The OG is filled with sh!tty weight loss advice

I really can’t believe that for being on a forum about a combat sport, that there are so many people that are clueless about diet and nutrition. From people starving themselves to lose weight, to people thinking that you can put anything on a salad and it is healthy, the ignorance is unbelievable. People are making this shit way to hard.

CICO. Calories In Calories Out. This is the beginning and the end of weight management. There is more nuance than this, but in the most simplistic terms this is what you need to focus on. I’ll go into more detail below but you need to understand CICO follows the law of thermodynamics and this doesn’t change no matter what. To lose weight you need to burn more calories than you take in. Period. Metabolic adaptations can occur, but the more likely reason you aren’t seeing weight loss when you think you are eating in a deficit is, because you are not tracking accurately.

The tools you will need for success are: Discipline, a calorie tracking app, and a food scale. If you forget your discipline one day/meal it isn’t over. Just get back on track RIGHT AWAY. Not “next week”, “after the weekend”, etc. The next time you eat, make it count and do it right. For calorie tracking apps, the most popular is MyFittness Pal, but I found it to be laggy when typing something and generally poor performance. I’ve since swapped to Chronometer and it seems to work really well. BTW, this is for the free versions of both. For a food scale, anything from Amazon will work.

Open your search engine and find a TDEE calculator. Enter your shit, and write down what it says your TDEE is. Don’t say you are “extremely active” or whatever if you aren’t. This is the ballpark caloric intake your body needs to keep the lights on. I say ballpark because these calculators are an estimate based on the general population. You may be a little more or a little less, and this number is going to vary from day to day. If you want to find out what your true caloric requirements are, you need to track your weight every day for a few weeks, and be super accurate about tracking your calories over the same period of time. I would suggest no more than roughly a 10% calorie deficit from your TDEE if your goal is to gain/maintain muscle/ lean body mass at any point in all of this. The larger the deficit the faster the weight loss, and the more muscle loss. BTW, when you track your calories and energy expenditure, understand that the calories you “expend” during exercise are not going to be accurately tracked by your watch/phone/fitbit, etc. DO NOT try to “make up for” these calories when counting for the day.

There are 3 macronutrients. Protein, Carbohydrates and Fat. Protein and Carbs have 4 calories per gram, and fat has 9. When you are trying to lose weight/cut and want to keep muscle, you want to eat about 0.8-1gr of protein per pound of body weight. Every meal should be protein focused. How you make up the remainder of the calories is up to you. I would suggest making most of the remainder composed of carbohydrates to help fuel your body. An important factor with fat is that you need to have a minimum amount for proper hormone production. Also since fat has twice as many calories per gram, it can be easier to overeat fat calories. Your goal should be to eat high volume, low calorie foods. This will keep you satiated and help you stay on track.

When people try “Keto”, or fasting, etc and fail, it is because these “diets” are too difficult to adhere to and take more discipline (tool number 1) than most people have. They might see results at first, but that is because of the caloric restriction that takes place. When calories are equated, there is no evidence that fasting or Keto works better for weight loss than a balanced diet with the same calories. Another reason people see immediate results with Keto is that for every 1gr of carbs, your body holds 2-3gr of water. When you reduce carboHYDRATE intake, you lose water weight quickly.

When losing weight, there is going to be a degree of muscle loss along with the fat loss. There are many factors that affect this, but the important thing to understand is that you are going to lose muscle along with the fat. Retaining muscle can be achieved with slower weight loss, keeping protein intake at about 0.8-1gr/ pound of body weight, and regular resistance training (weight lifting).

There are several ways to burn calories. You would be surprised on how many calories are burned by each method. HIIT stands for High Intensity Interval Training. This is something like riding a bike/running at a steady pace, then spiking the effort for 30 seconds (or so) and then returning to the slower pace/effort. MISS is Medium Intensity Steady State, and LISS is Low Intensity Steady State. You can burn just as many calories with LISS as you can HIIT, but the amount of time doing LISS is most likely going to be greater. RT is Resistance training (lifting weights). RT doesn’t burn as many calories as you would assume because the amount of effort that your body needs to put forth is for such a short duration that it doesn’t compare with the above mentioned types of exercise.
Something often overlooked when talking about burning calories is NEAT. Non-Exercise Activity Thermogenesis. This is the moving around that you do throughout the day outside of exercise. Chances are if you have an office job, you are not getting much NEAT, and if you have a manual labor job (like construction) then you are getting tons of NEAT. Neat accounts for more of a caloric burn than any of the above methods of burning calories, but I wouldn’t count it alone to meet your fitness goals.

Stop starving yourselves, enjoy a balanced diet, move your ass and get healthy.

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I don’t disagree with anything you said. However:

You underestimate the effect of fasting.
You overestimate the efforts required for fasting.
Fasting is easy, is obviously cheap, and will bring the quickest results, which is extremely positive for those with significant obesity.
On top of that, fasting will reset things like ghrelin and mind-gut relationship. And will shrink your stomach lumen size once you start eating again.

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Wordy, but probably very useful for me. Will go back to it, thanks for posting.

You dietary OP? I do need to speak to someone about nutrition, very serious, got some issues. Need to establish a dietary routine, I’m a complicated case. Extensive (not typical) gi surgery in past, but I have a food allergy profile that sucks. Makes it tough.

Honestly wish there was a flavorless, tasteless shake I could pound three times a day for perfect nutrition. I wouldn’t eat a single thing beyond that. I have no taste buds anymore (covid?). Everything tastes like nothing really.

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Is it basically “Stop eating and drink water for a week”? Cause that doesn’t sound easy; especially if someone is working out etc.

For people that are extremely obese it might be helpful, but fasting is not a long term solution to maintaining a healthy relationship with food, and is far more difficult than eating foods that you enjoy in moderation while getting all of your micro and macro nutrients.

Well, the first 2-3 days are notoriously difficult. But you can do mild training after that. Your body adapts from using sugar to fat. Performance is not the same, but enough to keep muscle.

Obviously some choices need to be made. You lose about 1 pound per day while fasting. If you’re morbidly obese, losing that excess weight is the priority.

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Thanks man.

I’m not a dietitian, just someone that went through a weight loss “journey” and spent hundreds of hours learning and researching the proven science backed methods to be healthy again.

In the last year I went from being 6’1" 250 down to 205, and now building muscle at 213 and about 17%BF. I also won a national competition at my gym (its a boutique gym with over 300 franchises).

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Correct, obviously. However, your relationship with food changes dramatically after fasting. There are 50 such examples on the OG fasting thread (and hundreds in my practice). Most people actually crave a salad or a fruit after fasting instead of pizza or a burger.

So I recommend everyone to start off with a fast then transition to what you propose.

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Put up a sample meal schedule for 1 day.

My guess is that the majority of guys on here are overweight and NOT morbidly obese.

That is why I think that promoting a healthy balanced diet is better than promoting something that is not as sustainable long term and doesn’t apply to as wide of an audience.

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It’s not even for morbidly obese individuals, it’s for anyone who wants to see results quickly.

I’ve tried for ages to propose a sustainable diet to patients. But in the best case scenario, they lose 2lbs per week, which is great, but discouraging for those who have 80lbs to lose. Most lose motivation.

Fasting will get you down quickly, during which life choices can be implemented and education gained regarding diet, macros, etc…

That said, I agree with all your points and will not derail this thread further.

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That would be hard for me to do as my calorie needs and the foods I enjoy are different than yours or anyone else’s. What I am promoting is tracking your food intake for at least enough time to become aware of your food choices and the amount of calories that you are eating in a day, and their macro/ micro nutrient profiles.

A little bit of self education from tracking your meals is really eye opening at first.

For my meals I eat about the same foods no matter if I am cutting or bulking. I just change the portions to fit my needs. Here is an example of my staples:

Meal 1: Greek yogurt with whey protein and either fruit or granola mixed in
Meal 2: Quick oats with a banana, blueberries, cinnamon and honey
Meal 3: 2-4 whole eggs and 100-200gr of egg whites. I either have a whole grain English muffin or 2 with this, or I mix the eggs and some zero calorie coffee syrup (Skinny Girl butter toffee flavor) and soak 3 pieces of bread in it and then make french toast in the waffle maker. I don’t use maple syrup often but when I do I use the zero sugar 15kcal/serving one.
Meal 4: left over meat from the previous night’s dinner along with rice or pasta
Meal 5: Chicken or ground turkey or pork chops or salmon or tuna, or lean red meat cooked with minimal oils/ dressing and mostly spices, along with either sweet potatoes, pasta or rice and some kind of veggies
Meal 6: I always have a cup of fat free cottage cheese before bed to help MPS (Muscle Protein Synthesis)

i IF daily simply for energy related purposes, as to not crash during my work day

ill also do 1 or 2 day fasts just to “reset” my body after a weekend of drinking and eating like a slob, smoking, etc.
never did full on multi day fasts though

i understand OP made a Weight specific thread, but just wanted to mention other benefits of fasting itt
i have a super high metabolism, so I actually look to keep my weight on

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I find it hard to believe that the same person that loses motivation by eating healthy foods they enjoy in moderation is going to have the discipline to not eat anything for days at a time on a consistent basis. I’m not a doctor, but I have enough interactions with people in my day to day life and at the gym that are trying to lose weight to understand human nature.

Ghrelin has a huge part in weight management

T levels have a huge part in weight management

Sleep and nutrition have huge effects on those.

Calories in/Calories out is a useful abstraction and probably the useful 20% of the 80/20 that is “how do I lose weight.” Saying CICO is the only thing that matters is not true. Might be the most important thing. Definitely not the only thing

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Its not to be long term, are you talking lifestyle or weight loss. Those are different topics, what you suggest is good for weight loss yes, lifestyle for sure.

Fasting for weight loss must then go into proper diet and exercise for health. Just like any diet. Its a lifestyle that manages it long term

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Coming up on my one year mark after deciding to get really serious about my overall health. I’m 5’11". Have gone from 24% body fat down to 18%. 236 lbs down to 168. Planning on doing maintenance when I get down to my goal range of 155-160.
I work out 2x daily…I run 1 mile every morning plus stretching. In the evening, I lift (push-pull-legs) 6 nights weekly, and do comprehensive stretching & muay thai.
The thing that has helped me most overall is the restriction of the “atkins” or low carb diet. It really removes the guess work. I eat the same thing daily for breakfast, mostly the same thing for lunch, and then something that falls within the guidelines of the diet for dinner. Lots of veggies, salmon, chicken, etc. I get that it’s CI/CO for the most part. But the restriction and LACK of options has really helped me. It’s often viewed as a negative in dieting, but it’s really allowed me to come this far.

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I never said it is the only thing that matters. It is the only possible way to lose or gain weight.

You mean like fighters and wrestlers?