Pope goes FULL COMMIE

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/amp/world-asia-china-42914029


China, the Vatican and a controversial deal

 04 February 2018 China

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Image captionPope Francis says he would like to visit China

China and the Vatican are close to reaching a historic deal regarding the appointment of bishops, according to media reports.

An agreement could be signed in a few months, said a senior Vatican source. If reached, it would be a breakthrough in relations for both parties.

But what exactly is in the pipeline and what would it mean for the country's 10 million Catholics?

What are relations between China and the Vatican like?

Ties between two have long been strained by disputes over who can appoint bishops in the country.

China first broke off diplomatic ties with the Holy See in 1951, and many Catholics were forced to go underground during former communist leader Mao Zedong's rule, emerging only in the 1980s when religious practices were tolerated again.

Today, Catholics in China face the choice of attending state-sanctioned churches approved by Beijing or worshipping in underground congregations.

Why many Christians in China have turned to underground churchesChina and the Church: The 'outlaw' do-it-yourself bishopChina's rebellious Catholics

The underground churches recognise only the Vatican's authority, whereas the Chinese state churches refuse to accept the authority of the Pope.

There are currently about 100 Catholic bishops in China, with some approved by Beijing, some approved by the Vatican and, informally, many now approved by both.

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Image captionPeople praying at an underground church

Relations between both parties appear to be thawing.

Last year, Pope Francis made his thoughts about China known , saying that he would like to visit China "as soon as they send me an invitation". The pontiff also added that he hoped there was the "possibility to have good relations with China".

Chinese and Vatican officials have met at least four times since 2016 over the issue of the appointment of bishops, state media report.

What is in the agreement?

Under the agreement, the Vatican would be given a say in the appointment of future bishops in China, a Vatican source told news agency Reuters.

For Beijing, an agreement with the Vatican could allow them more control over the country's underground churches.

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Image captionFather Dong Guanhua has been kicked out of the Chinese Catholic church for calling himself a bishop

Globally, it would also enhance China's prestige - to have the world's rising superpower engaging with one of the world's major religions.

Symbolically, it would the first sign of rapprochement between China and the Catholic church in more than half a century.

The Vatican is the only European state that maintains formal diplomatic relations with Taiwan. It is currently unclear if an agreement between China and the Vatican would affect this in any way.

What will this mean for the country's Catholics?

There are currently around 10 million Roman Catholics in China.

It's not certain how such an agreement will affect the community, though some are sceptical.

Cardinal Joseph Zen of Hong Kong had on Wednesday criticised the Vatican for its attempts at diplomacy with China, accusing the Church of forcing bishops to retire in favour of replacements picked by Beijing.

"Do I think that the Vatican is selling out the Catholic Church in China?" he wrote on Facebook. "Yes, definitely."

Others however, are slightly more hopeful.

Father Jeroom Heyndrickx, a Belgian priest who has spent 60 years trying to help Chinese Catholics, said that he believed China was "ready to have a dialogue."

"For 2,000 years in China, the emperor was emperor and pope at the same time," he told the BBC . "But China has changed and the Church has changed and this is what constitutes a new opportunity for this dialogue to succeed."

A Commie Jesuit Pope.  I am shocked.

evil veiled -

A Commie Jesuit Pope.  I am shocked.

And this is the guy people argue we should follow...

Investiture Crisis!

toelocku -
evil veiled -

A Commie Jesuit Pope.  I am shocked.

And this is the guy people argue we should follow...

Are you Catholic?

The sooner Jorge Bergolio is gone the better it will be for the Church. Francis has been a wrecking ball against sacred tradition, doctrine, and he and his cronies (the so called St. Galen Mafia - Cardinals Daneels, Marx Kasper and others) who forced Benedict XVI into abdication have wrecked vocations across the world shuttered monasteries and convents (Franciscans of the Immaculata and Mariawald come to mind) across the world and have promoted fools and nominal Catholics to positions of serious importance. (Blase Cupich being installed as Archbishop of Chicago comes to mind)

In any other papacy, the selling out of Chinese Catholics to a communist regime would be a tremendous and terrible scandal, but the Bergolio papacy has been so historically traumatic that it will be decades before his errors will be fully undone.

Also, for those of you who are interested in what an actual Catholic has to say in this matter of China, I would recommend following and reading Joseph Cardinal Zen of Hing Kong on the matter who has been very forthright in saying that Bergolio has "sold out" Chinese Catholics to a vile communist government.

Here are some links for anyone interested:

https://rorate-caeli.blogspot.com/2018/02/de-mattei-spirit-of-resistance-and-love.html

https://remnantnewspaper.com/web/index.php/articles/item/3747-pope-abandons-persecuted-catholics-in-china-sides-with-communists

https://www.lifesitenews.com/news/cardinal-zen-i-blame-popes-advisors-for-vaticans-suicide-deal-with-china

If someone could just explain why the Jesuits would form an alliance with the ChiComs, that would be great.

I feel I've overlooked something in the article. What has he done that's so shocking and why is it bad?

TTT 

LiveWire -
toelocku -
evil veiled -

A Commie Jesuit Pope.  I am shocked.

And this is the guy people argue we should follow...

Are you Catholic?

According to Catholics yes

The thing is that most Chinese on the mainland don't want to become Catholics becuase it's old fashioned with rituals and shit which is similar to superstitious Chinese traditions.

The real concern for the Pope is the fact that all the new Christians in China are all going to be Protestants and not Catholics. There are so many underground churches in China which preach Jesus that this is serious threat for the Catholic church as well as the Chinese government.

China may become the largest Christian country pretty soon.

evil veiled -

If someone could just explain why the Jesuits would form an alliance with the ChiComs, that would be great.

Who know$

That's weird only because The Church has always been completely Fascist

Rare Look at the Underground Church in China

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eKanVzGTKUg

hubris - Rare Look at the Underground Church in China

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eKanVzGTKUg
Good post

I feel like somehow the answer would lie in the origins of the Jesuit order (to which the Pope belongs, and is the first of this order to become Pope).  And the origins of Communism.

If only there was someone on the OG who had knowledge in these areas!?!

toelocku -
LiveWire -
toelocku -
evil veiled -

A Commie Jesuit Pope.  I am shocked.

And this is the guy people argue we should follow...

Are you Catholic?

According to Catholics yes

I’m actually interested in what that means, is that some clever play on a concept that I’m not aware of? Let me rephrase my question because maybe it wasn’t as straightforward as I thought:

Do you consider yourself Catholic?

LiveWire -
toelocku -
LiveWire -
toelocku -
evil veiled -

A Commie Jesuit Pope.  I am shocked.

And this is the guy people argue we should follow...

Are you Catholic?

According to Catholics yes

I’m actually interested in what that means, is that some clever play on a concept that I’m not aware of? Let me rephrase my question because maybe it wasn’t as straightforward as I thought:

Do you consider yourself Catholic?

I was baptized Catholic so according to Catholics that makes me Catholic but no I'm not

toelocku -
LiveWire -
toelocku -
evil veiled -

A Commie Jesuit Pope.  I am shocked.

And this is the guy people argue we should follow...

Are you Catholic?

According to Catholics yes

Fucker perfect. 

toelocku -
LiveWire -
toelocku -
LiveWire -
toelocku -
evil veiled -

A Commie Jesuit Pope.  I am shocked.

And this is the guy people argue we should follow...

Are you Catholic?

According to Catholics yes

I’m actually interested in what that means, is that some clever play on a concept that I’m not aware of? Let me rephrase my question because maybe it wasn’t as straightforward as I thought:

Do you consider yourself Catholic?

I was baptized Catholic so according to Catholics that makes me Catholic but no I'm not

Ok, so family baptized you but you’re not a practicing Catholic. Then why worry what a religious leader from a faith that is not yours has to say?

Is this more about family dynamics?