I just read another thread where Shen made a comment about the bond between instructor and student and once that bond was broken it's irrepairable.
I've had a brown belt coming up soon for 5 years. My instructor has asked me to complete a coaches course and a referees course to get a black belt. This has in my opinion damaged the relationship and I may to quit BJJ or go to a different school.
Has anyone been through something similar. Any differening points of view ? Does anyone really think that is the way to get a black belt ?
I just read another thread where Shen made a comment about the bond between instructor and student and once that bond was broken it's irrepairable.
I've had a brown belt coming up soon for 5 years. My instructor has asked me to complete a coaches course and a referees course to get a black belt. This has in my opinion ruined the relationship and I'm going to quit BJJ or go to a different school. I can't respect my instructor now.
Has anyone been through something similar. Any differening points of view ? Does anyone really think that is the way to get a black belt ?
I don’t have a problem with it IF you are not getting the black belt solely for taking the course. If your instructor feels you are ready for black belt AND requires a cocahing course then I feel, in general, that is a positive thing if that is what he requires. I have met more than a few black belts that we’ll say were not exactly stellar at coaching or instructing. At black belt, for someone who is training at a school, a basic understanding of this role is essential. I’m not that a referees course though, is essential.
Further, if you have been somewhat regularly training, 5 years in brown belt is more than enough to receive a black belt.
There are a few BJJ organizations that require coaching training.
Personally I am in favor, assuming everything is on the up-and-up.
I just read another thread where Shen made a comment about the bond between instructor and student and once that bond was broken it's irrepairable.
I've had a brown belt coming up soon for 5 years. My instructor has asked me to complete a coaches course and a referees course to get a black belt. This has in my opinion ruined the relationship and I'm going to quit BJJ or go to a different school. I can't respect my instructor now.
Has anyone been through something similar. Any differening points of view ? Does anyone really think that is the way to get a black belt ?
I don’t have a problem with it IF you are not getting the black belt solely for taking the course. If your instructor feels you are ready for black belt AND requires a cocahing course then I feel, in general, that is a positive thing if that is what he requires. I have met more than a few black belts that we’ll say were not exactly stellar at coaching or instructing. At black belt, for someone who is training at a school, a basic understanding of this role is essential. I’m not that a referees course though, is essential.
Further, if you have been somewhat regularly training, 5 years in brown belt is more than enough to receive a black belt.
There are a few BJJ organizations that require coaching training.
Personally I am in favor, assuming everything is on the up-and-up.
I reckon he runs the coaching and referring course and gets paid that way. I reckon it’s dodgy. I’m also nearly 50 and I don’t see any value in those courses. I think it’d be a funny sport if everyone had to do that to get a black belt.
I just read another thread where Shen made a comment about the bond between instructor and student and once that bond was broken it's irrepairable.
I've had a brown belt coming up soon for 5 years. My instructor has asked me to complete a coaches course and a referees course to get a black belt. This has in my opinion ruined the relationship and I'm going to quit BJJ or go to a different school. I can't respect my instructor now.
Has anyone been through something similar. Any differening points of view ? Does anyone really think that is the way to get a black belt ?
I don’t have a problem with it IF you are not getting the black belt solely for taking the course. If your instructor feels you are ready for black belt AND requires a cocahing course then I feel, in general, that is a positive thing if that is what he requires. I have met more than a few black belts that we’ll say were not exactly stellar at coaching or instructing. At black belt, for someone who is training at a school, a basic understanding of this role is essential. I’m not that a referees course though, is essential.
Further, if you have been somewhat regularly training, 5 years in brown belt is more than enough to receive a black belt.
There are a few BJJ organizations that require coaching training.
Personally I am in favor, assuming everything is on the up-and-up.
I reckon he runs the coaching and referring course and gets paid that way. I reckon it’s dodgy. I’m also nearly 50 and I don’t see any value in those courses. I think it’d be a funny sport if everyone had to do that to get a black belt.
Yes, profit centers can be iffy. But I have seen some stellar coaching training that really helps in that regard. The problem is BJJ has always been “casual” in its approach. My friend who became a Judo instructor years ago had to take some coaching course and said it was stellar in terms of learning how to plan, run classes, assess, and instruct.
I just read another thread where Shen made a comment about the bond between instructor and student and once that bond was broken it's irrepairable.
I've had a brown belt coming up soon for 5 years. My instructor has asked me to complete a coaches course and a referees course to get a black belt. This has in my opinion ruined the relationship and I'm going to quit BJJ or go to a different school. I can't respect my instructor now.
Has anyone been through something similar. Any differening points of view ? Does anyone really think that is the way to get a black belt ?
I don’t have a problem with it IF you are not getting the black belt solely for taking the course. If your instructor feels you are ready for black belt AND requires a cocahing course then I feel, in general, that is a positive thing if that is what he requires. I have met more than a few black belts that we’ll say were not exactly stellar at coaching or instructing. At black belt, for someone who is training at a school, a basic understanding of this role is essential. I’m not that a referees course though, is essential.
Further, if you have been somewhat regularly training, 5 years in brown belt is more than enough to receive a black belt.
There are a few BJJ organizations that require coaching training.
Personally I am in favor, assuming everything is on the up-and-up.
I reckon he runs the coaching and referring course and gets paid that way. I reckon it’s dodgy. I’m also nearly 50 and I don’t see any value in those courses. I think it’d be a funny sport if everyone had to do that to get a black belt.
Yes, profit centers can be iffy. But I have seen some stellar coaching training that really helps in that regard. The problem is BJJ has always been “casual” in its approach. My friend who became a Judo instructor years ago had to take some coaching course and said it was stellar in terms of learning how to plan, run classes, assess, and instruct.
That is interesting. The problem for me is I’m a hobbyist and I have no interest in coaching per se. If I choose to go into coaching then I’d understand getting a coaching course.
Depends if it is a money grab or not. Only you can probably tell. While you might not plan to coach or ref, I think these types of things will benefit you in all honesty.Â
While it is lame, my opinion is just do it. Unless you are not disclosing other stuff that has happened, I wouldn’t consider a relationship ruined only because you have to take a coaches+ref course. Beneficial at best, minor time+money sink at worst.
Can’t tell you how many times I have seen a brown belt at the 1 yard line decide to “punt” the ball. BTW, most of the ones that I know STILL don’t have their black belt and have hopped around multiple times due to being unhappy for X reason(s). Going to someone new as a high brown belt kind of sucks for everyone involved. No new honest instructor will want to give a black belt any time soon.
I just read another thread where Shen made a comment about the bond between instructor and student and once that bond was broken it's irrepairable.
I've had a brown belt coming up soon for 5 years. My instructor has asked me to complete a coaches course and a referees course to get a black belt. This has in my opinion ruined the relationship and I'm going to quit BJJ or go to a different school. I can't respect my instructor now.
Has anyone been through something similar. Any differening points of view ? Does anyone really think that is the way to get a black belt ?
I don’t have a problem with it IF you are not getting the black belt solely for taking the course. If your instructor feels you are ready for black belt AND requires a cocahing course then I feel, in general, that is a positive thing if that is what he requires. I have met more than a few black belts that we’ll say were not exactly stellar at coaching or instructing. At black belt, for someone who is training at a school, a basic understanding of this role is essential. I’m not that a referees course though, is essential.
Further, if you have been somewhat regularly training, 5 years in brown belt is more than enough to receive a black belt.
There are a few BJJ organizations that require coaching training.
Personally I am in favor, assuming everything is on the up-and-up.
I reckon he runs the coaching and referring course and gets paid that way. I reckon it’s dodgy. I’m also nearly 50 and I don’t see any value in those courses. I think it’d be a funny sport if everyone had to do that to get a black belt.
Yes, profit centers can be iffy. But I have seen some stellar coaching training that really helps in that regard. The problem is BJJ has always been “casual” in its approach. My friend who became a Judo instructor years ago had to take some coaching course and said it was stellar in terms of learning how to plan, run classes, assess, and instruct.
I’m not judo person but I’ve heard to get a BB in judo you need to also ref a certain amount of matches?
It doesn't sound too bad to have to go through a coaches course and understanding sport bjj rules. Hobbyist or not, it's nice to know how to answer some basic tournanment rules and learn how to teach. Neither a bad skills?
As blabbermouth also asked, how much are the courses? Is the reffing courses IBJJF or his rules course?
When I got my judo black belt. I took an instructors course. Definity worth it, taught me how to plan and run my classes, first aid, and how to train kids based on the national governing organization in my country. I’ve been refereering for several years prior to my black belt. All these helped me as an instructor.
Unless, these courses are ridiculeously expensive. I think there are good things to help you expand your knowledge of the sport.
SpeedKing9 - While it is lame, my opinion is just do it. Unless you are not disclosing other stuff that has happened, I wouldn't consider a relationship ruined only because you have to take a coaches+ref course. Beneficial at best, minor time+money sink at worst.
Can’t tell you how many times I have seen a brown belt at the 1 yard line decide to “punt” the ball. BTW, most of the ones that I know STILL don’t have their black belt and have hopped around multiple times due to being unhappy for X reason(s). Going to someone new as a high brown belt kind of sucks for everyone involved. No new honest instructor will want to give a black belt any time soon.
Good response. It does seem pretty slack to go to a new gym at brown belt level. I suppose another option is wearing a blue belt at a new gym.
All BJJ black belts should be competent coaches and, as a bare minimum, have an understanding of the rules.
An IBJJF (ugh) ref’s course is $60
Assuming the instructor course isn’t a total cash grab, I don’t see the harm in that either.
To flip the question: How are you going to be a black belt in a sport for which you can’t demonstrate an understanding of the rules?
In a similar vein, by the time you get to black belt, I would hope you’ve become a leader in your gym and are already passing on your knowledge. What’s wrong with formalizing that (if it’s not a cash grab).
Finally, and once again assuming it’s not a massive cash grab), if your relationship with your coach who brought you from white to black is so weak that you’re ready to throw it away over simple stuff like this, well…
A black belt is more than just a skill level. You are a representative of that academy and that instructor forever. And vice versa. Going to a new school would reset that completely. If you truly are unhappy with the relationship then I would leave, but if it’s just a minor course, I would stick around.Â
All BJJ black belts should be competent coaches and, as a bare minimum, have an understanding of the rules.
An IBJJF (ugh) ref’s course is $60
Assuming the instructor course isn’t a total cash grab, I don’t see the harm in that either.
To flip the question: How are you going to be a black belt in a sport for which you can’t demonstrate an understanding of the rules?
In a similar vein, by the time you get to black belt, I would hope you’ve become a leader in your gym and are already passing on your knowledge. What’s wrong with formalizing that (if it’s not a cash grab).
Finally, and once again assuming it’s not a massive cash grab), if your relationship with your coach who brought you from white to black is so weak that you’re ready to throw it away over simple stuff like this, well…
Listen fren, I do jitjitz best for streetfight not coqphaggot rules. But for you fren when you coach me I give clockchoke unnastan?
I just read another thread where Shen made a comment about the bond between instructor and student and once that bond was broken it's irrepairable.
I've had a brown belt coming up soon for 5 years. My instructor has asked me to complete a coaches course and a referees course to get a black belt. This has in my opinion damaged the relationship and I may to quit BJJ or go to a different school.
Has anyone been through something similar. Any differening points of view ? Does anyone really think that is the way to get a black belt ?
Steve, firstly, I want to say that I don’t know your coach or his ethics on running his Academy. I assume (correct me if I’m wrong) that you like and trusted his guidance enough to get to brown belt. It’s sad to see that the “giri” has been broken, and I don’t know the full story. So with that in mind;
I’ve graded 11 Blackbelts in my time coaching and I am so proud of each and every one of them. They have given me as much as I’ve given them.
Blackbelt is a very personal thing and everybody gets it for overcoming different hurdles. However as a general principle, the head Coach of the school will design the path to take into consideration what she/he thinks is important lessons to pick up on the way. I have 4 boxes that need ticking for Blackbelt (in general);
Participate or organise a Community Service event
To be proficient at the Helio Self-Defense System
To be proficient at the gripping systems/be confident on their feet to the ground.
To understand Coaching and assist new people for 10 lessons with me.
These are the things that important to me, that I want my Black Belts to have experienced. Bearing in mind that White to Black Belt is 10 years on average, I wouldn’t say that is excessive.
Of course every individual is a different case and I’m surely not going to make a Therapist do community service or a Judo Black belt master my gripping program. Sometimes I might push someone nervous to compete once before blackbelt, or get a young competitor to do a Referee course in order for them to understand and respect Referees.
Lastly, a good team is a good community at the end of the day; People who trust the other people around them and come in for the positive vibes and get better at Jiu Jitsu. The Coach has to decide what makes that community and it might not be the right one for you. However, I believe an important part of the path to blackbelt is giving back to the next generation so they can continue to provide the community and challenges you need to enjoy Jiu Jitsu. It’s a cycle.
Just my opinion and how I run things. It’s taken a LOT of thought and it continually changes. I hope you and your coach can discuss this and if it doesn’t work, you need to find a place that works for you - your Coach will understand.
All BJJ black belts should be competent coaches and, as a bare minimum, have an understanding of the rules.
An IBJJF (ugh) ref’s course is $60
Assuming the instructor course isn’t a total cash grab, I don’t see the harm in that either.
To flip the question: How are you going to be a black belt in a sport for which you can’t demonstrate an understanding of the rules?
In a similar vein, by the time you get to black belt, I would hope you’ve become a leader in your gym and are already passing on your knowledge. What’s wrong with formalizing that (if it’s not a cash grab).
Finally, and once again assuming it’s not a massive cash grab), if your relationship with your coach who brought you from white to black is so weak that you’re ready to throw it away over simple stuff like this, well…
All BJJ black belts should be competent coaches and, as a bare minimum, have an understanding of the rules.
An IBJJF (ugh) ref’s course is $60
Assuming the instructor course isn’t a total cash grab, I don’t see the harm in that either.
To flip the question: How are you going to be a black belt in a sport for which you can’t demonstrate an understanding of the rules?
In a similar vein, by the time you get to black belt, I would hope you’ve become a leader in your gym and are already passing on your knowledge. What’s wrong with formalizing that (if it’s not a cash grab).
Finally, and once again assuming it’s not a massive cash grab), if your relationship with your coach who brought you from white to black is so weak that you’re ready to throw it away over simple stuff like this, well…
Its been a while since I got my BB but if my memory is correct dont you need to take a refs course to get a cert from the IBJJF?
Or maybe that was only if you wanted to compete.
Its been a while so hopefully someone can clarify.