Ken was never a good nail. In the second Severn fight Severn finally got him down and did a lot of damage in a few seconds. Coleman was a better wrestler [younger + roids] at that point, he would have murdered Ken.
Ken stuffs an early takedown, then blasts Coleman with the same right hand that took the souls of Royce and Tito (via delayed effect) and the late Ross Clifton, then dives in for the sub finish, likely a leglock of some kind.
(yeah, I'm being a bit silly with the above, but I wouldn't count out the version of Ken who stuffed Severn and subbed him)
can see both winning. but if i had to bet, id go with Coleman on this one. Severn is one thing, but guys like Coleman, Kerr & Erikson were another. and those were the 3 i always felt Ken would have trouble with.
Ken was better than most of us remember BUT he would be on bottom and I don’t think Ken ever had much on bottom
I wouldn’t wanna go for a leg on Coleman. I feel like you’d end up in a even worse position. Especially if knees are allowed. I think the gassing game is the safest strategy I just dunno if Ken could apply it like Mo and Pete Williams did.
Coleman would’ve fuckstomped him......
onepunchJD - Ken was just as strong if not stronger that Coleman. Mo Smith said Ken was the strongest he ever felt. He also had excellent wrestling for MMA, a solid clinch, and a good sprawl.Ken and Coleman are the only fighters who physically manhandled Severn in that era – a guy who was both bigger and had superior wrestling credentials over Ken.
So its not a given that Coleman gets the instant takedown. He might have to work for it. The longer it goes, the more it favors Ken.
Keep in mind 2 guys who trained with Ken beat Coleman via superior conditioning in the UFC. And Pete wasn’t getting the better of Ken in the gym.
Ken KO’d Coleman in training. Its only training, so not a predictor. But these 2 guys were evenly matched physically.
Nothing wrong with picking Coleman…
But its a much closer matchup than many people will admit.
Just have some dignity and concede that you were wrong instead of posting another pile of crap to try and back up the first one. Headbutts and Hammer fists all day. Ken was never good off his back and his cardio vs big guys drops off significantly. Especially when they’re on top pummeling him. Mo Smith had the defense, the striking, and some of the best cardio around that allowed him to stick to and execute the well thought out game plan. Never heard anything about Ken KOing Mark in training…
Ken by legbar
http://www.mixedmartialarts.com/forums/UnderGround/Ken-Shamrock-KOd-Mark-Coleman-in-training-:2194776
what injuries did ken get in pro wrestling?
Tim Duncan -onepunchJD - Ken was just as strong if not stronger that Coleman. Mo Smith said Ken was the strongest he ever felt. He also had excellent wrestling for MMA, a solid clinch, and a good sprawl.Ken and Coleman are the only fighters who physically manhandled Severn in that era – a guy who was both bigger and had superior wrestling credentials over Ken.
So its not a given that Coleman gets the instant takedown. He might have to work for it. The longer it goes, the more it favors Ken.
Keep in mind 2 guys who trained with Ken beat Coleman via superior conditioning in the UFC. And Pete wasn’t getting the better of Ken in the gym.
Ken KO’d Coleman in training. Its only training, so not a predictor. But these 2 guys were evenly matched physically.
Nothing wrong with picking Coleman…
But its a much closer matchup than many people will admit.
Who’s not to say that Petey or Mo wouldnt beat Ken in a fight? Tra beat Igor but I doubt Ken could. I would favor Mo in a Shamrock fight, Petey, might win via Petey my heart!
I would have liked to have seen a Mo vs Coleman rematch. Coleman 2.0 would beat him IMO.
Ken beat Mo Smith easily in Pancrase.
Ken manhandled all the Lions Den guys. Its common knowledge.
Igor is a tough fight for anybody. The slower more striking oriented Ken we saw in Pride who had to work for takedowns would be playing with fire. The dominant grappling Ken of the 90s matches up just fine with Igor.
in training ken probably subbed him a bunch, but coleman wasnt throwing ground strikes
ken was not good off his back, and coleman would be punching in mma
FloppyBBC Divac -onepunchJD - Ken was just as strong if not stronger that Coleman. Mo Smith said Ken was the strongest he ever felt. He also had excellent wrestling for MMA, a solid clinch, and a good sprawl.Ken and Coleman are the only fighters who physically manhandled Severn in that era – a guy who was both bigger and had superior wrestling credentials over Ken.
So its not a given that Coleman gets the instant takedown. He might have to work for it. The longer it goes, the more it favors Ken.
Keep in mind 2 guys who trained with Ken beat Coleman via superior conditioning in the UFC. And Pete wasn’t getting the better of Ken in the gym.
Ken KO’d Coleman in training. Its only training, so not a predictor. But these 2 guys were evenly matched physically.
Nothing wrong with picking Coleman…
But its a much closer matchup than many people will admit.
Just have some dignity and concede that you were wrong instead of posting another pile of crap to try and back up the first one. Headbutts and Hammer fists all day. Ken was never good off his back and his cardio vs big guys drops off significantly. Especially when they’re on top pummeling him. Mo Smith had the defense, the striking, and some of the best cardio around that allowed him to stick to and execute the well thought out game plan. Never heard anything about Ken KOing Mark in training…
LOL
What exactly am I “wrong” about? An opinion about a hypothetical fight between 2 monsters that never happened??
Like I said, its a good matchup.
Coleman is the better wrestler but so was Severn. Ken had subs and the cardio advantage. Both guys were tough as nails, and at their best neither was an easy out for anybody.
I just see Ken as being better conditioned and durable enough to weather a storm if it came to that. I think Coleman would get tired before he could finish Ken, and get subbed. Also Coleman usually enjoyed a significant strength advantage that he wouldn’t have against Ken. Ken surprised Severn with his strength and wrestling. If he could make Coleman work for takedowns, that expended energy would be a factor.
Regardless, it is one of my dream fights from that era
I love both but I'd submit before either of them did. This would have half hour of laying still until one guy was too tired to stand. They would have completely nullified each other I think...
It’s hard to pick one over the other. If Mark were to put Ken on his back… that’s a dangerous place to be for anyone. If Ken put Mark on his back, that’s a living death.
Ken was more wise, and more patient after fighting Royce twice. He would have studied and known what he was up against coming into the fight. We’re talking about one of the founding fathers of MMA here. Make no mistake about it.
It’s Hard to say if Ken would be patient to a fault against the godfather of GNP. Ken was just as, if not stronger than Mark and could threaten with more versatile submissions if he wasn’t already rocked too hard when they hit the ground.
Ken could wear Coleman down, but the fight probably wouldn’t end in a spectacular fashion unless Ken drove some knees ala Kimo.
I favor Ken.
Coleman. Too strong and able to control Ken. Frank may be able to pull off a quick sub, though.
Supposedly Ken beat Mark Coleman when the trained together.
I think that it would have depended upon when they fought. Ken’s prime as a fighter was earlier than Mark Coleman’s prime as a fighter.
“Yeah and most of those people he heelhooked were wearing giant fucking boots…oh and most of those fights were fake in an organization that had more fake fights than the WWE.”
This is complete crap. There were very few works in Pancrase (you could probably count them on one hand, and probably not use all your fingers).
Pancrase had some highly skilled MMA fighters back in the day.
“he dodged a lot of top fighters of his era by being in the WWE”
Ken did not go to the WWF because he was dodging fighters in MMA. He went to the WWF because they paid him a lot more money than he could have made in MMA at the time.
It was actually good for MMA that he did that stint in the WWF, because he brought more attention to MMA, which was good for the bank accounts of MMA promoters and other MMA fighters.
" I would favor Mo in a Shamrock fight, "
I recall that Ken beat Maurice Smith in Pancrase. I think that he submitted him via submission to an arm triangle choke.