So are the UG doctors accusing Cormier of roiding?

NorthFromHere - These samples were taken in the middle of gruelling fight camps. Overtraining can drastically lower your testo levels.


Don Catlin, former head of the largest doping detection lab in the world, disagrees.

Does overtraining affect your T/E ratios? Or does your body maintain the ratios as your levels of testosterone rise and fall by increasing and decreasing amount of epitestosterone production?

eXtv - 
NorthFromHere - These samples were taken in the middle of gruelling fight camps. Overtraining can drastically lower your testo levels.


Don Catlin, former head of the largest doping detection lab in the world, disagrees.


Ok, sounds surprising as there is tons of evidence that prolonged heavy physical exercise can lower your T-levels. And stress, that is surely present in a high level training camp, has a negative effect too as cortisol levels go up etc.

NorthFromHere - 
eXtv - 
NorthFromHere - These samples were taken in the middle of gruelling fight camps. Overtraining can drastically lower your testo levels.


Don Catlin, former head of the largest doping detection lab in the world, disagrees.


Ok, sounds surprising as there is tons of evidence that prolonged heavy physical exercise can lower your T-levels. And stress, that is surely present in a high level training camp, has a negative effect too as cortisol levels go up etc.

Athletes try not to overtrain though. And the kind of S+C these guys do actually increases test.

Glovegate - 
NorthFromHere - 
eXtv - 
NorthFromHere - These samples were taken in the middle of gruelling fight camps. Overtraining can drastically lower your testo levels.


Don Catlin, former head of the largest doping detection lab in the world, disagrees.


Ok, sounds surprising as there is tons of evidence that prolonged heavy physical exercise can lower your T-levels. And stress, that is surely present in a high level training camp, has a negative effect too as cortisol levels go up etc.

Athletes try not to overtrain though. And the kind of S+C these guys do actually increases test.


Yes, lifting heavy shit few times a week can increase your testo production IF you get the rest and nutrition to recover.
Mid camp these guys are doing 12 or more training sessions per week that leaves very little time for recovery. When you combine this with restricted food intake and mental stress, it's no wonder if one's hormone production is having temporary issues.

orcus -
JabCore - 
CormierBONEDintoirrelevance - Cormier is 35 and had a reading 235% higher than Jones, so no. Phone Post 3.0
This is why..... Phone Post 3.0

1) Testosterone levels for various age groups: In the one most commonly cited study, group 25-34 had average 617, group 35-44 had average 668.

2) Testosterone level in blood isn't the same as T/E ratio in urine. Where's your source for urine T/E ratio dropping significantly between 27 and 35?

3) Who cares if his ratio was higher than Jones'? It was still way below what everyone said could be legitimate. So does a low T/E mean PEDs or not?
Did his T level increase by 2.5 times in 2 weeks. Also 1:1 is common .4:1 is very low .19:1 is fucking absurd. Phone Post 3.0

Who drew the line between "very low" and "fucking absurd" at .4 and .19? And why would "very low" not be suspicious?

We don't know that Jones' actual testosterone level increased by 2.5x, because we haven't seen the blood test results yet. If it has, what's the supposition, that he juiced between those two tests and somehow it wasn't caught by the CIR test?

orcus - Who drew the line between "very low" and "fucking absurd" at .4 and .19? And why would "very low" not be suspicious?

We don't know that Jones' actual testosterone level increased by 2.5x, because we haven't seen the blood test results yet. If it has, what's the supposition, that he juiced between those two tests and somehow it wasn't caught by the CIR test?


What CIR test can you please post it?

I think it makes sense to act as though the CIR test was clear until we see otherwise. If we're going to assume they would hide or fudge test results, they would have done it with the cocaine in the first place and there never would have been one peep about Jones.

you do understand that cormier went to two olympics dont you dummy?

What the fuck does that have to do with anything? You don't think Olympic guys juice? You think being in the Olympics 7 years ago means he wouldn't juice now, when he's naturally older and slower and weaker and he says himself this is his last chance to be the best at anything?

Is this what idiots like you base your crusades on? This guy's "very low" ratio should be ignored because he went to the Olympics once upon a time, this other guy's very low ratio means he was juicing and everyone is covering it up?

NorthFromHere - 
eXtv - 
NorthFromHere - These samples were taken in the middle of gruelling fight camps. Overtraining can drastically lower your testo levels.


Don Catlin, former head of the largest doping detection lab in the world, disagrees.


Ok, sounds surprising as there is tons of evidence that prolonged heavy physical exercise can lower your T-levels. And stress, that is surely present in a high level training camp, has a negative effect too as cortisol levels go up etc.

You are technically correct, the best kind of correct. But I'm guessing he is too and the two are not mutually exclusive.

Perhaps overtraining lowers your epitetosterone production in the same way, or at least close to the same way) it lowers testosterone production? That would cause the ratio to remain unchanged by a strenuous training regimen.

ILoveWatchingJonesBoneShogun - Orcus, are you on Jones's payroll? Lol if not you should tell his pr people to pay you for this relentless 24 hour posting spree
I'd hope so. Phone Post 3.0

orcus - Who drew the line between "very low" and "fucking absurd" at .4 and .19? And why would "very low" not be suspicious?

We don't know that Jones' actual testosterone level increased by 2.5x, because we haven't seen the blood test results yet. If it has, what's the supposition, that he juiced between those two tests and somehow it wasn't caught by the CIR test?
I may be wrong but werent his test levels published? I recall seeing a 2.5 times increase in his test levels and similar in epi. as his T:E dropped but his actual test level increased. Phone Post 3.0

We've only seen urine tests so far. As I've said, you don't measure testosterone with a urine test. The testosterone in the urine sample doesn't necessarily correlate to the level in his blood, which is what is important.