training etiquette

I am cross faced all the time and it makes a better competitor. I can typically withstand most cross faces regardless of weight, I am so used to it by now. But I get cut up in the meantime and I have professional job and it looks bad. The crosface is a distraction while you set something else up or you dont know anything and its done in frustration.

On the street no problem with friends who have families, jobs, no dental plans, etc... its a problem.

I am glad you all remember the secret handshake. i do use it to this day with new people. Use it and be proud my secret fraternity of brothers/sisters.

I have no probs at all with the crossface.

LIMMER your back I saw you on another post. How's it going? Where've yah been lately? I haven't seen you on the forum in awhile.

Wiley

"....Thos who use the cross face a lot usually get a certain stigma associated with them at clubs. "dirty fighter, so and so is to rough, nice face you must have been rolling with Ge%#y"

Wiley, I think you're getting what he does mixed up with a crossface. Limmer is correct, nothing wrong with a crossface as long as it's done right.

I get the feeling there are a few different definitions of crossface being used in this discussion. I think Wiley and Big Killer mean: "A" has "B's" back. "A" puts forearm directly across "B's" nose/mouth and secures it as one would a choke to get the opponent to tap or else have their nose/teeth broken. Another definition would be where "A" has used their forearm to turn "B's" head in one direction and is using controlled pressure to create a "cranking" effect similar to a twister. I think the first is just sloppy/mean and the second is legitimate technique. What do you all mean by "crossface"?

Potential for injury and the degree of that injury needs to be factored in. When endorphins are rushing and and adrenalin is pumping, the line between 'okay' and 'injured for life' can become very blurry.

Neck cranks, heel hooks, etc. have proven to be difficult to gauge and easy to harm over the course of time, and so are respected and controlled in their application.

This is the same reason thumbing someone in the eye or trying to rip their nutsack off is respected and controlled (usually banned). Sure, the other person can tap when they feel pressure on their eyeball or pain in their nads, and if they don't, we can blame them, but usually wiser heads prevail and such stuff is left out of general rolling.

If there's a chance you're going to crack a guy's neck or tear his ACL, you better be on your best sunday school behavior.

As rene.r points out, it's hard to judge how far to go with a heel hook, as well as how long to wait before tapping to one. Best policy with these is probably "catch and release". That way you can learn to perform/defend them without the injuries.

like scarface said "how it is applied can be a little uncalled for". I think what techniques you do in training is up to you and the guys you train with. If you feel safe with them then do whatever you want. Every time I roll I know there is a certain amount of risk and I accept that and never hold anyone to blame if injured as long as they don't cross the line.

Wiley, good to hear from you. I just got the major work done on my car. Been nursing an ankle injury but won't be long. Will probably come up there soon to see you guys.

Limmer,

Once you know if your gonna come down let me know via email. I will do my best to make sure I am there. I hope all is going well at the new location. Sorry to hear about your ankle injury. Who knows one day you might unexpectedly see me my mug around your club.

only have a problem with people who intent to hurt you both men and women, but so what? and then there are those that are just 'rough', so as long as you know that it isn't personall,it's all good. proper etiquette means different 'things' to different people, some will go farther/further than others. communication will solve a lot of issues. if you have a 'bad shoulder' tell your partner, and if you do get hurt don't take it personally. You did your best... injuries come with the territory... 'abandoning' certain techniques though isn't very productive...but what do i know


cheers

if my training partners aren't doing everything they can (that's legal) to escape my submission or make make me tap than they are cheating me.....if i have someone in my guard and he wants to escape or set something up I WANT him to shove his forearm into my throat, put his hands on my face or dig his elbows into my thighs...if he's not doing everything he can than i am not going to get better.....

word up gord96...word up

i don't think cross facing or heelhooks are dirty...what i do think is dirty is being guillotined by a guy 50 lbs heavier then you and when he still doesn't have it sunk he tries to rip your head off and you can hear your neck start to crack... also
i don't how many of you have seen this but when your also in someones guard and they grind your face into there knee ... that is cheap as well as grinding the hip bone into someones eye socket from north south... again cheap

Apparently sticking your tongue in your partners ear is also considered a No No.

Who Knew!

Uh, I knew that.

**rolling my eyes**