Standing strangles?

Does anyone here use standing strangles in tounaments?

I've been slipping into cross strangles (juji-jime) and sliding lapel strangles (okurierijimi) while standing during sparring. The entries have been fairly easy because everyone is so focused on takedowns they don't consider a standing submission.

Anyone else use these, or have seen them used in tournaments?

Thanks

standing chokes are legal. BUT almost impossible to pull off against somebody with a decent skill level.

from what i understand, and i could be very wrong here, you cannot throw people from a choke, the risk of breaking their neck is too great. i was told this long ago.

ive never in my life seen anybody make a standing choke work in a BB division. ive seen green belts, even a brown belt or two, get caught with them once in ahwile, but that was about it.

then again, its judo and if you get good at it then i'd say its a skill worth having because it can be a great set-up for other things and will definately change the way people grip-fight with you.

-resnick

"I think it would be way hard to pull off as it's hard to get someones back while standing."

I do them while facing my opponent, while we're both fighting for a good grip or manuvering for a throw.

When I do a duck-under or arm drag to take their back I do a body lock takedown. (not sure of the name for a body lock)

"you cannot throw people from a choke"

Josh is correct. ;-)

"ive never in my life seen anybody make a standing choke work in a BB division."

I suppose it's like every other technique, your attack has to be better than your opponent's skill to defend.

Fun moves to play with but kind of cheap to use in class sparring. I limit myself to one type of strangle each class, to force myself to learn other techniques.

You'd punch someone in the head for using a legal technique?

Are you trolling or what?

"Anyone else use these, or have seen them used in tournaments?"

Someone tried that on me once, but it didn't work.

see, clown.. this is funny. youd get made for somebody doing something perfectly LEGAL..? you, sir, are a tool. lol.

id punch somebody for doing kami basami on me.. or for doing kawazu gake or wake-gatame... but never, ever for a standing choke.

the truth is that if you are stupid enough to get caught with a standing choke thats your own damn fault!! certainly not his for being good (fast and accurate) at it. its one thing if the technique is being done in a dangerous, uncontrolled or illegal manner. its another for being caught the fool.

i use standing chokes when i can. i think most people who have any idea what grip-fighitng is would if they chance was there. i mean, if i get both lapels on somebody who is bending over and i cant get them to move or open-up in the slightest ill put the pressure on their throat-- why not?? it makes them react and that gives me a chance to attack. if they just stay there then screw-em for being so stupid.

lol. to be honest, id put one on you, or anybody, inna heartbeat if the chance was there. if you punched me for it, then we'd see what's what really fast. then again, im sure it wouldnt be a problem to take somebody out who is stupid enough to get caught in a standing choke.

-resnick

"lol. to be honest, id put one on you, or anybody, inna heartbeat if the chance was there. if you punched me for it, then we'd see what's what really fast. then again, im sure it wouldnt be a problem to take somebody out who is stupid enough to get caught in a standing choke."


LMAO so true!!

btw Standing waki-gatame is legal....you just have to remain standing and keep control....still very dangerous though IMHO.

id punch somebody for doing kami basami on me.. or for doing kawazu gake or wake-gatame... but never, ever for a standing choke.

I don't know those techniques, any explanation?
Thanks

Ott,

kami-basami is a leg scissors. its responsible for ending many judo careers and injuring many, many people. it was made immediately illegal in the summer of 91.

kawazu-gake is complex. this is a new one that we cannot do. imagine facing somebody, taking your left leg between his legs and then wrap it all the way around his right leg so that the instep of your foot is touching his shin. then use that to lift and throw him over that very leg. if it works you fly, if it doesnt you get your knee of ankle ruined.

wake-gatame is an armlock. its commonly known as an armpit-armlock. it is not illegal in either standing or newaza forms, but only in the dropping form where one puts it onto the oppoenent standing and then takes it to the ground or uses it to force uke into the ground. this generally breaks the arm without giving a chance to submit first.

you can go to judoinfo.com to see detailed pics of all 3 of these techniques.

-resnick

Thank You very much!!

becuase if tori is off just a little bit he can easily cut the knee and ankle instead of the back of the knee and hips. this breaks the legs without any hesitation.

i know, i did it to somebody in 1990. he was a teammate of mine back in milwaukee. he blocked the throw and jumped away as i cut my legs. the result was a shattered shin-bone in 14 places that required a steel plate and tons of screws to repair. it took him over a year to come back and he was never the same. ill never forget what i did to him and ill never tolerate anybody taking that same chance with another. nor, does it seem, will the IJF.

-resnick

clown.. i have had people try standing chokes on me.. not in europe, but in japan and in korea. i have a very bent-style of playing and in all honesty i lend myself to that type of thing sometimes... i dont blame them for trying something that is PERFECTLY LEGAL.. did i go with those guys again..? hell yes.
fact, a lot of the koreans i went with tried it from that high collar and high lapel grip they like to take. shit, i remember being 17 and training at tohkon with dougie tono.. he put me in 1, and i did everything i could to escape then he smashed me with kouchigari.. it was brilliant on his part.

in all honesty, it isnt shit judo. you have a skewed peception of what skewed judo is. i can see if somebody is putting you in a standing baseball choke and then tries morote seio-- thats gonna break your neck.. but, if he puts the choke on and you cant get out thats a damn good choke, be it on his feet or not.

dont forget, judo comes from JJJ. standing strangles are a very valid technique in JJJ and they do not cause death or severe injudy on their own as techniques like kawazu-gake, kami-basami and wake-gatame do.

my advice to you sir, is keep your head up and your shoudlers back. cause someday you might end-up punching the wrong fella and get your ass beat for it as you find out exactly what a real noose is like.

-resnick

clown,
you just proved how little you actually know. i guess you must also be pissed off to do a regular choke, or an armlock then.. really mad to put somebody in a pin... wow, i never knew that.

it doesnt happen often, but it does happen. and, in all honesty, im fine with that. only once did i get tapped out from it, and i was 16 then. long time ago.

all the same, its a valid part of judo, once again you prove that your too limited in your scope to accept things for what they are. much the same as your view on strength and pick-ups.

-resnick

The sissor kick throw that Cung Le does in San Shou-is that legal? As you can tell I'm a newbie.

"The sissor kick throw that Cung Le does in San Shou-is that legal?"

No. That is a variation of Kani-Basami which Resnick describes above.

If someone gets lucky enough to set a standing choke, just sit down to the mat. It will relieve the pressure and allow you to escape.

My sensei would standing choke me when we would spar and I was not being aggresive, but instead trying to think of what I should do instead of fighting.

It was funny :)

Eventually I learned not to stand there and get choked :)

I've won exactly two matches in the BB division with a standing strangle.

What about a standing guillotine?

(ebi-garami - classified by Kodokan as a form of hadaka-jime. Also known as kubi-jime)

Is this legal in Judo?

Here's link to a drawing of kami-basami, the judoinfo page lists it as an illegal takedown for tournaments. (bluenamer help please and thank you)

http://judoinfo.com/images/nauta/kanibasa.gif

Jack I can't remember if the standing guillotine is legal or not. I'm always asking my coach about legal/illegal techniques - I don't think it's legal but I don't remember, hopefully one of the more experienced guys can help us out.

http://judoinfo.com/images/shime/hadaka_jime.gif