What will it take for Cro Cop to get respect for his grappling skills. Will Cro Cop have to pull off a hater's favorite submission on a fighter? Will Cro Cop have to submit a BJJ black belt? What would he have to do (something reasonable) for people to accept Crocop being a complete fighter? I'm not saying he is a complete fighter but he has shown a ton of growth in terms of skills. He's been able to beat wrestlers handily, well rounded fighters (Herring, Fedor's brother), and hang with BJJ legend Minotauro on the ground (at least in the beginning) for several minutes with no discernible problems. Hell, Sylvia in a similar situation with Mir barely lasted a minute on the ground.
Crocop gets personally trained in BJJ by a black belt with Mundial experience/ champion maybe(?) (Werdum). This is something a lot of amateur and pro-fighters don't have access to. Do people think Crocop under that kind of personal attention and as well as his displayed athleticism/ high learning curve in terms of fighting has reached his max potential? Or do people find Crocop to be the stereotypical striker with no groundgame who will remain that way for the rest of his career?
I think CroCop will be a terrific grappler in time. Right now his game is still developing, but he's an outstanding athlete in every way. I have no doubt that if he puts any effort into it he'll be great soon. Right now I think people are just so scared of his standup game that grappling is the clear choice when fighting him. So I don't think it's that he gets no credit for his grappling, it's just that it's clearly the lesser of two evils for anyone who gets in the ring with the guy.
He has come a very long way in a short amount of time, right now though, he still is strictly defensive against most opponents on the ground. He is very impressive for the amount of time he has been training on the ground.
So what would be evidence of a good ground game? He's actually submitted Randleman. Something Babalu who has very good ground game could not do. Also, once you're fighting top heavyweights, isn't pulling off a submission pretty hard in the first place? So I guess, in Mr. Nash's eyes, Crocop will never be good at grappling.
I think you guys will be surprised. I'm not saying he is a "great" grappler, but from what I've seen thus far...he is a sponge. He's a lot better than people think. We'll just have to see
Cop Crop has success with his style of keeping it on his feet , it seems that no one can stand with him in MMA therefore I think he should work solely on his clinch/sprawl and his escapes, if he dose this then it will be difficult to beat him.
If Cro Cop fought Klitchsko in an MMA match.....you think he'd clinch Tyson and try to take him to the ground? That would be funny to see....Cro opting for the takedown...
He's super-fast and super-strong; if he is really dedicating himself to learning the ground as he's said to be, it's only a matter of time before he starts submitting people.
"He's actually submitted Randleman. Something Babalu who has very good ground game could not do."
Randleman also was EXPECTING Babalu to try for submsissions, something he was probably pretty unaware of about Crocop (Kind of a Telligman/Vitor situation). Even a sucker move like a guillotine.
And KR has shown the best ability of any fighter to find a ridiculous way to lose a fight that he should win, time and time again. Bad example.
Now, if we want to talk to him having a half dead Kanehara mounted and not being to do anything, or submitted within 1 minute of being taken down by Nog...
---- "From: Linkage Date: 02/11/05 05:55 PM Member Since: 03/01/2003 2416 Total Posts Ignore User "What would he have to do (something reasonable) for people to accept Crocop being a complete fighter? I'm not saying he is a complete fighter"
If you've suffered head trauma, please let me know now so I don't feel like an asshole when I make fun of how stupid that sounded."----
Did I say something to piss you off? I was asking a question and wanted to see someone respond with a sensible answer. I don't see anything wrong with the question. I just qualified my question considering how the UG misinterprets stuff so easily.
Date: 02/11/05 05:57 PM
Member Since: 03/01/2003
2417 Total Posts Ignore User
"He's actually submitted Randleman. Something Babalu who has very good ground game could not do."
Randleman also was EXPECTING Babalu to try for submsissions, something he was probably pretty unaware of about Crocop (Kind of a Telligman/Vitor situation). Even a sucker move like a guillotine.
And KR has shown the best ability of any fighter to find a ridiculous way to lose a fight that he should win, time and time again. Bad example.
Now, if we want to talk to him having a half dead Kanehara mounted and not being to do anything, or submitted within 1 minute of being taken down by Nog..."----
The guillitone isn't a sucker move. It's a legitimate submission just as any other submission. Some fighters are able to hit it an others are not. If it was easy as you made it out to be then obviously you are championship material.
KR may not have been expecting it, but he should have considering the fact that it's been used by unskilled fighters as well as skilled fighters on host of people attempting double leg takedowns (alah the early UFCs). I mean anybody attempting a shot always has to take that into consideration especially a professional. Why take credit away from Crocop's submission? Are you a blind hater of Mirko?
Crocop lasted more than a minute with Nog and he acknowledges he made a mistake in the 2nd round. However in the beginning, Crocop was in Mino's guard for a good 3-4 minutes with no ill effects. The Kanehara fight displayed Crocop working on his game... he attempted submissions, etc.