you like Glocks!
or a bullet is just some brass and lead ...
I always thought Judo was an art and a way of life. Guess it's a way to crack skulls. COOOOL DUUUUDE!
It's more like a drug to me lol
"I would not eat Primordial Egg,
I would not eat beak,wing or leg,
I would not eat it on tatami,
I'd let it hatch and call me mommie."
LOL! Good one, Quincy! Been to see "The Cat in the Hat"?
Ben R.
lol...No not yet (I say yet because you know the tikes will make me see it sooner or later) but when I wrote "I would not eat a primodial egg" it reminded me off green eggs and ham..
Yep, just like a Porsche 911GT2 is just a car.
I know it is absurd thats what makes it so great, the irony. Just trying to inject a little humor in a subject that is beaten to death. Just for the record
ancient Indian wrestlers used the gaurd, omplata, chokes, joint locks etc. which then found its way to Japan in ju jitsu then into Judo then into BJJ. Old drawings and text show the Indian fighters doing most of the modern newaza techniques including the guard in the 17th century. From this primordial martial arts soup comes the judo, sombo, bjj and mma we know today.
Joe
"--It's more like a drug to me lol ---"
Amen. And withdrawal is a killer.
I just lie in bed thinking, "I could be working on my uchimata-sumigaeshi combo right now."
And then I see this baby, crawling across the ceiling, staring down at me...
It is bullshit!
What I meant is not that Judo is bullshit, but the concept of it only being a sport is bullshit.
in response to the first post on the thread and it asks for an opinion:
I don't mind the sentence.
If Judo is so much believed around the world (or more emphasized so in America) as a sport, then is that the reason why it's not taken seriously as a martial art?
That's fine with me because I as an individual I know how it is. Most people that taste Judo for what it is knows that it's good to learn and know. John Q Public might think otherwise because they love to watch GnP all damn day and in turn learn GnP. I don't mind many others believing just part of Judo, it saves us (those who believe all of Judo) more time and space to learn rather than worry about legislation or labeled as BAD or VIOLENT. Labels suck, but I rather be seen as a non-threat because I do 'only a sport.' But that's how I see life.
Here's something to figure ego-
"How many people here want to be known as lethal weapons or mad, bad, & dangerous to know?"
LOL @ those who try to categorize Judo, Sambo, BJJ, or any other grappling arts as "merely sport"
Unfortunately, we don't have studios or PR companies dumping our "sports" onto the mainstream with cheese-ass films. Unfortunately, we don't have wannabe MA's with the last names Norris, Lee, Seagal or Van Damme pushing myths to the masses about how invincible our art is. And most unfortunate of all, we don't have flashy 360 degree super inverted spinning back kicks of death to dazzle the eye and confound the mind of the casual observer.
What we do have is the ability to utilize physics and biomechanics to their utmost degree, enabling a hundred pound man to hurl a 300 pound monster over his shoulder like he was a sack of feathers. We have the ability to dislocate, hyper extend, break, and asphyixiate any wannabe tough guy at the drop of hat. And most of all, we have the gift of visualizing combat in a realistic manner, understanding that grabbing is always superior to striking and acting accordingly.
Maybe if Judo Gene, the Gracies, Gokor, Swain, and Taktarov all got together, they could convince some Hollywood studio (probably Dimension) to make a new kind of martial arts movie....one that has moves that ACTUALLY work. Or maybe they'll pass and just make another movie about Seagal...the title will probably be "The Glitterman who is Under Siege because he is On Dangerous Ground for being Above The Law and thus Marked For Death by Exit Wounds" Catchy, ain't it? :)
Maybe then, grappling won't be "dismissed" as a "sport". Maybe.
The Judo as practiced by Kano Jigoro is seldom practiced today and is fairly obscured by the promotion of Judo as sport only, mainly by Judoka, the IJF, etc. The seven katas of Kodokan Judo are seldom seen during competition with the exception of the All Japan Judo Championships, even then, they don't show all of the kata competitors. Judo as self defence can only be effective if practiced as such, Shiai Judo and Randori are for the development of techniques that are applied to competition between Judoka, this is good and is nothing to defend against for fear of critism, boxers don't need to defend the effectiveness of their sport, nor do wrestlers, or for that matter, all other combat/ contact sports, as Judoka, one should not wish to slam anyone on their heads on concrete, that doesn't make you a Judoka, that makes you a felon, if you can effectively defend yourself, it doesn't matter what you practice, but as a Judoka, you should do so responsibly knowing that what you do, you'll have to account for. This is much more important than boasting to a practitioner of a different discipline that you're as lethal as they think they are. Judo is great, and will be greater in the years to come because Judoka are generally humble people who respect what they do and feel no need to prove to anyone how effective they are.
"one should not wish to slam anyone on their heads on concrete'. WTF? If I'm assaulted that is precisely what I wish to do. That does not make me a felon, conversely it protects me from one.
f you are going to pontificate at least keep things in context. Post morality lessons on the Holy Ground forum.