alot of bjj'ers get their noses high on bjj and it's superiority.
i know alot of traditional karate guys that will break your shit off properly if you fight them... you will HAVE to get the takedown because you will hurt when they hit...
some of these guys wrestled in HS as well and would be very difficult in a fight...
what is your experience w/ your average or even above avg. jits practitioners who are blind to the fact that these older/traditional martial arts are in fact VERY effective in a fight given they trained hard/smart/live as well...
key here is the guys i know trained live.
I agree.Not only Karate guys will put on the hurt but the Judoka will really put on the hurt when they get ahold of you.
Ju-Jitsu is great on the ground but you need to be a very accomplished Ju-Jitsu man to control someone who wishes to tear your head off.
Everything depends on the type of training you engage in. I agree that the lack of SD training in most BJJ schools is disheartening. People should spend at least one session a week training Carlson Gracie style.
I disagree. I feel no obligation to any other martial arts.
This is why BJJ should never forget its roots.
I don't care about arts. It all comes down to training methods. Most bjj self-defense training is practiced without what Matt Thornton calls "aliveness" and is therefore no more useful than most TMA training. The toughest guys tend to be those who participate in combat sports like wrestlers, boxers, kickboxers, etc. But a person shouldn't be judged on their style or rank, just on their ability.
agree with Ridgeback. Why should I respect someone only based on his roots or tradition?
I mean a karate guy who wrestled in highschool and can kick ass - wicked. What has it to do with "traditional martial arts"?
"who are blind to the fact that these older/traditional martial arts are in fact VERY effective in a fight given "
Actually it's not a fact. To the contrary most TMA's are proven to have bad techniques, bad strategy and piss poor execution. A Handful of decent fighters doesn't change that.
You are either a troll or the interweb is a time portal and you are writing us from 1989. Wanna know some scores?
I know a doorman who can wristlock most drunks at the bar he works at. He's 320 pounds and a powerlifter. Does that mean Aikido is very effective?
But seriously, you're correct that we should do what Luke Beston always does, respect all martial arts.
"The toughest guys tend to be those who participate in combat sports like wrestlers, boxers, kickboxers, etc."
Are you going to tell me that Jiu Jitsu isn't a Combat Sport?
How many Wrestlers and Boxers do you know who train Jiu Jitsu? I know a shitload.
I respect anyone who has put the time in to be good at what they do. From Martial Arts to basket weaving, if someone has acheived a degree of expertise in something, I have respect for them.
What I have a problem with is people who have terrible technique in a Martial Art but still think they are bad-ass becuase they have bought a Black Belt (See DR90210 post on UG).
you guys are reaaallly running into a lot of karate guys crosstrained in
What happens when the high school wrestler finally gets takedown By a real good submission guy?
All MA's have strengths and weaknesses. You should respect them all.
rocklos has said something very, very correct. it's a shame that the argument will continue in the face of it.
you are right... i've been posting since '00, just biding my time to make this thread, Le Shat.
keep reading my post up there, i mentioned "LIVE" training.... real sparring. not cookie cutter karate or tkd run by a fat white man or 14 yr. old helpers.
i'm talking some old school kenpo or kyokushinkai guys that fought and trained real hard and live.
too many bjj stylists who don't do the self defense are extremely shocked when someone w/ balls and good hands starts dropping bombs on them.... shit, a good roid head w/ fast haymakers is probably enough to shock them...
Interesting topic. Great discussion!