I thought everyone still hated Larry Holmes
He beat better fighters than Ken Norton and Earnie Shavers? Heck, he didn't even beat better fighters than Tony Tucker or James Tillis.
Portuguese2002, who the hell is "jackson"? Do you mean Jack Johnson?
Anyway, this is a whole other debate but Evander is the best heavyweight of his era, not Tyson and not Lewis. Evander will never get the credit but he was the best fighter of his era in the heavyweight division.
buddie
Rahman lost to Ruiz, got knocked out of the ring by Maskaev and hasn't won a fight in almost three years. I would say he's a journeyman.
homie I am not trying to minimize anything. I have never really liked Lewis much but IMO you cannot be so shortsighted that you judge him based on those two fights. You cannot argue that he bashed Klitsko's face as if he used a baseball bat. Some people act as if Klitsko was never even hit and his corner accidentally cut him while applying vaseline. Lewis smashed his face like a vegetable. His face was one of the worst smash jobs I have seen and they were all legit shots.
what I judge him by is that he seems incapable of winning a boxing match without cheating. The headlock on Grant, the shoving Tyson down after every punch, the takedown on Klitchko, etc. Wouldn't it be nice to have a boxing champ that wins with boxing?
Vitali's face cut because he has weak skin. We have all seen Lewis hit opponents harder and more often than he hit Vitali on that night and their faces never looked anywhere near as bad. Don't try to make it sound like Lewis was giving him a horrible beating; Vitali was the one winning the rounds.
"Evander will never get the credit but he was the best fighter of his era in the heavyweight division."
Evander's legacy imo is that he was a cruiser that came up and had great success at HW, but he is def not the best hw of this era...
So Jason, I guess you must absolute HATE Hopkins...
Funny how after he pushed Tyson, tyson couldn't do anything...that was one heck of a shove!! Get real...he did him a favor...
Vitali was winning the rounds....but Lewis had him rocked in the last round badly....and the fight was turning...
"Don't try to make it sound like Lewis was giving him a horrible beating; Vitali was the one winning the rounds."
Respect Stocky, but the facts are the facts. I HATE Lewis for his apathy, and prefer watching VK, but an old and out of shape Lewis beat Vitali on possibly the greatest night he'll have. Punching your opponents face so hard that the skin splits open forcing a stoppage is a legit way to win a fight. And his cuts were very bad. If they had fought again, I'd bet money that Lewis would smash him with ease.
BTW props to VT to the comments he made regarding Lewis' retirement...
"My goal now is to win the WBC heavyweight championship against whoever they want me to fight," stated WBC #1 heavyweight Vitali Klitschko after hearing the announcement today that heavyweight champion Lennox Lewis was retiring. "I am sad to hear that Lennox Lewis has decided to retire, but I respect him for his decision. Lennox was one of the greatest heavyweight champions of all time and I am very proud and honored to say that I was able to fight him. I know I had him on the ropes and almost beat him, but my cuts stopped me. On a personal level, I am disappointed, like the millions of boxing fans, that there will not be a rematch between Lennox and myself. I wish him all the best, however, in whatever he decides to do in the future. Lennox was a credit to the sport for many, many years and his presence will be missed."
Where's santroy??????
I have no problem with Lewis retiring. A rematch with Klitschko is the best fight in the division by far but I wouldn't mind seeing V. Klitschko v Sanders.
It's starting to look like DK's gonna get the Heavyweight belts on lock down again. The rumor is both Klits will be signing with DK and he already has Ruiz, Byrd, and Sanders under contract.
I pray that Dominick Guinn is as good as I think he is.
"Funny how after he pushed Tyson, tyson couldn't do anything...that was one heck of a shove!! Get real...he did him a favor..."
Actually the first time he shoved Tyson Lennox was penalized a point
"Do the names Jack Dempsey, Rocky Marciano, Muhammad Ali, Mike Tyson and Evander Holyfield mean anything to you? Those guys alone could be somebody's top 5 and they all make Lennox seem like an innocent school girl in the ring. "
I'm not being hypocritical. One of the main reasons I don't like Ali is that he cheated. But even Ali would fight clean sometimes. Holyfield fought clean sometimes. All those guys you mentioned could beat a guy without cheating.
I have every single one of Lennox's pro fights, and he cheats in all of them except the ones where he KO's the guy in the 1rst or second round, and he cheats in some of those too. Its ridiculous. His corner even tells him to cheat, like in the Tyson fight. Its obvious that he feels like its a part of his boxing ability.
Regarding VT's comments on Lewis: only an idiot would run down a man who beat him. If Lennox is the greatest boxer in history, then its ok that Vitali lost a close match. If Vitali were to say that Lennox is a suck ass loser, then it just makes Vitali look worse.
so...you hate MAB too?
everyone, every single boxing analyst, writer, heavyweight fighter etc etc will tell you that Evander was much worse than Lennox...but i could care less about that also...its not sewing here....
I agree about your comment about VT's comments though...he knows a lot of people think it was close or that he was winning...
The fact of the matter is the man's record speaks for himself. He's beat the hell out of the best heavyweight boxers for years. His only two losses were both avenged. He's beaten so many former champions, Tyson, Holyfield,Briggs and KOed Riddick Bowe before he became champion. Give this man some credit damn. Why does he have to fight Vitali? He cut him up like a Christmas turkey last fight. I'm gonna miss seeing him go. 'Cause he won me ALOT of money.
Why?
Slick is correct about Bowe.
That was a horrible stoppage, Bowe had Lewis in just as much trouble in the first round.
"its not sewing here.... "
NO, its not. Its boxing. Which means its not wrestling or Muay Thai, so Lennox needs to leave out the headlocks, double legs, etc and just stick to boxing
"The fact of the matter is the man's record speaks for himself. He's beat the hell out of the best heavyweight boxers for years"
Actually, no. He beat Holyfield, once. Other than that, Lennox never beat anyone who was one of the "best" HWs. Tyson was beyond washed up when Lennox had to cheat his way to a victory over him. Lennox's epic pair of fights with Rahman, who he is 1-1 against, would have been more impressive if Rahman didn't lose to everyone he's fought since. Lennox never avenged his loss to McCall, not that I blame him for that
And I don't like MAB either
hater I agree that Bowe had Lewis hurt in the first but Riddick IMO was done when it was stopped. At that point in his life Riddick had never proven that he had the heart to get up from that and IMO he would not have. I think Bowe was done at that point.
Just read an ESPN article that said that Lewis cemented his legacy as one of the best ever by beating Tyson. Anybody that says that has no right talking about boxing.
Beyond that what did Lewis ever do? In my opinion he split 2 fights with a waaay over the hill Holyfield. He had good wins over Razor Ruddock and Tua. And he lost to mediocre Rahman, and got murdered by pretty much a clubfighter in McCall. He also definitely lost that fight to Ray Mercer, who is also not a great fighter.
What wins did he ever have to make up for such terrible losses? None. And yet people want to rank him among the all-time greats. That's fascinating.
tapout, you're talking crazy. Holyfield beat Bowe as a pro, which is something Lennox never did. Holy beat Quawi, he beat Foreman, he beat lots of guys. Yeah, Tyson was past prime when Holy beat him, but no where near as bad as when Lennox faced Tyson.
Say what you want to about Tyson and Holyfield and Holmes and their level of opposition, but all of those guys cleaned out their divisions. Lennox never faced Bowe, never faced Tyson while Tyson was decent, is now ducking a rematch with Klitchko, never faced RJJ, never faced Wlad, on and on. Tyson fought everyone who was out there for him when he was 18-22, period. Holmes fought everyone who was out there for him, period, and Norton, Shavers, Cooney, etc were all tough guys.