"Say it to his face!" is stupid

This whole thing started as a result of Khabib threatening to physically attack Artem because of his free speech.

We live in a society where you are free to speak your mind free of violent reprisals.

If this wasn’t true, virtually all women who were less physically imposing as men would be in fear of speaking their mind for fear of being beaten.

All these MMA “scholars” like Cormier and even Ariel are like Khabib didn’t act ideal BUT he’s from a different culture man, etc. etc. They didn’t think it through. We have one way or the other. Free speech enforced by a soverign authority or a state of nature where the strong prey on the weak.

If you don’t believe this, that’s fine. But you’re un-American.

It's almost as if all parties involved are 'un-American'

Weird. That's the #1 rule of this forum too.

“So-and-so is from a different culture!”

“You’ll have to excuse so-and-so’s… homophobia, racism, misogyny, etc.”

Am I Right?

PC logic makes no sense. Hypocritical and inconsistent.

It’s based on bias and emotion.

You sound like a fat pussy hiding behind his monitor. BTW, I would say that to your face. 

Artem is a pro fighter with a losing record, shouldnt be talking about someone 27-0 when he's 13-14

The artem and khabib situation doesn't really have anything to do with "free speech" artem said something khabib didn't like and khabib told him to watch his mouth. If artem got arrested for saying something, that's when "free speech" comes into play.

I prefer to say "you wouldn't whisper that in his ear..."

Like, "Oh yeah bro...you are real tough on the internet...I bet you wouldn't whisper that shit seductively into my ear."

tenchu - "So-and-so is from a different culture!"

“You’ll have to excuse so-and-so’s… homophobia, racism, misogyny, etc.”

Am I Right?

PC logic makes no sense. Hypocritical and inconsistent.

It’s based on bias and emotion.

exactly. good post.

Joshinho - 

The artem and khabib situation doesn't really have anything to do with "free speech" artem said something khabib didn't like and khabib told him to watch his mouth. If artem got arrested for saying something, that's when "free speech" comes into play.

The 1st A doesn’t apply since there is no Congressional prohibition however the West generally values free speech as an inherent good in itself due to the marketplace of ideas concept, freedom from tyranny, etc. and that’s what I’m referring to as well as the contrast with other cultures who believe that speech is justification for violent retribution.

I would assume that most cultures would justify being "violent" if someone is insulting you. Wouldn't you? 

It's also a bit hard to call what khabib did to artem "violent"

Joshinho -

The artem and khabib situation doesn't really have anything to do with "free speech" artem said something khabib didn't like and khabib told him to watch his mouth. If artem got arrested for saying something, that's when "free speech" comes into play.

He also surrounded him with about 20 of his goons and slapped him (although in a "friendly" manner) and threatened him.

And what Artem said about Khabib anyway? If i remember correctly it wasnt  anything offensive, its not like he called him a churka or a muslim rat.

UFC isn't global? Best fighters in the world? American values don't mean zip in Russia. UFC values do! Dana & UFC failed in this totally avoidable situation. 

FatBuddha -
Joshinho - 

The artem and khabib situation doesn't really have anything to do with "free speech" artem said something khabib didn't like and khabib told him to watch his mouth. If artem got arrested for saying something, that's when "free speech" comes into play.

The 1st A doesn’t apply since there is no Congressional prohibition however the West generally values free speech as an inherent good in itself due to the marketplace of ideas concept, freedom from tyranny, etc. and that’s what I’m referring to as well as the contrast with other cultures who believe that speech is justification for violent retribution.

Hey FatBuddha!!

Be careful not to generalize too much. America is the land of the free. There’s some truth there but don’t get too cocky, it’s just a slogan at the end of the day.

I’m a Lebanese-Canadian, I moved to Canada after high-school and I feel like there are less stigmas in Lebanon than in Canada. I go back there yearly and I appreciate many freedoms that you don’t have, and that you’re not aware of not having. One example is drinking on the sidewalk while leaning on cars which is nice when all the bars are packed. You guys are complexed by alcohol for some reason.

Another freedom that we have is smoking indoors, we still do that. Restaurants have the right to ban it, but the market regulates itself. Here’s what’s interesting, the government passed a law banning smoking indoors but no one gave a shit and 2 weeks later everything went back to normal. So the people aren’t worried about laws or afraid of the government and that’s freedom right there. Kinda like when you become an adult you stop worrying about what your parents decide, you feel more free when fewer officers have less authority over you.  

I also listen to Lebanese and Egyptian news networks and they talk rather freely about some very real shit. scandelous shit. Their buildings are shot at by certain militias sometimes if they trashed their leader too much but they always perform their journalistic duties ethically. Fox news and CNN ain’t got nothing, they talk to you people like you’re a bunch of children. And when it comes to certain issues, your naivete as a nation really has got to that level.

The American media is literally taming the populace by changing the vocabulary, like midget and handicapped, you can’t say these words anymore. Well you can but why would you unless you want to make a point? When the norm is controlled it doesn’t matter if you think you’re free, your environment will incentivize you not to say some things. They’re getting one half of people riled up about some overexaggerated cases of inequality; while the other half, yourself included, is baited into engaging in stupid debates against brainwashed kids. Your soldiers are traumatized by the amount of traumatization that they’ve been ordered to induce on others. How freely can you talk about the army? Would you dare to not glorify veterans?

Daniel said "it’s a different culture" to explain why Khabib didn’t forget and forgive after the fight was over. It is a question of honor and different cultures draw the line at different places. Even individuals have different acceptable limits. And no one tried to justify his actions. His dad warned him about that and he got disciplined for not listening. DC got a little pushy too one time, where were you when that happened? Is it cause he’s black? Definitely not and I feel bad for even asking the question. Shit like this hurts, only say it when you’re sure you want to.

The champ Khabib is an exceptional international athlete who regularly competes on your soil. Feel the honor of hosting his talent and make him feel welcome. And if you don’t dig his culture call you’re congressman and politely convey your opinions on immigration or whatever. 

BUT DON'T SLIP INTO RACIST SHIT. 

Oh op....

Lol @ "un-American"

Words have consequences anywhere in the world. Say the wrong things to the wrong people in America and you can get yourself killed. 

If Khabib went off about America and Al dominated him and went after his corner, you would be singing a different tune.

The UFC has a different set of rules for Conor. He used a weapon to assault another UFC fighter. The UFC promoted it and granted him a title shot 6 months later. This whole ordeal is a joke. 

the MKS connection - 
FatBuddha -
Joshinho - 

The artem and khabib situation doesn't really have anything to do with "free speech" artem said something khabib didn't like and khabib told him to watch his mouth. If artem got arrested for saying something, that's when "free speech" comes into play.

The 1st A doesn’t apply since there is no Congressional prohibition however the West generally values free speech as an inherent good in itself due to the marketplace of ideas concept, freedom from tyranny, etc. and that’s what I’m referring to as well as the contrast with other cultures who believe that speech is justification for violent retribution.

Hey FatBuddha!!

Be careful not to generalize too much. America is the land of the free. There’s some truth there but don’t get too cocky, it’s just a slogan at the end of the day.

I’m a Lebanese-Canadian, I moved to Canada after high-school and I feel like there are less stigmas in Lebanon than in Canada. I go back there yearly and I appreciate many freedoms that you don’t have, and that you’re not aware of not having. One example is drinking on the sidewalk while leaning on cars which is nice when all the bars are packed. You guys are complexed by alcohol for some reason.

Another freedom that we have is smoking indoors, we still do that. Restaurants have the right to ban it, but the market regulates itself. Here’s what’s interesting, the government passed a law banning smoking indoors but no one gave a shit and 2 weeks later everything went back to normal. So the people aren’t worried about laws or afraid of the government and that’s freedom right there. Kinda like when you become an adult you stop worrying about what your parents decide, you feel more free when fewer officers have less authority over you.  

I also listen to Lebanese and Egyptian news networks and they talk rather freely about some very real shit. scandelous shit. Their buildings are shot at by certain militias sometimes if they trashed their leader too much but they always perform their journalistic duties ethically. Fox news and CNN ain’t got nothing, they talk to you people like you’re a bunch of children. And when it comes to certain issues, your naivete as a nation really has got to that level.

The American media is literally taming the populace by changing the vocabulary, like midget and handicapped, you can’t say these words anymore. Well you can but why would you unless you want to make a point? When the norm is controlled it doesn’t matter if you think you’re free, your environment will incentivize you not to say some things. They’re getting one half of people riled up about some overexaggerated cases of inequality; while the other half, yourself included, is baited into engaging in stupid debates against brainwashed kids. Your soldiers are traumatized by the amount of traumatization that they’ve been ordered to induce on others. How freely can you talk about the army? Would you dare to not glorify veterans?

Daniel said "it’s a different culture" to explain why Khabib didn’t forget and forgive after the fight was over. It is a question of honor and different cultures draw the line at different places. Even individuals have different acceptable limits. And no one tried to justify his actions. His dad warned him about that and he got disciplined for not listening. DC got a little pushy too one time, where were you when that happened? Is it cause he’s black? Definitely not and I feel bad for even asking the question. Shit like this hurts, only say it when you’re sure you want to.

The champ Khabib is an exceptional international athlete who regularly competes on your soil. Feel the honor of hosting his talent and make him feel welcome. And if you don’t dig his culture call you’re congressman and politely convey your opinions on immigration or whatever. 

BUT DON'T SLIP INTO RACIST SHIT. 

I’m Lebanese too and let’s be honest, do you think that where it counts, like criticizing political leaders, you have as much freedom of speech without fear of violent recriminations in the Middle East as throughout let’s say America and Canada, to give 2 examples of our adopted countries? It’s more than just a slogan here for many. As I’ve said before Khabib seems a great fighter, good friend, and funny guy. It’s specific things that I think are clashing with free values such as training with a friend wearing a “Not Charlie Hebdo shirt” (yes I get that that’s free speech, but let’s not be stupid here, it’s supporting the murder of over 200 people because of their free speech), telling a woman with bare shoulders to cover up before taking a picture, supporting on twitter a threat against a gay singer, Ali (nuff said)…That’s not racist, that’s criticizing actions that hurt others. He could be a martian for all I care with blue skin and I’d feel the same way. Anyways, thanks for the civil debate.

FatBuddha - This whole thing started as a result of Khabib threatening to physically attack Artem because of his free speech.

We live in a society where you are free to speak your mind free of violent reprisals.

If this wasn’t true, virtually all women who were less physically imposing as men would be in fear of speaking their mind for fear of being beaten.

All these MMA “scholars” like Cormier and even Ariel are like Khabib didn’t act ideal BUT he’s from a different culture man, etc. etc. They didn’t think it through. We have one way or the other. Free speech enforced by a soverign authority or a state of nature where the strong prey on the weak.

If you don’t believe this, that’s fine. But you’re un-American.

“We live in a society where you are free to speak your mind free of violent reprisals.”

just because violent reprisals are illegal doesnt mean you are free from them when you piss someone off