"Maybe the zero tolerance policy of the Boston diocese isn't the best solution"
How can any Catholic stand for this? I am shocked. I really am. This after today's report that about 4% of priests have been accused of pedophilia, and about 7% of the Boston priests. Report details a "homosexual sub-culture" in the priesthood. But no zero tolerance?
"Maybe the zero tolerance policy of the Boston diocese isn't the best solution"
yeah...it is a horrible horrible thing. what i can't get is how does the law not prosecute??? they have reports of 815 abuse cases in Boston alone and how many of those priest have been brought to trial by the Criminal system!
both the act and the lack of care by the government in Massachutes are truely disgusting.
not to change the subject, cause the real issue is the pain and torment that the victims have had to go through, but how any Massachuttes politician on a local boston level, to state, to federal, can't demand a criminal investigation and prosecution, and death penalty is beyond my comprehension.
if Joe Smith from the boyscouts did this to one child, every boyscout leader across Massachuttes would be under scrutiny, but 815 counts in Boston alone has gotten what one Priest to resign?
"what i can't get is how does the law not prosecute??? "
The Church shields them, and has admitted as much. I think the whole Catholic Church should be brought to trail ala the mafia, because at this point they are a criminal organization (not made up entirely of criminals) because their memebers commit crimes and then hide under the umbrella of the Church
Joe, it was on Fox News this morning. Some guy in Italy was saying the Vatican just released this report. So I have no link
Jason...we can't do that..cause there are tons of Catholic priests that don't condone(sp?) this behavior or the behavior of the coverup, but love and care about the catholic church and it's principals!
i think its clear from my post history that i have no love for alot of the Catholic theology, but i do consider most catholics my brothers in christ and support their efforts around the country and around the world.
so to bring retaliation and punishment against the organization would be horrible.
however i would completely support a organization wide investigation to find out who covered up what and how and persecute them to the enth degree of the law
were are those people now that tries to label homosexuality as a mental disease? where is the moral outrage?
I am more than outraged. However I disagree that them living a life of celibacy morphs them into pedophiles. I'd like to see what Moses would have suggested as punishment.
homosexuality WAS labeled a mental disease until 1976, when the clssification was changed for political, and not scientific, reasons. But that's beside the point of this thread
"Jason...we can't do that..cause there are tons of Catholic priests that don't condone(sp?) this behavior or the behavior of the coverup, but love and care about the catholic church and it's principals"
If you're in the Mafia, you're part of a criminal organization, it doesn't matter if you commit the crimes yourself or not. The tithes of millions of people are going to support organized pedophilia, and these people are allowing it to continue. I consider Catholics my fellow Christians too, but I don't understand how they can continue to give their money and their children to this organization, when the Church is saying flat out that it will not condemn a crime against children and God.
You can't tell me that there aren't priests in the Church right now who don't know something about evidence against the pedophile priests, but are keeping quiet because the Church tells them to. That's organized crime. Its the textbook definition. They're suppressing evidence, tampering with witnesses, moving criminals from one jurisdiction to another to escape prosecution, and there's a flow of money up a chain to a small group at the top. Its clearly organized crime, as defined by the laws of the US
"I'd like to see what Moses would have suggested as punishment. "
Death was the Old Testament punishment for almost all sex crimes. Completely appropriate for a Cardinal who molested 250 small children, ruining thousands of lives in the process
"when the clssification was changed for political, and not scientific, reasons."
wrong Jason, it was not for political reasons, it was because it was obvious that to keep labeling homosexuality a mental disease were incorrect and had no scientific support whatsoever.
Fudo, don't hijack this thread, please. Various gay organizations lobbied heavily to get the classification changed by psychiatric groups. We'll talk about it somewhere else if you want to start a thread about it
"Fudo, don't hijack this thread, please."
sure thing it´s your thread. but if you answer me back, I take that as a sign that you want to continue the discussion. If you don´t want that, don´t reply.
"Various gay organizations lobbied heavily to get the classification changed by psychiatric groups."
So? Feminists has lobbied for equal rights aswell, so with your logic if they hadn´t done that, they should still be hold inferior to men. and rightfully so.
"We'll talk about it somewhere else if you want to start a thread about it "
nevermind, it´s not that an issue for me that you belive in incorrect things. keep believe what makes you happy.
that is so childish. If it wasn't an issue, why did you even try to correct me in the first place?
well, first of all, it was you that commented on something I said eventhough you thought it was irrelevant (and I didn´t think it was irrelevant, but since it´s your thread-you´re the boss)
And I corrected your statement because it implied something that was false and it then became an issue, but not a big issue though. so as I also said, we can let it rest if you prefer.
ok, well I seriously would love to talk to you about that issue, since I am 100% convinced that homosexuality is a mental disorder, but I'd like to do it somewhere else.
To bring this thread back to the point:
If you are a Catholic, could you please tell me how this makes you feel? Knowing your tithe money is going to shield pedophiles? I'm not bashing the average Catholic at all; its the organization I have a problem with. And i'd really like to get some inside views on this. thanks
"Funny that someone with minimal to no formal education in psychology or science can rationally convince themself that homosexuality is definately a mental disorder"
and how did you learn all about my formal education in psychology? (I have some college education in in, btw)
I can see now that this thread has been pretty much driven off course, so I'm just going to drop it
i was raised roman catholic.i have attended the same church my whole life,as have my parents.i remember my attending a catholic grade school as some of the happiest times in my life.i felt God to be always over my shoulder.attending mass at my church is as peaceful/spiritual experience as it gets for me.
i have visited a few catholic forums.with regards to the issue of abuse,i think i speak for many catholics when i say it is shocking and saddening.how could those that are entrusted to lead us let satan himself into the church?my heart and prayers go out to those who have been affected by this and NO explanation i have heard for the reasons for allowing this to perpetuate are acceptable,none.i don't give rat's ass what some shrink said,if they where trying to protect their fellow priests,the church,whatever.DOESN'T WASH.
should these people be forgiven?sure.BUT... those responsible MUST go for the church to regain any credibility.
that said i have no intention of abandoning my church either.i need to separate at times the physical from the spiritual aspects of His church.God himself turned my life completely around 7 yrs ago after having drifted away.the GOD and SAVIOR i prayed to,worshipped at,and learned of at THIS church as a child and young adult.i feel decent catholic christians need to stand up, not run away.
LOL!!!! Keep running Jason...keep running...
Its pretty crazy to say they need to bring a whole organization on trial for what 4-7% of them do. It does not suprise me at all to see satan infiltrating the church. He already has the world, and if he can get into the church, he can give something the world to look at and say "oh those catholics, they are perverts, organized pedophilia and such..."
I attended a baptist church for most of my young life, my family left this church over the very issue we are discussing here, because we felt the victim was being sweeped under the carpet. So its for sure not an issue that is catholic only. However, that being said, Satan will infiltrate the churches ranks when possible. His intentions are to cause dischord and dissent in the body, make the church look bad, bring up accusations and tempt people.