"Just don't know martial art skill when they see it".
You mean like most people who post on TUF?
Ben
At one point, I wanted to dabble in Aikido. Then I saw a class...
As others have stated, it's not a fighting style. It's geared towards self-defense. But I feel there are better options out there for SD such as KM. I shouldn't have to become a blackbelt, something that takes years, to be proficient at SD. If you want to be a fighter, I'd spend my time elsewhere. If you want to learn SD, I'd say the same thing.
originalSEAL: I think KM is basically watered down muay thai and Gracie Jiu-jitsu. The self-defense curriculum of Gracie Jiu-jitusu is far more developed than KM, at least how it was taught to me by Helio, Rorion, Ryron and Rener Gracie.
That being said, if something goes "wrong" when attempting one of the standing Gracie Jiu-jitsu moves (which really just come from the old judo/jujutsu self defense), you'd better learn judo to know how to deal with a moving, resisting opponent, moving in 3 dimensions. (hence me trying to learn judo, starting about 2 years ago).
The military and LE version of KM is taught all over the world. Self-defense is not rocket science. Unfortunately, many orgainzations play the politics and money game, which may dilute the SD cirriculum. SD should incorporate pre-conflict and post-conflict methodologies, besides the conflict stage -- this is not commonplace. Sadly, there are SD schools, including the style of KM, that don't teach these principles.
I could care less what the school is called. As long as they teach self-defense correctly, it's fine. A few months of SD classes should give you a better chance of survival. You can't say that about every SD school.
"I used a GJJ technique 2 years ago perfectly against resistance, simply because most people resistance is soo predicatable. And the type of resistance was the one Royce told me about. And it worked."
Now this is definitely true. The one thing (actually two things) about people (human beings) is we are habitual and predictable. We do alot of things by habit and we are very predictable in every sense of the word.
If you push a person, nine times out of ten they will push back. And that action, or in this case reaction can be used against them.
And that is the reality of the "principle" behind Judo. Judo works because it takes advantage of the natural reactions of people. And that's what make the SD techniques of Gracie Jiujitsu work. It really comes down to the individual "understanding" the principle behind the techniques.
did a year of aikido (and some other TMA jjj "standing joint lock" based styles). i also have many years of more practical training (like judo) and 10 years as a police officer. a couple of observations, from the cage, and the street.
a lot of those strange aikido/jjj moves actually work like magic on the street. except when they don't, you end up with nothing, and you better have a good "high percentage" move to follow up with, or he's going to beat your roof in. as noted above, often works great against drunks, surprise opening move etc. can be very tough to execute against someone with any real grappling/full contact experience.
these moves are often based on real fighting principles. but their level of execution tends be much lower, because judo's live resisting opponent training methodology is much more efficient. and of course, the live training FORCES you to tighten and sharpen your technique (unless you like getting punked at the dojo every day).
ironically, these techniques actually work MUCH better if you have the timing/speed/skills/attributes of a judoka/kickboxer etc. to actually make it work.
like i said, these moves are based off real martial arts principles. i use the off angle footwork used aikido all the time. unfortunately, i didn't understand how to use it until my boxing coach showed me and i did a lot of rounds of hard sparring :)
What are my views on aikido? WHAT?.....are MY views?.....on?....AIKIDO?
The martial arts, (and all athletic endeavors for that matter) are where theory is applied to reality. With aikido, reality took a walk one day, and simply never came back. And by the all accounts, it's practitioners never seemed to notice.
WARNING: watching the following video may cause sadness.
doesnt judo incorporate techniques very similar to akido. I did a little akido and found the moves virtually identical to goshin-jutsu.
Now here is Ueshiba.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YQ7LozQDAaY
A very good martial artist and probably, an otherwise decent man. But, just a man, and prone to getting caught up in the same misguided human silliness as any of the rest of us....if we are not careful. He was not so careful, and today, we have new aikido "masters?", upping the anti, and escalating their claims. Until that terribly real, and yet, metaphorical punch in the mouth.
If you haven't seen it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bQeUkUO5ZPo
Now the director's cut, with commentary by Mr. Speilberg....(ie: better angle)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7jf3Gc2a0_8&mode=related&search=
dakuan,
Yes! But goshin jutsu is the theorhetical(kata), and randori is the real. Shiai is where the theory is constantly tested. A hundred years without testing and you have aikido. Where people fall down at the slightest nudge, or sometimes without any nudge at all.
ashy nailed it.
"And that is the reality of the "principle" behind Judo. Judo works because it takes advantage of the natural reactions of people. And that's what make the SD techniques of Gracie Jiujitsu work"
Tahdaaaaaaahhh!! Thats why BJJ is Judo, 100%.
Ashy,
You make a very good and legit point. BUT the difference between Ueshiba and the guy in the video is Ueshiba actually had years of experience testing and applying his skills in real situations.
Both Ueshiba and the man who he learned some of his skills from, Takada, tested their skills against all comers. This is one of the reason why both were highly respected and known martial artist in their day.
Ueshiba taught Aikido over a period of 50 years. The his earlier generation of student were "tougher" and more "seasoned" in regards to actually using their skills in real life situations because they were regularly forced to used and apply their skills in real situations, which I understand was the custom among martial arts schools in Japan. In the early years of Aikido both the art and its founder were subject to testing by critics and skeptics.
Ueshiba's latter generation students rode on the success and reputation of both Ueshiba and Aikido and didn't put their skills to the test like Ueshiba's earlier students.
I've heard many martial arts schools and teachers, in the past and present, have been shamed and put out of business in Japan because they couldn't stand-up to scrutiny.