Officer kills homeless man who wouldn't put down crowbar

Only two kinds of people will walk toward someone with a weapon in their hand, towards a cop: Those who want to die by cop and those who are mentally ill.

I’m sure that I am in the minority when I say an old man with a crowbar should be able to be easily disarmed by a who are trained to do these things.

Shut up, faggot.

Right, people think riot gear is scary looking, and thats a problem in its own way, but it’s kind of a dumb thing to have a problem with compared to having them put someone down like a dog and would have worked in this situation, no? Isnt that perception the lesser of 2 evils, especially if PDs or the government in some way tries to socialize that they are doing it to protect people and not to harm them?

Counter point- if you produce a deadly weapon and advance on a police officer, who gives you multiple lawful orders to drop the weapon and tells you that failure to comply will result in being shot, you have forfeited your expectation of not being shot. The suspect chose the outcome during multiple points and bares responsibly for the outcome.

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I’m a huge advocate of practical police gear. I have no idea how to overcome the political and bureaucratic hurdles preventing it in most cases.

Appearance means more to politicians than the actual reality of the matter.

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A lot of people have chimed in and tried to put themselves in the officer’s shoes, saying they wouldn’t shoot or that they feel like they could easily disarm the suspect. But let me ask this. Put yourself in the suspect’s shoes and imagine you have a rap sheet a mile long that includes violent crimes against police. So many in fact that the first officer on scene knows you by name. You strike multiple unattended vehicles with a crowbar, another officer shows up, you verbalize that you intend to strike him, he backs up and points his gun at you. He tells you repeatedly to drop the weapon and that if you don’t, you’ll be shot. You raise the weapon. Do you think you have a reasonable expectation, under the best circumstances of not being shot?


Well, thats a starting point for things we can agree on, then. To me, if the 2 most important goals are keeping the officer safe and preserving life, riot gear or similar on the cop for this kind of situation is a practical answer that works. In other words, with updates to equipment and/or procedure, this death COULD HAVE been avoided, no?

And for those who are saying that by ignoring lawful orders and warnings, this guy is forfeiting his right to complain about getting shot, sure, thats true, but a)he has reduced capacity for logic and rational action, and b)we arent just trying to preserve his life for HIS benefit, but for the cop’s benefit and that of the general public and their trust.

I mean, you think its healthy for or fair to a cop when someone uses them to commit suicide?

Convinced me of what? You just got done explaining that thousands upon thousands of similar incidents like this are handled without leading to executions. I agreed with you.

You can’t argue both sides. You can’t point out what a great job most cops do in similar situations, and also defend this cop who did his job badly.

According to FBI stats, random heavy objects kill more people than guns. And “Deadly Weapon” has a pretty specific legal meaning that this clearly falls under…


As has been stated previously in this thread, the taser is not a reliable method of stopping an advancing suspect. Engaging in hand-to-hand combat is also not a guaranteed method of preventing the suspect from murdering you with a crowbar.

Now we’re going to see if I’m too stupid to post a Youtube video. I’m aware they keep saying “knife” and the direction of force is different with a crowbar. I’m also aware the officer already has his weapon drawn as the suspect is advancing.

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Honestly, I think tasers should be considered a failed experiment. They seem to be unreliable at stopping people, thus endangering cops, while still occasionally resulting in death of the target.

Since I got some agreement from LakerUp that riot gear could have protected both cop and perpetrator in the above case, doesnt that seem like a better option than killing the guy and a good policy for cops to adopt? I mean, the only thing you have to overcome is that people perceive it as militaristic, and while its sort of absurd that people dont realize it prevents cops from having to kill people, maybe they can print some nice messages on their gear or make it pink and fluffy or something.

See it his is where reason, logic and feelings part ways. I think the helmet crack was meant facetiously, but a lot of people in today’s climate might actually think that’s a great suggestion. Never mind that if Police Departments proactively did this, they’d be criticized for “becoming militarized.” The problem isn’t the people hitting the cops with sticks and crowbars, it’s the cops failing to wear a helmet. It’s a constant moving goalpost in a lot of ways with modern critics, “yeah he had a crowbar, but he couldn’t swing it. Oh, he already swung it at a bunch of cars? Well he’s obviously not able to think. Oh he has already been arrested a million times for crimes that require a men’s tea of “knowingly”, oh well the cops should have worn a helmet.


I agree with you buddie for the most part. I guess my issue was profiling the suspect. For a stupid example, if that bum were a 10 yr old boy with a crowbar, on paper it would be the same scenerio, but you’d hope the cop would concider the threat as less and handle it accordingly. I suppose i under-profiled the suspect as harmless and assumed the cop was physically stronger with combat training to to disarm him. But i realize it places the cop in a more dangerous position with too many unknowns

That looked like a bad shoot from a cop,

“OH YEAH??? Here’s a video of a blonde bimbo reporter panicking and firing at people! How about THAT??”

That’s…not a response.

thats why the police tell you to drop whatever it is first

yes this is a stupid example. not the same on paper. a 10 year old will not have near the same strength, speed, and coordination making him much much less of a threat