Major Nation wide changes coming for ammy MMA?

So it appears there is going to be a nation wide push to change ammy MMA. New rules like shin pads and possibly head gear, no strikes to head of downed opponent (including punches), heavier gloves, and making some subs illegal (leg locks like heel hooks and knee bars for example). Anyone in the know have more info? I have head rumors of this before, but it appears it is close now.

I think this will kill ammy MMA and push many people to turn pro early or skip ammy all together. Head gear and shin pads will make grappling very difficult. No strikes to head on ground? Limiting subs? Looks like they trying to make ammy MMA a kickboxing match to me. Terrible.

I have not seen a significant issue with medial reason for these changes so why are they doing this? And also, what federal body would have the authority to tell state commission what their rules should be in regard to ammy MMA.

Interested in other's thoughts and insight on this issue.

That's how ammy mma should have been all along.

If you think adding headgear and shin pads while outlawing strikes on the ground won't ruin ammy MMA then you are crazy. It will basically kill the ground game.

 this sucks! how the guys gonna get reay for real pro fights fighting like yhis?


 I like it. It makes zero sense to have "ammy" fights with the exact same rules the pros have (except for the round times of course.)



As it stands now ammy MMA only serves to benefit the promotors by letting them fill a card at a substantially lower payroll. If fans don't want to watch guys fight with headgear, shin pads, and more restrictive rule sets, then they will stop paying for it and you'll only see it at smoker type events.

Larry,

Fighters have been doing that in Japan for ages. Every legend you have seen fight in MMA out of Japan fought this way as an amateur for a long time. Amateur fights out there are held in the bigger gyms and year end tournament is usually held at a larger high school gym. Fighters from Shooto for example must graduate from the amateur ranks before turning pro. This does not apply to foreigners but all Japanese fighters must go through this progression. Shooto decides when they are ready to turn pro or they can win the year end All Japan amateur tournament and turn pro that way. Fighters like Gomi, Okami, Sakurai, Uno, Kid Yamamoto, Takaya etc etc all fought this way before turning pro. Amatuer MMA should not be a for profit venture. It should be about helping fighters prepare for pro fights without having to risk the severe injuires and head trauma of a pro fighter without getting paid. It's amazing that fighters let you manage them.

"If you think adding headgear and shin pads while outlawing strikes on the ground won't ruin ammy MMA then you are crazy. It will basically kill the ground game."

Shooto, Pancrase, ZST and every org in Japan has had ammy rules exactly like this for many years. It doesn't kill the ground game at all. Most of their ammy shows are free to attend as well.

Here is a highlight video from the All Japan Amatuer Shooto Championships 2010.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ab7sNbvsidg

Can you grapple with pads on? Sure, but it makes it significantly more difficult and changes it dramatically. Just doing BJJ with wrestling headgear completely alters you peripheral senses and completely changes all sub attacks involving the head and neck. Using bulkier striking headgear only worses the problem. Shin pads make it more difficult to get the hooks in among other things.

Japan has been doing it, ok I get that but still haven't seen a good argument why the US should change their rules. Lots of things are done differently in other places but that doesn't mean it is "right." Have there been significant injuries in ammy MMA that warranted the change? Will these rules changes help if there is such an issue (that to my knowledge doesn't exist)?

Have an issue with promoters and how they treat ammys? Then fix that issue, instead of changing it so that fewer promotions exist and less people go to watch.

Again, there are so many issues with MMA including judging and scoring that should be addressed first instead of fixing something that isn't broken IMHO. The first thing that should be addressed in ammy MMA is the match making and making sure people who step in the cage belong there in the first place.

Amateur MMA should have way more safeguards than pro fights. Most amatuer shows in the U.S. are pro fights where no one gets paid. It's not about making fighters better. Fighters take the same beatings in amateur shows that the pros do. Phone Post

"Japan has been doing it, ok I get that but still haven't seen a good argument why the US should change their rules."

How about because they have the best running and most successful amateur circuit in the world when it comes to training and producing pro fighters? They have been doing it since the 90s. Phone Post

" Then fix that issue, instead of changing it so that fewer promotions exist and less people go to watch."

This the problem with your mentality. Amateur fighting should not be about how many promotions there are or who is going to watch. It's strictly about helping fighters get better without taking the higher risks of a pro fight. Phone Post

Magnum TA - Amateur MMA should have way more safeguards than pro fights. Most amatuer shows in the U.S. are pro fights where no one gets paid. It's not about making fighters better. Fighters take the same beatings in amateur shows that the pros do. <img src="/images/phone/post_tag.png" alt="Phone Post" border="0" style="vertical-align:middle;"/>


Again, is there a significant health or safety issue with ammy MMA? If so, show me the numbers and show me where the new changes will fix that. You don't like that pros get paid and ammys don't? Then fix that, but don't completly alter a sport to fix something that isn't broken.

Amatuer MMA in my opinion is a place for guys to fight on the big stage to get ready for their pro career. You can lose in ammy MMA and those loses won't affect your pro future. If you can show me that their is a significant problem with ammy MMA in regards to their safety and that the new changes will fix it, then I will listen. I just don't see that being the case.

The real problem in regard to the safety of the ammy fighters is when the commissions allow guys with huge gaps in ability to fight each other. That is when someone gets hurt. The other main issue is refs in the cage that don't belong in there. They are the ones looking out for the welfare of the fighters and if they don't really understand MMA, then they are the one's that are more likely to get someone hurt, not the fact that an ammy fighter is wearing shin pads or not.

Magnum TA - "Japan has been doing it, ok I get that but still haven't seen a good argument why the US should change their rules."How about because they have the best running and most successful amateur circuit in the world when it comes to training and producing pro fighters? They have been doing it since the 90s. <img src="/images/phone/post_tag.png" alt="Phone Post" border="0" style="vertical-align:middle;"/>


I think this is highly debatable. How are you judging that they are the "most successful" in the world? Numbers of fighters? How good they are once they turn pro? What?

Just because they have been doing ammy MMA for 2 decades the way they do it doesn't mean all of the rules they have in place make their ammy MMA better than what is currently done in the US. Maybe it is their ammy rules that explain why they do so poorly once their fighters make their way to the US. Just a thought.

So again, because Japan has been doing ammy MMA their way for a long time, that is not justification for the new rules that are currently being proposed in the US.

"You can lose in ammy MMA and those loses won't affect your pro future."

You can also take the same career shortening beatings that a pro does. Every beating you take shortens your fighting career. That should not be happening in the amateurs. Guys get fucked up in amateur fights all the time because they are the same as pro fights in the U.S. It's not about making fights better, just profit. Phone Post

Magnum TA - " Then fix that issue, instead of changing it so that fewer promotions exist and less people go to watch."This the problem with your mentality. Amateur fighting should not be about how many promotions there are or who is going to watch. It's strictly about helping fighters get better without taking the higher risks of a pro fight. <img src="/images/phone/post_tag.png" alt="Phone Post" border="0" style="vertical-align:middle;"/>


I really don't care how many promotions are out their and I have a huge problem with promotors and match makers just throwing two guys in the cage because they are the same weight with no regard to their ability. I don't know many MMA shows I have been to where the 5-0 fighter from a good gym is matched up with the overwight guy who trains himself that walks out in swim trunks for his MMA debut. This is the problem, not if a fighter is wearing shin pads or not.

I think ammy MMA is there to get guys ready for pro fights. They can lose and not worry about it going on their record when they are a pro. Fighters can fight in an ammy show and develope their game until they are ready to turn pro. To comepletely alter ammy MMA so that it is nothing like pro MMA will not get them ready to fight pro. Only allowing body punches on the ground? Limiting subs? Grappling with bulky head gear and shin pads and possibly bigger golves or even boxing gloves. Talk of standing 8 counts? All of these things will not help someone get ready for pro MMA. All it will do is cause people to skip ammy MMA and go straight to pro. That is a bad thing all the way around.

Do you feel the same way about college football? Those guys take a beating and don't get paid. They have injuries that at times completely end their careers before they even get a chance to turn pro. Maybe we should have them play flag football until they make it to the NFL. That way they can still get ready for pros but avoid most risk to them. Flag football gets you ready for NFL football right? Flag football is basically the same thing, right? College football isn't about making players better, just profit.

They are getting a free college education. Something many people in this world would love to have. What are amateur MMA fighters getting.....nothing Phone Post

"To comepletely alter ammy MMA so that it is nothing like pro MMA will not get them ready to fight pro."

Some MMA legends have proven this wrong. Like I said every shooto great out of Japan did it already. Phone Post

It sounds to me like you have a personal stake in this issue. Nothing I say will make you feel differently. Phone Post