Just curious how many people have been trained or certified to judge and what was the training like? Was it done by an actual muayThai sanctioning body or a kickboxing sanctioning body?
Were you instructed to score muayThai specifically or a fight in general?
Often, we see results and question the outcome...if scored under the rules of muayThai versus kickboxing, the outcomes might be different. Often leaving fighters, trainers and spectators upset or at least confused by the result.
In Ontario, there is an attempt to get everyone all on the same page with CAMTAO as a sanctioning body. On their webpage is a set of CAMTAO rules for amateur Muay Thai. Follow the "forms" link for the .pdf
I have yet to judge for CAMTAO, however I have judged for the Quebec amatuer MT sancitioning body. We were instructed to judge based on a standard 10 point must, with 10-9 being slight advantage, 10-8 definite advantage, etc... It starts to get dicey due to the subjectivity of "general look" of the round. IE: Were the skills being displayed "Muay Thai" based? If so, what is one's definintion of MT?
Recently one of my fighters lost a close decision because she was being punched overtop her kicks. This was only a possibility because under the rules we were fighting in, the combatants wore chest guards and shinpads. "Taking" the kick was a viable option in order to drop a straight right in. However, in the "spirit" of MT, this is not really a possibility. You don't "take" a kick with a bare shin into your bare ribs. Anyways, the decision went the other way, and we were left scratching our heads after the decision...
Awesome - Tony is the king.
This is an invaluable resource to have!
•A boxer hits their opponent with a punch that cleanly hits the target
•Their opponent hits back with a kick that cleanly hits the body
•Who scores?
•The kicker!
•Although punches have the same potential to score as kicks or knees, in practice they often don't
•For a punch to score it has to land on target and show a visual effect
•Equally, Kicks that are "flicked" like those used in Karate or Taekwondo or where a boxer falls backward don't score either
•Clean kicks and knees to the body are considered to be more effective than a cleanly landed punch unless the punch shows real a effect
To judge the art of MuayThai…you need to know the art of MuayThai
Thanks RD... a good find.
When I was in Bangkok, some organization was offering a judging and refereeing course. I was hesitant about its legitimacy, but I remember thinking it was endorsed by somebody... I just can't remember who!
Has anyone attended this course? I'm thinking of making time for it on my next trip in August (although I never got around to it in the 8 months I was there last time...)
Was it the IFMA (amateur arm of the WMC)? I took it last November.
Syllabus:
REFEREE AND JUDGE COURSE
| Number of hours |  20 hours |
| Number of participants | 50 people |
| Course Objectives : | 1. To comprehend roles and duties of judge and referee 2. To comprehend the rules of the competition 3. To learn and practice the skills of signals and commands |
| Course Contents : | 1. The Role and functions of Judge and Referee 2. Signaling; Commands, and Fouls demonstration 3. Processes to be performed as Judge and as referee in the ring 4. Moral, Ethics and Codes of Ethics of the Judges and Referees |
| Teaching Methods : | 1. Demonstration 2. Teaching Aids 3. Visitation of the real fights at Lumpinee and Rajdamnern Boxing Stadium |
| Evaluation | 1. Participation 2. Ability of Judge/Referee performances |
| Remarks | Every candidate must bring along a referee/judge suit. |
Was that in Bangkok Pisand? Looks about right. The think that is throwing it for me, is I believe somebody was handing out a flyer ouside of Lumpini, or it was at the windy store...
Yes. It was running in Bangkok at the IFMAs 2004, in the mornings before the fights.
Ironic that Tony just posted this up regarding the UK scene...after recent promotions, I think we have similar problems in the US. Fairly analogous since depending on where you fight, for whom and who judges you can get very different results. We lack the conformity to the Thai rules and uniformity across promotions.
TONY wrote:
There have been a few decisions given at shows recently that seem to underline the lack of understanding of MuayThai scoring by many judges' in the
Let me illustrate this with an analogy using another sport. Say that soccer coaches and players weren't really sure about how you score in soccer. Sometimes they would turn up to a match and they got a goal for kicking the ball through the nets, yet in other matches if they retained possession longer than the opposition they would be declared the winner; irrespective of goals scored. In other matches perhaps teams were awarded a victory by fouling the other team more frequently. Given this scenario would soccer be as developed as it is now? Certainly not, it would be a shambles with coaches and players guessing what they needed to train for to win. This situation sounds totally ridiculous and in the real world would be ridiculous and damaging for the sport. But this is what it is like in MuayThai in the
For example, I have heard coaches in the corner saying to fighters to kick or knee the legs because it scores more and even to forget trying to kick the body kicks and throw loads of punches instead. When although leg kicks, if effective, can win fights by stoppage as can combination punching attacks, they certainly don't score that well unless really effective, certainly not on a level with body kicks or knees. A fighter and coach should know if they are winning or losing throughout the fight, so they can adjust strategies to continue a successful game plan. This is the case generally in
So what is the way forward? A number of individuals and groups do attend training workshops and courses for judging and then shadow judge. This system works well if the course is reasonable and those judges that trainees' shadow understands the sport well. Unfortunately, there are not that many judges I personally could guarantee really understand the sport well enough to mentor new judges. By understanding the sport well enough I mean a judge who could go to a show at Lumpinee or Rajadamnern and in 90% of the fights come up with the same decision as the judges; the 10% error being for very close fights. Any ideas would be welcome.