Does anyone have any tips for making the keylock work better for you from the mount or side mount, i.e. more than beeing just an annoying move that can once in a blue moon set up other moves?
First thing: do NOT lift the elbow from the ground more than 5 cm! I learned it the hard way:)
I still like the keylock... usually as a setup for kimura... from sidemount... or as a combo attack from moiunt crossface with chokes...
And sometimes get people to tap to pure keylock...
Hells yeah. I find that when I actually go for it, it's one of my highest percentage submissions.
Here are some things I make sure I do (we'll start from side mount):
1) Drive BOTH arms out of posture. Usually I kill the one under my hip with a little wiggle, driving his wrist into his shoulder or onto the mat. I make sure I maintain that as I work on the other one. With the top one, I drive it into the shoulder with my chin/side of my neck, and then onto the floor where I can get a hand on it.
2) Sometimes if I can't do that, I twist my shoulders hard towards his hips, to bring his wrist away from his body (especially if he's hugging over my body, which he obviously shouldn't be doing). This is a sweet entry I learned from Roy Harris. You have to feel it to appreciate it.
3) I pin his wrist to the ground with my forehead, so that I can be sure the weight of my upper body is keeping is arm down.
4) I put my arms in position, making sure that the one that's under his arm is EXACTLY under the elbow joint.
5) I move my forehead to the back of my own wrist, which is also good for mma/street, because it guard my face/eyes. It also forces me to KEEP my weight on his wrist as I work.
6) I shift my bellybutton over the shoulder I'm attacking, and push my weight down into the shoulder to keep it from lifting off the mat. I use my hip/thigh to continue killing his other arm and keeping it out of posture.
7) Now that my weight is pressing down on both his wrist and his shoulder, I move his wrist away from his body, bringing his arm fairly straight (this adds to the pressure in the shoulder, believe it or not).
8) To finish, it just takes a little pressure underneath his elbow to make the turn. If it doesn't happen, I walk his wrist farther down towards his hips and repeat. This keeps my weight on his arm and stops him from going anywhere while I finish.
Lastly, if I'm entering from Mount, I use the sweet entry that Roy Harris taught in his Rochester seminar back in June. It's really hard to describe it in text, but it is used for guys that keep their elbows in tight underneath the mount. It is an unstoppable method of putting your weight on the arm so it goes into "americana position."
"Sometimes if I can't do that, I twist my shoulders hard towards his hips, to bring his wrist away from his body "
I'm a bit confused. In which direction do you twist your shoulders? So that you're kind of looking at his hips or his head?
"I shift my bellybutton over the shoulder I'm attacking, and push my weight down into the shoulder to keep it from lifting off the mat. I use my hip/thigh to continue killing his other arm and keeping it out of posture. "
Wow! Isn't there a huge danger of him rolling you over him if you do that? If I understand you correctly, you are putting your bellybutton on top of his left shoulder if you're keylocking his left arm, right? I would personally feel off balance even putting my bellybutton over his NEAR shoulder, i.e. his right!
"Now that my weight is pressing down on both his wrist and his shoulder, I move his wrist away from his body, bringing his arm fairly straight (this adds to the pressure in the shoulder, believe it or not).
I think I know this move. It's when he defends the "normal" keylock by straightening his arm and you basically pin his wrist to the mat and lift your elbow up that's under his elbow and lean your shoulders towards his head. Do you find this move to be higher percentage than the normal keylock?
"To finish, it just takes a little pressure underneath his elbow to make the turn. If it doesn't happen, I walk his wrist farther down towards his hips and repeat."
I know another counter to when he stretches out his arm in the keylock: Slide his wrist UP towards his head (actually not up in the air, but parallell to the ground like he's raising his hand up to ask a question). Then move his arm back down but in the normal keylock position, with his arm bent this time.
"It's really hard to describe it in text, but it is used for guys that keep their elbows in tight underneath the mount. It is an unstoppable method of putting your weight on the arm so it goes into "americana position."
An unstoppable, but hard to describe way to get the keylock from the mount? Now you KNOW you gotta tell, dude! lol :)
Hi again jonpall,
1) I twist my shoulders towards his hips.
2) YES, I put my bellybutton on the shoulder that I am attacking. YES, it doesn't feel like the mount/sidemount any more. NO, I am not worried about being rolled. I have my head and elbows on the ground, and his arms are killed.
3) WHen I say that I bring his arm fairly straight, I'm NOT talking about a straight armlock. I am STILL getting a bent armlock (with twisting pressure on the shoulder). But I am performing it with his hand very, very far away from his shoulder. It's more like the next thing you address, with "raising his hand."
4) Here's something to remember about the shoulder: when it's palm up, he loses the ability to put his hand behind his body as the elbow comes towards the hip. When it's palm down, he loses the ability to put his hand behind his body as the elbow comes towards the ear. That sounds muddy, but try this:
hold up your arm like someone is doing an americana on you. raise your elbow over your head and bring your hand behind your head (do this now). Now hold your elbow at shoulder height and do the same thing. (do this). Now touch your elbow to your hip and try to do the same.
Now, while we're doing this, turn your arm palm-down. Hammerlock yourself low on your back. Now put your elbow at shoulder height and try to put your hand behind your back (like someone is kimura-ing you). Now touch your tricep to your ear and try to bring your hand behind your back.
Lesson: Tension in the shoulder relates directly to elbow height.
So when you do an americana, the tension mounts as you bring the elbow towards the hip (likewise with the kimura, and towards the ear).
5) Yeah, Yeah, I know :-) I've opened the box, but I really can't describe it in a way that does it justice. Everyone will go "huh?" and think I'm a moron. :-)
We already think you're a moron. Tell us!
ps. Just kidding on the moron thing.
Good tips, Twinkletoes. Any for doing it from mount?
If you're worried about getting rolled over once your belly button is on his shoulder, make sure you drop your hips completely, and sprawl back. This will keep his shoulder pinned. If you come to your knees or too far forward, you'll get turned.
From mount, something that's not only helped with my mount control, but setting up subs/transitions is pinning one arm straight out, far away from his body as soon as you get there. It makes it MUCH harder for him to escape, and enables you to go for the keylock pretty easily (though most of the time, he'll defend and you'll get his back.
JR, It's not really the moron thing. I have a new toy and I'm not ready to share it with others yet. Let me bust it out at a few tourneys before I start telling everyone on the internet about it ;-)
I mean, plenty of other people could've gone to that seminar, which was totally sweeeeeeet.
I'm not Twinkletoes, but here is what I like to do with my mounted kimuras:
1 - secure the Kimura grip (e.g. wrap his left arm with my left arm, gripping his left wrist with my left hand).
2 - put my head on the ground at about 1 o'clock, crank a bit on the arm so that his head comes off the ground (my left leg is usually straight at this point, pointing off to about 8 o'clock).
3 - bring my left leg under his head (my right leg is still alongside his body)
4 - roll over towards my right side, pulling his head over with my left leg
5 - I end up on my back, with his arm kimura'd, my left leg across the back of his neck and my right leg across his back.
twist the wrist....grabbing at the hand.
if attacking your opponent's right arm. grab the hand/wrist with fingers on the meat of the lower thumb...then twist like the accelerator on a motorcycle. then..follow any of the explanations above. it'll get the guy to tap 67-70% sooner, regardless of your choice of application from those above.
get Roy Harris' Armlock #2...the whole tape is devoted to the bent arm lock...i even think it's on sale...
The best tip is to use the twist on the hand. Tony C shows this on his catch tapes. It will greatly improve your finish. Just work on setting it up and keeping control.
Pull his elbow as close as you can to his side. Don't lift his elbow up much, and torque. Also, when in place and about to execute the move, straighten your body out, laying chest to chest (wait on chest), and finish. Also, it's not a good idea to try this move from mount. Most of the time, you'll get rolled.