“Let me put everything to rest here -- the Fedor deal is entirely manageable, it will be very, very workable for everyone including Fedor,” he said. “He is very well taken care of, but it’s a very responsible deal -- no one’s going out of business because of it. It’s all silliness, and I’ll tell you, if the UFC is good at anything, they are good at spreading a lot of nonsense.”
www.sherdog.com/news/news/showtimes-hershman-declares-ratings-victory-19214
I think he brings up a good point - a lot of the silly "Fedor will kill Strikeforce" talk seems to be a product of UFC cultivating a media environment where the fan(boy)s are easily drawn into emotional arguments and hysterical claims. So when Dana White flippantly remarks that Fedor will run them out of business, some find it very easy to accept his promoter-speak as the truth, even if they have no real idea of how Fedor could harm Strikeforce's business.
he just stated what is obvious for anyone that is not a ufc fanboy.
" a lot of the silly "Fedor will kill Strikeforce" talk seems to be a product of"
the fact that every org he has ever fought for no longer exists.
David Weiß - Fedor has the potential to make Strikeforce almost as big as the UFC.
lol, not if he only fights cans once a year.
orcus - " a lot of the silly "Fedor will kill Strikeforce" talk seems to be a product of"
the fact that every org he has ever fought for no longer exists.
This is the kind of stuff Hershman is getting at, I believe. A flimsy emotional argument that really doesn't mean anything. Are you familiar with the concept of "cause and effect"?
Rogerio Nogueira fought in PRIDE, HCF and Affliction, all of which folded. Does that mean he is also an MMA show serial killer (in the eyes of the faboys at least)?
I dont think he will kill strike force as i see them already at the point where theyve gone through the growing pains and are pretty much on autopilot as long as they have the deal with showtime.I can see him bringing them better ratings but probably not enough to justify his contract but it does add more legitimacy to the org.I think they will be a force in a couple years
Is there such a thing in the UG lexicon as Anti-UFC Fanboys. Because for every fanatical UFC fanboy there is an equally fanatical UFC hater. They are the same person really just a mirror image.
One traipses from thread to thread nuthugging and the other checks in on each of those threads to do the opposite. It's funny really. They don't even realize they are doing it either...
I don't think it's a product of UFC rumors. Dana said Strikeforce has no money and couldn't have offered anything close to what the UFC did. It's primarily been forum members that are saying he will kill Strikeforce.
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smoogy -orcus - " a lot of the silly "Fedor will kill Strikeforce" talk seems to be a product of"
the fact that every org he has ever fought for no longer exists.
This is the kind of stuff Hershman is getting at, I believe. A flimsy emotional argument that really doesn't mean anything. Are you familiar with the concept of "cause and effect"?
Rogerio Nogueira fought in PRIDE, HCF and Affliction, all of which folded. Does that mean he is also an MMA show serial killer (in the eyes of the faboys at least)?
The difference is, Nog was not a major player in any of those organizations folding. Fedor was.
Fedor's management has shown, time and time again, that they don't give two shits about the financial well-being of their partners. They screwed over Pride with their attempted Bom Ba Ye defection, they screwed over Sibling Entertainment when they were launching M-1 Global, and they killed Bodog & Affliction by asking for guranteed contracts that their partners could not afford. Where was M-1's offer of a 50-50 split of profits/losses when Bodog & Affliction were losing millions of dollars? They just took their guaranteed money, watched their partners go out of business, and moved on to the next sucker. Pretending that Fedor is just some unlucky innocent who has had the bad fortune of hooking up with failed promoter after failed promoter is laughable.
Hopefully, Coker & Hershman have set up an infrastructure that will allow them to succeed where others have failed. But I have no doubt in my mind Fedor & M-1 are going to cause them a lot of headaches along the way.
Steve beat me to it.
Bodog was horribly mismanaged and Affliction had an unworkable pay structure from Day 1. Like I said in another thread, what was more likely to have caused Affliction's downfall, paying Fedor market value, or paying Lindland and Rothwell over $1.5m combined? Again, I think people are just accepting this silly idea that Fedor is the cause, and then they color in the details however they see fit. I find it difficult to blame Fedor when Bodog and Affliction never seemed to have a clue what they were doing from a business perspective
smoogy - Bodog was horribly mismanaged and Affliction had an unworkable pay structure from Day 1. Like I said in another thread, what was more likely to have caused Affliction's downfall, paying Fedor market value, or paying Lindland and Rothwell over $1.5m combined? Again, I think people are just accepting this silly idea that Fedor is the cause, and then they color in the details however they see fit. I find it difficult to blame Fedor when Bodog and Affliction never seemed to have a clue what they were doing from a business perspective
So why didn't their partner M-1 provide them with some sage advice. If they really saw a future with their 'partners', maybe they should have offered to take a little less up-front money in exhange for a cut of the back-end money. But no. M-1 was more than happy to just count their money, wait for their 'partner' to go out of business, and then fleece the next sucker.
I wish Strikeforce and Showtime all the luck in the world. They are going to need it.
Steve4192 -smoogy - Bodog was horribly mismanaged and Affliction had an unworkable pay structure from Day 1. Like I said in another thread, what was more likely to have caused Affliction's downfall, paying Fedor market value, or paying Lindland and Rothwell over $1.5m combined? Again, I think people are just accepting this silly idea that Fedor is the cause, and then they color in the details however they see fit. I find it difficult to blame Fedor when Bodog and Affliction never seemed to have a clue what they were doing from a business perspective
So why didn't their partner M-1 provide them with some sage advice. If they really saw a future with their 'partners', maybe they should have offered to take a little less up-front money in exhange for a cut of the back-end money. But no. M-1 was more than happy to just count their money, wait for their 'partner' to go out of business, and then fleece the next sucker.
I wish Strikeforce and Showtime all the luck in the world. They are going to need it.
So M-1 should have offered to re-negotiate their deal, harming their business in the process, to help lighten the load (marginally) on a promoter that had no future due to their complete lack of a realistic business plan? What kind of silly idea is that?
smoogy -Steve4192 -smoogy - Bodog was horribly mismanaged and Affliction had an unworkable pay structure from Day 1. Like I said in another thread, what was more likely to have caused Affliction's downfall, paying Fedor market value, or paying Lindland and Rothwell over $1.5m combined? Again, I think people are just accepting this silly idea that Fedor is the cause, and then they color in the details however they see fit. I find it difficult to blame Fedor when Bodog and Affliction never seemed to have a clue what they were doing from a business perspective
So why didn't their partner M-1 provide them with some sage advice. If they really saw a future with their 'partners', maybe they should have offered to take a little less up-front money in exhange for a cut of the back-end money. But no. M-1 was more than happy to just count their money, wait for their 'partner' to go out of business, and then fleece the next sucker.
I wish Strikeforce and Showtime all the luck in the world. They are going to need it.
So M-1 should have offered to re-negotiate their deal, harming their business in the process, to help lighten the load (marginally) on a promoter that had no future due to their complete lack of a realistic business plan? What kind of silly idea is that?
Of course not.
What they SHOULD do, if they are so interested in co-promoting, is stop signing with companies that "never seemed to have a clue what they were doing from a business perspective". Go out and find partners who are smart and business savvy if you want to build a global MMA empire.
Of course, we all know why M-1 didn't do that. Because only someone who "never seemed to have a clue what they were doing from a business perspective" would be willing to pony up the guaranteed money that Fedor was demanding. They never viewed Bodog or Affliction as partners. They viewed them as rubes who could be easily separated from their money.
yeah, because it sure couldn't have been because they dealt with the only orgs that were there to deal with.
Story is correct.. all this Fedor having his organizations fold came long before the UFC was around.
story97 - yeah, because it sure couldn't have been because they dealt with the only orgs that were there to deal with.
Not true.
The UFC was out there. Strikeforce was out there. EliteXC, DREAM, ICON, and Sengoku were all out there. M-1 chose to do business with Bodog & Affliction because they were the only rubes willing to offer the guaranteed money that Fedor demanded. They didn't want a partner. They wanted a mark.
Steve4192 -story97 - yeah, because it sure couldn't have been because they dealt with the only orgs that were there to deal with.
Not true.
The UFC was out there. Strikeforce was out there. EliteXC, DREAM, ICON, and Sengoku were all out there. M-1 chose to do business with Bodog & Affliction because they were the only rubes willing to offer the guaranteed money that Fedor demanded. They didn't want a partner. They wanted a mark.
UFC doesn't want partners and none of those other promotions could not have offered even half what Affliction gave him. This whole "con men" angle is pretty absurd. What fighter with his head screwed on right would turn down 2 million+ per fight guaranteed based on reservations about the business model?
orcus - " a lot of the silly "Fedor will kill Strikeforce" talk seems to be a product of"Philosophy 103: Introduction to Logic
the fact that every org he has ever fought for no longer exists.
False Cause
I. False Cause: the fallacy committed when an argument mistakenly attempt to establish a causal connection. There are two basic interrelated kinds.
- Post hoc ergo propter hoc: (literally "after this, therefore because of this") the fallacy of arguing that one event was caused by another event merely because it occurred after that event.
- I.e., mere succession in time is not enough to establish causal connection. E.g., consider "Since hair always precedes the growth of teeth in babies, the growth of hair causes the growth of teeth."
- Consider also "Every severe recession follows a Republican Presidency; therefore Republicans are the cause of recessions." Accidental generalizations need not always be causal relations.