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<h3><a href="/go=news.detail&gid=440420" target="_blank">
Shinya Aoki: I have more to gain in ONE FC
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<p>Earlier this month Japanese featherweight submission ace Shinya Aoki turned down a UFC offer. Manager Chatri Sityodtong cited 'more favorable economics' as the reason behind the decision to stay with the Singapore based One FC.</p>
Cagewriter's Elias Cepeda interviewed Aoki to learn more about what was meant by favorable economics.
"OneFC has taken care of me," Aoki said.
"They've treated me well. I know the fighters there and I'm comfortable in OneFC. I think I have more to gain from fighting there."
Aoki described his toughest fights as Gilbert Melendez and Eddie Alvarez, both of which took place in the US, but did not express any particular desire to build his US fan base.
"I'm happy that any fans from anywhere would watch me fight," said Aoki. "I'm honored that they are watching but it isn't my goal to appeal to everybody."
In a past interview, Aoki exhibited distate for the wrestling heavy style of play that for better and for worse works best in this sport.
“The American wrestling style – punching a little bit, getting a takedown and moving to side control to win the round has no risk,” said Aoki to MMAFighting.com. “It’s an easier fight. It’s just using the judges. They don’t even have to worry about injuries or anything like that. There is no risk.
“Japanese MMA is totally different. We go for knockouts and submissions from the beginning and going for the decision isn’t an option.”
Aoki is fighting Toshikatsu Harada at IGF - Inoki Bom-Ba-Ye 2013 in Tokyo, Japan, on New Years Eve.
^Same thing really. He will make money and look like the best in OneFC (more to gain) as oppose to coming to the USA and getting mauled by any top 5 and looking regular.
^This.
But I do think it's a little silly to hear him spin it. I get it, of course, and it's important to his psyche as a fighter, but let's not kid ourselves.
He'd do POORLY here. The wrestling here is much better, so to compete among the best here Aoki would have to become a better wrestler and/or develop his submission grappling style to address what high level wrestlers bring to the table. It can be done--Maia has laid out the blueprint for bringing together the high level sub grappling, wrestling, and judo skills to deal with wrestlers.
But Aoki either can't or doesn't want to do that, so he competes elsewhere where there are far fewer competitors that can exploit his weaknesses than there are here in the States.
He'll look better, win more, and be paid better competing in Asia, so that's what he's going to do. I don't blame him, and I thoroughly understand.
I just think it's a little silly to hear him say it's simply because the fighers here fight with a "no risk" style etc., when in fact it's because he'd LOSE a lot more and there'd be nothing he could do about it.
I think it would cost him more to fight in the US as well, if he wanted to bring trainers and corner guys especially, all that travel expense could be enough to offset whatever money the UFC offers.
Thanks for the link, UG News and thanks for reading, guys! A more in depth look at his psychology and career and future will be up next week at CagePotato
“Japanese MMA is totally different. We go for knockouts and submissions from the beginning and going for the decision isn’t an option.”
Bullshit.
There are plenty of decisions in Japanese MMA, just like anyplace else in the world.
I like Aoki and respect his place in the history of the sport, but I would respect him a whole lot more if he had the gumption to come and learn how to counter those 'American wrestlers' rather than running away from them.
At it's best, MMA is an experiment in martial arts Darwinism. New techniques/styles pop up and dominate for a while, but the great martial artists adapt and find ways to defeat those styles. Submission grapplers like the Nog brothers, Werdum, Jacare, Maia, and others had the balls to test themselves against 'American wrestlers' and managed to find different ways to beat that style. Kudos to them for stepping up and making the necessary adaptations. Aoki has gone the opposite route. He has chosen to remain in a closed ecosystem where he can survive with his existing style, rather than venturing out into the big scary Darwinian world. He doesn't want to adapt, so he stays at home where he is safe.
Steve4192 - “Japanese MMA is totally different. We go for knockouts and submissions from the beginning and going for the decision isn’t an option.”
Bullshit.
There are plenty of decisions in Japanese MMA, just like anyplace else in the world.
I like Aoki and respect his place in the history of the sport, but I would respect him a whole lot more if he had the gumption to come and learn how to counter those 'American wrestlers' rather than running away from them.
At it's best, MMA is an experiment in martial arts Darwinism. New techniques/styles pop up and dominate for a while, but the great martial artists adapt and find ways to defeat those styles. Submission grapplers like the Nog brothers, Werdum, Jacare, Maia, and others had the balls to test themselves against 'American wrestlers' and managed to find different ways to beat that style. Kudos to them for stepping up and making the necessary adaptations. Aoki has gone the opposite route. He has chosen to remain in a closed ecosystem where he can survive with his existing style, rather than venturing out into the big scary Darwinian world. He doesn't want to adapt, so he stays at home where he is safe.
Pretty much. Plenty of examples of both types of behavior in all walks of life too.
Why take a paycut for a more demanding job? MMA is a business. If UFC arent willing to pay more than OneFC, why should he be willing to accept less?
UFC have twice offered Aoki a contract and both offers were major lowball offers, the first was to fight BJ Penn at 170 before Aoki signed with PRIDE and it was for peanuts. The second was the recent offer which wasnt close to what he currently makes in OneFC. Dana says all the time you only have a very short window of opportunity to make money in MMA, Aoki did the smart thing.
Gets paid more money to be a bigger star, fight closer to home and fight absolutely nobody in the top 10.
Compared to having to travel to US for fights, atleast most fights, some would be in Asia but he'd have to eventually fight around the world. Fight top guys and get his ass kicked and make less money.
Sucks for fans that want to see him vs top guys but this really isnt that hard of a dec for him to make at this point in his career when you really look at it. In OneFC he is their GSP/Cain/Jones/Ronda/Silva, in UFC he ends up being another mid level fighter after he loses to a few of the best guys in the div.
Steve4192 - “Japanese MMA is totally different. We go for knockouts and submissions from the beginning and going for the decision isn’t an option.”
Bullshit.
There are plenty of decisions in Japanese MMA, just like anyplace else in the world.
I like Aoki and respect his place in the history of the sport, but I would respect him a whole lot more if he had the gumption to come and learn how to counter those 'American wrestlers' rather than running away from them.
At it's best, MMA is an experiment in martial arts Darwinism. New techniques/styles pop up and dominate for a while, but the great martial artists adapt and find ways to defeat those styles. Submission grapplers like the Nog brothers, Werdum, Jacare, Maia, and others had the balls to test themselves against 'American wrestlers' and managed to find different ways to beat that style. Kudos to them for stepping up and making the necessary adaptations. Aoki has gone the opposite route. He has chosen to remain in a closed ecosystem where he can survive with his existing style, rather than venturing out into the big scary Darwinian world. He doesn't want to adapt, so he stays at home where he is safe.
True, decisions are part of the the game and inevitable. Aoki is however, himself, a finisher and constantly hunting for the finish. He is obviously just spinning his place in One FC, silly and can see thru but no diff than the ol PR coming from them Zuffa staff.
Im also a bit on the fence at Aoki's placement as it is now. It seems to be always overlooked that Aoki has had a long successful career already and that he has already faced and beaten a 'American wrestler' like Alvarez and beat him rather quickly the first time. Yes, he got smoked in the rematch but Aoki actually finished Eddie faster than vice versa. Why do people constantly act like the first fight never happened?
He also beat big strong guys with good wrestling like JZ and Kawajiri...guys that everyone along with Alvarez everyone said he was gonna get smoked by. Same with thing Shaolin and Aurelio, that his BJJ was gonna get exposed.
Aoki is now clearly taking the easier route to a bigger paycheck but he's already accomplished quite a bit, he has a long list of top 10 wins, whether most of the recent UFC fans know about these or not.
^Same thing really. He will make money and look like the best in OneFC (more to gain) as oppose to coming to the USA and getting mauled by any top 5 and looking regular.
^This.
But I do think it's a little silly to hear him spin it. I get it, of course, and it's important to his psyche as a fighter, but let's not kid ourselves.
He'd do POORLY here. The wrestling here is much better, so to compete among the best here Aoki would have to become a better wrestler and/or develop his submission grappling to address what high level wrestlers bring to the table. It can be done--Maia has laid out the blueprint for bringing together the high level sub grappling, wrestling, and judo skills to deal with wrestlers.
But Aoki either can't or doesn't want to do that, so he competes elsewhere where there are far fewer competitors that can exploit his weaknesses than there are here in the States.
He'll look better, win more, and be paid better competing in Asia, so that's what he's going to do. I don't blame him, and I thoroughly understand.
I just think it's a little silly to hear him say it's simply because the fighers here fight with a "no risk" when in fact it's because he'd LOSE a lot more and there'd be nothing he could do about it.
Again, why wipe out his entire career save for his Gil and Alvarez rematch bouts? I wouldnt bet on him to do that well now in the UFC but his prime was arguably years ago and had beaten some of the fighters with above description but it just wont acknowledged by you guys...just like Fedor detractors will never acknowledge what he did prior to his 3 losses. You're really only as good as your last bout (that happened on US soil).
Steve4192 - “Japanese MMA is totally different. We go for knockouts and submissions from the beginning and going for the decision isn’t an option.”
Bullshit.
There are plenty of decisions in Japanese MMA, just like anyplace else in the world.
I like Aoki and respect his place in the history of the sport, but I would respect him a whole lot more if he had the gumption to come and learn how to counter those 'American wrestlers' rather than running away from them.
At it's best, MMA is an experiment in martial arts Darwinism. New techniques/styles pop up and dominate for a while, but the great martial artists adapt and find ways to defeat those styles. Submission grapplers like the Nog brothers, Werdum, Jacare, Maia, and others had the balls to test themselves against 'American wrestlers' and managed to find different ways to beat that style. Kudos to them for stepping up and making the necessary adaptations. Aoki has gone the opposite route. He has chosen to remain in a closed ecosystem where he can survive with his existing style, rather than venturing out into the big scary Darwinian world. He doesn't want to adapt, so he stays at home where he is safe.
It was a pure experiment when it was nhb. There were no judges or rules or score cards to exploit with point fighting.
The scoring for mma in America is tailor made for point fighting wrestlers.
There were some stats a while ago that showed as long as you had top position, regardless of what actually was happening (strikes/submission attempts) that you very very likely get given the points for the round.
By contrast, the Japanese dont overvalue the takedown and punish being ineffective / inactive with top position. There's a huge undeniable difference.
Steve4192 - “Japanese MMA is totally different. We go for knockouts and submissions from the beginning and going for the decision isn’t an option.”
Bullshit.
There are plenty of decisions in Japanese MMA, just like anyplace else in the world.
I like Aoki and respect his place in the history of the sport, but I would respect him a whole lot more if he had the gumption to come and learn how to counter those 'American wrestlers' rather than running away from them.
At it's best, MMA is an experiment in martial arts Darwinism. New techniques/styles pop up and dominate for a while, but the great martial artists adapt and find ways to defeat those styles. Submission grapplers like the Nog brothers, Werdum, Jacare, Maia, and others had the balls to test themselves against 'American wrestlers' and managed to find different ways to beat that style. Kudos to them for stepping up and making the necessary adaptations. Aoki has gone the opposite route. He has chosen to remain in a closed ecosystem where he can survive with his existing style, rather than venturing out into the big scary Darwinian world. He doesn't want to adapt, so he stays at home where he is safe.
It was a pure experiment when it was nhb. There were no judges or rules or score cards to exploit with point fighting.
The scoring for mma in America is tailor made for point fighting wrestlers.
There were some stats a while ago that showed as long as you had top position, regardless of what actually was happening (strikes/submission attempts) that you very very likely get given the points for the round.
By contrast, the Japanese dont overvalue the takedown and punish being ineffective / inactive with top position. There's a huge undeniable difference.
Id also say Aoki has some of the best MMA adapted BJJ we've seen so far. Yes, with the wrestlers and the cage, diff deal but again, he's already tapped tons of top 10 guys incl American wrestlers in the ring as well. Of course then there are those who think its "unfair" that he was able to wear his tights and that he never tapped anyone without them...which is obviously untrue but with rounds, standups, gloves, grease, the cage..... the deck is already stacked against grapplers. I think tights should be allowed to even it up a bit.
Aoki is a top 10 all-time LW, but he's just so unlikeable. The way he talks about the sport in interviews is incredibly self-serving, and he's shown poor sportsmanship on multiple occasions.
Also, I'd say the reason people cite the Alvarez rematch but not their first fight is the same reason Cain was a favorite against JDS in the rubber match. People generally give greater weight to the more recent fight.
