So I'm at that point where I'm experimenting with different guards and how they work with my game. I'm on the smaller side, but I'm really digging spider so far.
My question is, when you're playing spider and someone stands do you automatically go to lasso - spider? 
Depends - you can also go with a de la riva hook or go to feet on the hips
I usually like to lasso if I need a control point in spider guard. THe other major control points are collar-foot in bicep (Romulo style), DLR hook, or foot in bicep + pants (leandro lo).
If they stand and are back away, still square with me, I will immediately try to dip under for x guard (using one foot on the mat and one foot in their bicep to pull me under/pull them over). I will lasso if I need to stop them for a second so I can establish a better position for attack. Sometimes I will use double lasso.
I often put one foot on their hip as soon as they stand for an easy sweep or to control the distance
I'll leave one spider hook in and play the other one like a butterfly hook, or an inside dlr hook. If they're bringing in the hips hard, I'll usually start to look for an outside dlr hook.
That lasso is nice for bringing them back in if they're aren't already too far away.
omoplautistic - I'll leave one spider hook in and play the other one like a butterfly hook, or an inside dlr hook. If they're bringing in the hips hard, I'll usually start to look for an outside dlr hook.Go shin to shin
That lasso is nice for bringing them back in if they're aren't already too far away.
I go de la riva or one leg shin to shin while the other is in spider. I don't like lasso because big guys sit on you
GaspareBJJ - So I'm at that point where I'm experimenting with different guards and how they work with my game. I'm on the smaller side, but I'm really digging spider so far.
My question is, when you're playing spider and someone stands do you automatically go to lasso - spider?
No...However that is because I prefer to primarily play double sleeve rather than collar/sleeve...With dbl sleeve you don't have the posture control. This makes it really difficult to lasso, especially if your smaller.... I generally go to dlr.
There is a great sweep that I do from lasso spider as they are standing...Not necessarily so much lasso, but just having the foot by the shoulder...either way. We you see them starting to stand, you just keep your foot in place...pretty soon his hips come up to where your foot is, then you just do the basic tripod sweep...It's money because most people hip heist when they stand against lasso and this plays right into it.
No. I usually will do two different variations of push-pull sweep, or sit up into a koala-style guard.
what do you guys do when you are playing spider guard against a pretty strong person and they are constantly trying to flee the guard? They might not be trying to go apeshit and run but instead, you feel they are trying to retreat and have pressure going back, like they want to run away and have no intention of trying to pummel your hooks/pressure in to pass. Sit up guard would be a good answer but they are ready to plant you back down on your ass if you try to follow them. It is really frustrating to put on spider guard hooks on biceps and all you feel is retreating backwards pressure making your spider guard feel useless
mideastgrappler - what do you guys do when you are playing spider guard against a pretty strong person and they are constantly trying to flee the guard? They might not be trying to go apeshit and run but instead, you feel they are trying to retreat and have pressure going back, like they want to run away and have no intention of trying to pummel your hooks/pressure in to pass. Sit up guard would be a good answer but they are ready to plant you back down on your ass if you try to follow them. It is really frustrating to put on spider guard hooks on biceps and all you feel is retreating backwards pressure making your spider guard feel uselessBack sweep or sickle sweep
ECM -mideastgrappler - what do you guys do when you are playing spider guard against a pretty strong person and they are constantly trying to flee the guard? They might not be trying to go apeshit and run but instead, you feel they are trying to retreat and have pressure going back, like they want to run away and have no intention of trying to pummel your hooks/pressure in to pass. Sit up guard would be a good answer but they are ready to plant you back down on your ass if you try to follow them. It is really frustrating to put on spider guard hooks on biceps and all you feel is retreating backwards pressure making your spider guard feel uselessBack sweep or sickle sweep
what is the back sweep?
Sickle sweep, no way. WIth feet on the biceps and their grip at the end of your pants, it is a far path to go from biceps to their knee/ankle level. especially with their retreating pressure, their ankles get far away (at least to grab) and they are usually in a staggered stance which makes it even harder to sickle sweep
mideastgrappler -Don't let them control your legs ever. Break the grips then go, sickle sweep works very easily in this situation. Back sweep simply put your insteps behind their heels, and push your shins against theirs. Or push your feet on their hips while you pull their ankles towards youECM -mideastgrappler - what do you guys do when you are playing spider guard against a pretty strong person and they are constantly trying to flee the guard? They might not be trying to go apeshit and run but instead, you feel they are trying to retreat and have pressure going back, like they want to run away and have no intention of trying to pummel your hooks/pressure in to pass. Sit up guard would be a good answer but they are ready to plant you back down on your ass if you try to follow them. It is really frustrating to put on spider guard hooks on biceps and all you feel is retreating backwards pressure making your spider guard feel uselessBack sweep or sickle sweep
what is the back sweep?
Sickle sweep, no way. WIth feet on the biceps and their grip at the end of your pants, it is a far path to go from biceps to their knee/ankle level. especially with their retreating pressure, their ankles get far away (at least to grab) and they are usually in a staggered stance which makes it even harder to sickle sweep
Also plant your feet on biceps and swing towards them when they back off
ECM -Awesomemideastgrappler -Don't let them control your legs ever. Break the grips then go, sickle sweep works very easily in this situation. Back sweep simply put your insteps behind their heels, and push your shins against theirs. Or push your feet on their hips while you pull their ankles towards youECM -mideastgrappler - what do you guys do when you are playing spider guard against a pretty strong person and they are constantly trying to flee the guard? They might not be trying to go apeshit and run but instead, you feel they are trying to retreat and have pressure going back, like they want to run away and have no intention of trying to pummel your hooks/pressure in to pass. Sit up guard would be a good answer but they are ready to plant you back down on your ass if you try to follow them. It is really frustrating to put on spider guard hooks on biceps and all you feel is retreating backwards pressure making your spider guard feel uselessBack sweep or sickle sweep
what is the back sweep?
Sickle sweep, no way. WIth feet on the biceps and their grip at the end of your pants, it is a far path to go from biceps to their knee/ankle level. especially with their retreating pressure, their ankles get far away (at least to grab) and they are usually in a staggered stance which makes it even harder to sickle sweep
Also plant your feet on biceps and swing towards them when they back off
Meatgrinder -GaspareBJJ - So I'm at that point where I'm experimenting with different guards and how they work with my game. I'm on the smaller side, but I'm really digging spider so far.
My question is, when you're playing spider and someone stands do you automatically go to lasso - spider?
No...However that is because I prefer to primarily play double sleeve rather than collar/sleeve...With dbl sleeve you don't have the posture control. This makes it really difficult to lasso, especially if your smaller.... I generally go to dlr.
There is a great sweep that I do from lasso spider as they are standing...Not necessarily so much lasso, but just having the foot by the shoulder...either way. We you see them starting to stand, you just keep your foot in place...pretty soon his hips come up to where your foot is, then you just do the basic tripod sweep...It's money because most people hip heist when they stand against lasso and this plays right into it.
I see people talking about the sickle sweep now... Maybe that's the name of the one I'm talking about...You grab one ankle...one foot goes behind his other ankle and your other foot pushes on his hip....
Don't think that this is unrealistic...It's is very doable... The key is to it is to leave your foot where his hip is going to be when he stands. Don't wait to undo the lasso after he stands....Many people don't think about doing this sweep while your leg is looped over his arm... Maybe that's what makes it so effective.
what ECM said about not letting them ever control your legs..ever..Agreed. Thisis exactly why I prefer dbl sleeve grip. Gaining a collar and giving him a free hand is not usually a good tradeoff in my book unless you're positioned in a way that he can't get control of your leg. There usually isn't a long time window for that.
I'm talking about when the guy is already standing
The problem with not letting them control your pants sleeve is more complex. You have double sleeve control with feet on biceps. They grab the end of your pants sleeve. there is no way you can stop that. Easy, now you break grips. Start to kick and break off their grips. Problem is now when you are grip breaking, they have thrown their hips back slightly with the feet placed too far away for you to effectively reach with your feet by the time you have broken grips. You would now be reaching too much if you extend your legs to catch your hooks to sweep with
Meatgrinder -Yep that's the sweepMeatgrinder -GaspareBJJ - So I'm at that point where I'm experimenting with different guards and how they work with my game. I'm on the smaller side, but I'm really digging spider so far.
My question is, when you're playing spider and someone stands do you automatically go to lasso - spider?
No...However that is because I prefer to primarily play double sleeve rather than collar/sleeve...With dbl sleeve you don't have the posture control. This makes it really difficult to lasso, especially if your smaller.... I generally go to dlr.
There is a great sweep that I do from lasso spider as they are standing...Not necessarily so much lasso, but just having the foot by the shoulder...either way. We you see them starting to stand, you just keep your foot in place...pretty soon his hips come up to where your foot is, then you just do the basic tripod sweep...It's money because most people hip heist when they stand against lasso and this plays right into it.
I see people talking about the sickle sweep now... Maybe that's the name of the one I'm talking about...You grab one ankle...one foot goes behind his other ankle and your other foot pushes on his hip....
Don't think that this is unrealistic...It's is very doable... The key is to it is to leave your foot where his hip is going to be when he stands. Don't wait to undo the lasso after he stands....Many people don't think about doing this sweep while your leg is looped over his arm... Maybe that's what makes it so effective.
what ECM said about not letting them ever control your legs..ever..Agreed. Thisis exactly why I prefer dbl sleeve grip. Gaining a collar and giving him a free hand is not usually a good tradeoff in my book unless you're positioned in a way that he can't get control of your leg. There usually isn't a long time window for that.
mideastgrappler - I'm talking about when the guy is already standingControl the inner sleeve forcing their hands to the outside. Control the centre which makes grabbing pants very difficult. It's a seperate battle to win before you even think of advancing. Like I said earlier never, ever let them control your legs or the position is already lost
The problem with not letting them control your pants sleeve is more complex. You have double sleeve control with feet on biceps. They grab the end of your pants sleeve. there is no way you can stop that. Easy, now you break grips. Start to kick and break off their grips. Problem is now when you are grip breaking, they have thrown their hips back slightly with the feet placed too far away for you to effectively reach with your feet by the time you have broken grips. You would now be reaching too much if you extend your legs to catch your hooks to sweep with
mideastgrappler - I'm talking about when the guy is already standing
The problem with not letting them control your pants sleeve is more complex. You have double sleeve control with feet on biceps. They grab the end of your pants sleeve. there is no way you can stop that. Easy, now you break grips. Start to kick and break off their grips. Problem is now when you are grip breaking, they have thrown their hips back slightly with the feet placed too far away for you to effectively reach with your feet by the time you have broken grips. You would now be reaching too much if you extend your legs to catch your hooks to sweep with
Nope... I don't do feet on biceps when they standing...no way. Not against a bigger person. De la riva...situp guard, etc.
Meatgrinder -mideastgrappler - I'm talking about when the guy is already standing
The problem with not letting them control your pants sleeve is more complex. You have double sleeve control with feet on biceps. They grab the end of your pants sleeve. there is no way you can stop that. Easy, now you break grips. Start to kick and break off their grips. Problem is now when you are grip breaking, they have thrown their hips back slightly with the feet placed too far away for you to effectively reach with your feet by the time you have broken grips. You would now be reaching too much if you extend your legs to catch your hooks to sweep with
Nope... I don't do feet on biceps when they standing...no way. Not against a bigger person. De la riva...situp guard, etc.
spider guard works great on standing opponents who are actively pressuring you and trying to pass. The problem for me is applying spider guard on standing opponents who constantly try to flee the guard and not engage. I also am not talking about them trying to run off like crazy. More like they don't really try to pass and are subtly stalling/fleeing.
If you don't do feet on biceps vs standing, then when do you use it? Barely anyone passes on the knees anymore much less stay on their knees when put in spider guard
I am just looking for more options because I don't believe them standing>>>>spider guard. If I did spider guard and I was forced to transition to DLR, sitting every time someone stood up from my spider guard, that would basically mean my spider guard is inferior.