Ok, whats the deal w (Vannest)?

I've seen some posts about him and Lonnie etc...
what happend and wtf is going on???

Lonnie promoted Jonas, who in turn promoted Vannest. Jonas's skills are apparently only purple belt level (both in knowledge and actual ability), which is why the black belt promotion is even more puzzling. That's the only real question that hasn't been answered yet. Now Lonnie's taken the promotion back and put Jonas at purple belt. All the while, he's been trying to get back with Rigan Machado after being promoted by Joe Moreira.

fucking incredible
So how much $$$ did he get to promote this dude??

I don't know what's the deal with this guy, but his dvd was pretty solid. I actually like it.

Who are these people?

I'll need to remember to stay away from them.

Honestly, for as much shit a Simco takes these days. He is nowhere near as despicable as these guys. He may, as people have said, searching for someone to promote him, but these guys are all frauds. Joe Moreira too, he is a legit guy, but is involved in nearly every fake blackbelt story I ever hear. I have heard of tons of TMA school owners, going to Learn BJJ in 24 hour courses, to be certified to teach bjj.

Early next year, I will open a school, put up a karate sign and put on a blackbelt. Let's see how these frauds react when a BJJ guy who never learned karate opens a school and labels himself as grandmaster. I will have an open challenge too, any of these TMA grandmasters can stop by and challenge me.

I am in agreement with Louco, Simco has an instructor for every belt (even a couple per belt in some cases). These guys have no legit belt history at all. They are the the new definition of shameless in the dictionary (at least this Cavileer guy is). Check out the saw-jj.com website, Jonus is not taking off the black belt.

I'm doing my best to educate Jonas on that forum, but he just isnt getting it. That's too bad because I thought he was just innocently involved in this.

andre, good work on that forum! I've been reading the thread and although you are being very respectful he isn't giving you an inch. On his post on that forum he states he has received the various BJJ belts however he isn't being specific as to who gave them to him aside from mentioning that one guy (Tice I believe?) who is only a brown belt now, which makes no sense.

if Tice is Now a brown belt, then he was a purple belt when Jonas got his BB, which means - with Tice's instructor's permission, he would have been able to give Jonas a blue belt. i know some purples who are allowed to promote to blue with their instructor's permission. Jonas was a white belt in WV in mid-2004 at a Royce seminar and asked to test for his blue. he was granted permssion to test for his blue, but did not show up the following day to test. he was a white belt in BJJ jan/feb 2005 when i spoke with him as well.

Andre, you have been beyond patient with these two fucking frauds! Neither Vannest nor Jonas deserve ANY credit for "clearing things up" and coming forward with their explanations. They are both scum bags looking to find someone who will "recognize" them as BJJ BBs...w/o the inconvenience of having to train in BJJ! Both are pathetic and despicable. Finally, Lonnie's explanation/apology makes no sense whatsoever. He is only sorry this blew up in his face and he wants it to go away! I find Lonnie's actions on par with the other two birds. They ALL were knowingly pulling a scam, and are continuing to pull that same scam as we speak. Integrity, honor, honesty are not qualities any of these individuals possess. They deserve all the heat they have brought upon themeselves. ANY legititmate bjj instructor that has ANYTHING to do with any of these individuals is crazy!

Well said, Tysaw.

"he was a white belt in BJJ jan/feb 2005 when i spoke with him as well. "

Holy shit!! I didn't realize how messed up this all was until I saw that. White-Black in a year? What a joke. How can he look himself in the mirror? And the instructor that gave it to him..... he is a disgrace.

Speculation: I think that the big guy (is this Vannest or Jonus?) was training with Lonnie and caught him due to size, perhaps training lapses, whatever and Lonnie gave him his black belt due to this. Perhaps that is what happened with Vannest as well he was catching the other guy.

I am trying to rap my head around this, but I can't quite do it.

Nice posts on their forum Andre. I hope you can impart some sense in this.

Thanks. It is like talking to a rock.

andreh - nice work on SAW-JJ. im tired of typing for now. maybe after the holidays, i'll concern myself some more, but for now... i need some rest. did you guys see in the videos clip, Jonas is wearing a torn up belt (is it brown?)?

bsktrap - jan/feb 2005 he was white... March 2005 he got his BB. that's white to black in ONE MONTH, not one year bro

chris o. - Jonas and Lonnie are not telling us something...

"Speculation: I think that the big guy (is this Vannest or Jonus?) was training with Lonnie and caught him due to size, perhaps training lapses, whatever and Lonnie gave him his black belt due to this. Perhaps that is what happened with Vannest as well he was catching the other guy. "

The big guy is Jonas and Vannest posted he has never trained with Lonnie, he claims he was given his BB over the phone.

Actually Vannest claimed Lonnie "recognized" him as a blackbelt but Jonas is the one who promoted him to blackbelt.

It's amazing how they claim to not care about BJJ and that SAW-JJ extends far beyond BJJ, but then they insist on trying to circumvent the system and want desperatly to be recognized as BJJ black belts.

The only thing they've accomplished is to be recognized as frauds. I think they're spending more energy trying to get over than if they just pursued it in the correct manner.

If Tice gave him his blue and purple as he claims then Tice would need a black belts permission because he himself is not a black belt.

I am only a purple but my instructor has authorized me to promote my students and he in turn presents them with the rank. I only have one blue belt though.

Equally disturbing is how they talk about Lonnie being a piece of shit but Jonas still wants to be his black belt, even after Lonnie took it back! WTF? You couldn't write a goofier script.

Sounds like WV needs some legit guys.


lonnie accepts what he deserves. he knows he screwed up and he is very sorry.

in my opinion, lonnie was caught at a low point and made some very bad mistakes and terrible misjudgements. again he is willing to accept all that he is said about him. he know he deserves this sh*t talking about him.

this is no excuse for what he did but lonnie at that time in point, was very frustrated with the bjj community and he just did whatever without really understanding the consequences of his actions. there was no shadiness. lonnie was vunerable, stupid and guillible.

again he realizes his mistake, apologizes to the bjj community and is trying to correct his mistake. he knows he has damaged the bjj intergrity and he can only do what he can do.

so now all he can do is continue training his students and continue to improve his own bjj skills. he is proud of his current students and will continue to train them to the best of his ability

he will now only promote his own students and will never promote anyone outside of his own students.

like andre said, jonas should not have accepted a BB belt with anyone for only training with them for 2 days. that is ridiculous. and it was not an intensive evaluation. they were just training.

i hope jonas and dave will find another bjj instructor and train with them for a while before they accept any promotion.

move on folks...