although many have said they do not care about his upcoming fight, we cannot deny what royce has done for jiu-jitsu when it comes to fighting other grappling styles. he fought a very large and powerful dan severn who fought under the title of greco roman. he relived the battle that his father and kimura had by fighting an olympian....yoshida. now he is fighting one of the greatest sumo wrestlers of all time. it is cool to see royce put jiu-jitsu against the other great grappling arts to show how powerful it is in terms of grappling. he might not be a sjj legend, but he is a legend when it comes to doing what GJJ does best....fighting.
unreg is correct. That was a fact that tons of TMAers still throw in my face and there's really no counter to that argument.
He also showed what happens when you fight against a bunch of strikers who wouldn't know a sprawl from their own arsehole.
But he opened the eyes of a lot of people, me include about the usefulness of grappling in a duel/fight. I was a decent wrestler, many of my friends were good wrestlers and Judokas as well and I was absolutely convinced that any decent Brown Belt in Karate could just completely kick my our respective asses.
He is the reason I got to be a big MMA fan. I was blown away by his technique and his ability to beat bigger guys. He showed the world that ground fighters will almost always beat standup fighters, while everyone was sure it was the other way around.
He will have a great legacy.
royce vs. akebono is as gimmicky as it gets. this is nothing more than a circus match that will somehow glorify gjj for the legion of jockriders out there. akebono has no clue what to do on the ground. and if royce wins, it'll "prove" that gjj is superior to sumo, a sport rooted in japanese tradition with absolutely no emphasis on striking.
if royce loses or draws, they'll point out the huge weight and height advantage to lessen the blow. isn't gjj's selling point that an undersized individual can overcome a much larger opponent through technique? if so, why does royce claim victory if it ends up a draw, like he said? he should be able to defeat the akebono, who has barely any striking OR ground experience.
i've had enough of these royce vs. traditional martial artists matchups. i wanna see him against the cross trained fighers.
If it wasn't for Royce then all you naysayers would still be training in Tae Kwon Do, Aikido and/or Ninjutsu.
You don't have to like him but show some respect.
"Having an older brother that is part owner of the organization you fight for"
So when Nogueira, Penn, Shaolin, Bustamante, Sperry etc. win with a BJJ submission, it is because they know the owner?
Royce was the first BJJ pioneer and opened the doors for others (like the ones I mentioned) to showcase BJJ to the world.
man,..there are some serious haters on this thread. Dissing Royce Gracie? Get a grip.
I think poodollar has laid down some great points.
"unreg is correct. That was a fact that tons of TMAers still throw in my face and there's really no counter to that argument."
So you are saying that Dan Severn and Ken Shamrock did not know how to grapple or sprawl?
the UG is great. sudo beats butterbean and the entire UG talks about how great sudo is. wasn't that a gimmick? the UG loves to forgive their favorites. what is the difference between the two matches.
royce being a grappler from a style that nobody heard of until 1993 has faced grapplers from all the major grappling styles. how many TKD guys fought top level boxers and top level muay Thai fighters? not k-1 guys but the best from thailand and holland?
hell, he fought saku tough when saku was destroying everyone. stop hating on royce and give credit where credit is do.
Damn, Kai is a loser.
"He also showed what happens when you fight against a bunch of strikers who wouldn't know a sprawl from their own arsehole."
Ken Shamrock didnt know a sprawl? Dan Severn didnt know a sprawl? Keith Hackney was pulled into guard, so sprawling wasnt an issue.
You annoy me more than words sometimes. You try to come off like an expert but your posts reveal such ignorance that it is hard to stomach.
Don't hate on Royce b/c of Rorion.
Royce has accomplished more for himself and for MMA than about 95% of all the fighters today -- even the one's that could clean his clock. Royce (and Rorion) put MMA on the map. He may not be the greatest fighter ever, but he's a pioneer.
"now he is fighting one of the greatest sumo wrestlers of all time. it is cool to see royce put jiu-jitsu against the other great grappling arts to show how powerful it is in terms of grappling."
come on now this isn't the 80s. the days of traditional MA vs. traditional MA to prove superiority are OVER. fighting one of the greatest sumo wrestlers will prove what? that gjj, a martial art with actual effectiveness on the street, is superior to a sport involving two fatasses trying to toss each other out of the ring? please tell me your trolling.
royce's legacy is that he introduced the effectiveness of gjj to the US along with rorion. i'll give him that. but wouldn't you rather see him fight against the actual fighters?
amen to andre
"He also showed what happens when you fight against a bunch of strikers who wouldn't know a sprawl from their own arsehole. "
Judo Gene was doing this for years, yet no one wants to give him any credit. I remember reading about Judo Gene when I was a kid beating up boxers and karate guys. Yet everyone thinks Royce showed the world. Any Wrestler in the early 90's already knew they could beat a tkd blackbelt.
Yeah, well, Gene never did it on TV so rightly or wrongly he's pretty much irrelevant to the development of MMA.
Royce ain't though.
yes, i'd say that the sudo-butterbean fight was gimmicky as well. but look at some of the fighters he's fought in addition: royler, marquadt, ludwig...actual well-trained mixed martial artists. royce fought sak tough a few years back. i respect that. but yoshida? yoshida again? now akebono? all with special rules? wouldn't you rather see royce in the middleweight division? i'll guarantee you that the majority of this forum would jizz their pants to see royce fight against some of the top fighters in his weight division. as a matter of fact, royce has been outweighed in every fight he's been in with the possible exception of ichihara.
"royce being a grappler from a style that nobody heard of until 1993 has faced grapplers from all the major grappling styles. how many TKD guys fought top level boxers and top level muay Thai fighters? not k-1 guys but the best from thailand and holland?"
the sport has evolved. stop living in the past. it's no longer about style anymore. bjj has proven its effectiveness against those arts that don't emphasize ground fighting. and i'm not denying that royce is a pioneer.
Andre: I'm not here to be your friend, and I'm not here to agree with anyone.
UFC 4 was the end of Royce in the UFC, his victory over Severn was pretty damn amazing, but again, I'm speaking from my experience and my thoughts on seeing Royce Fight back then.
I was just completely baffled that no one, and I mean NO one knew how to sprawl.
Also as far as Ken x Royce I, I was not fortune enough to see it until around... 1999 or so. For I started watching it on PPV with UFC 2 and as we all know, we were up to about UFC 15 by the time UFC 1 came out on video.
Anyways, you can call me ignorant all you want, but Severn and Shamrock were the two few exceptions in the early UFCs.
And again, having your brother as the 'fight director' and organizer of the first 4 UFC and even having a ceremony to honor their dad made it more seem like an Infomercial than a Competition.
Now, that doesn't really mean shit to be completely honest, the people that Rorion got for the most part were legit Champs in their own ways, along with Art Davies' occasional freakshows, but there were still a few that were turned down along the way that could have been a real problem for Royce (Steve Smith for one).
PS: Thanks for calling me a loser and resorting to what every other person on here resorts to when arguing with me: Ad Hominem.
WAIT A SECOND!!! yoshida fought silva and gave silva a tough as hell fight. so tough that i would even say he has a legit chance of winning a rematch. not that he would win, but he has a chance. yoshida proved himself to be a legit fighter.
i like how asking for less rules....constitutes special rules....lol! shame on royce for making it less of a sport
None of that means that Rorion set up the fights for Royce. From those present, it was a random draw.
Anyway, the point is that you bash the Gracies and Jiujitsu any chance you get, even when you are wrong such as now. Plus, the sprawl would have played no differently had any of Royce's oppts known how to do it. He almost always upper body clinched and tripped, and when he couldnt get the guy down that way, he pulled guard and still armbarred the shit out of them.
Have you taken a day's worth of BJJ? I'm just wondering about your credibility.