A woman here has been banned from leading prayer at a County Supervisors meeting. What a crock. Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof;
You gotta be kidding me. You're the guy who wants creationist out of schools even if they don't mention a specific sect of religion but you want a Wiccan witch to make a mockery of prayer by leading it's invocation. Are you just being provacative?
It's not like the original founders at the federal, state and local level were wiccans and had wicca in mind. Lame.
We all know that prayer is completely unique to Christianity, right?
Oh yea, it isn't.
Before Donna or someone else flips out, let it be known this is classic liberal strategy. You make a thread title that is shocking and grabs forum member's attention, then they click and get nothing of the sort. You could have just as reasonably said "person barred from leading prayer" or "witch barred from leading prayer" but that wouldn't be any fun would it? Yes, a "wiccan witch" was barred from leading prayer. Call the police!
On the same subject, I have always wondered why woman were treated poorly in the bible. I understand why this happened throughout history, as men were stronger and could force their will upon the physically weaker sex.
Fathers giving their daughters away like propery is weird.
bludhall, the bottom line is that people (unlike animals) are religious by nature. Period. Men and women strive to make some sense of life and death. It is impossible to innoculate and detach a person from their spiritual views. We can try to minimize the role of religion in public life (which usually just increases the ignorance and proselytizing of secular humanist) or we can (as the founders envisioned) allow people to engage in the public forum w/out having to have their religion underground.
Further, critical thinking should be able to distinguish between constructive and destrustive religious philosophies. The problem here is that the liberals on this forum act like all religions are equal (well actually like Christianity is the worst of religions).
Helwig is correct.
"...the liberals on this forum act like all religions are equal..."
Which one(s) are superior?
Before Donna or someone else flips out, let it be known this is classic liberal strategy. Yes, it's called exposing a double standard. It doesn't matter if a liberal uses it or if I use it.You're the guy who wants creationist out of schools even if they don't mention a specific sect of religion but you want a Wiccan witch to make a mockery of prayer by leading it's invocation. So you support exclustion of prayer from the public sector? I'll remember that. You get freedom of religion, as long as it's mine.
So a satanist she be allowed to lead prayer invocation crescent?
If you want to be consistant. If you want to be a hypocrite then no. Why do you want special treatment?
I say if they want a certain sect to lead their prayers, then they can pick a certain sect to lead their prayers. It isn't like they aren't entitled to their own opinions. Wicca is not a very big religion, doesn't have many adhearnts, and I am sure there are no wiccans on the council, so why should they be forced to let her lead prayers when they don't feel comfortable with her religion.
Rev has caught the correct...
Conn, the religion that is "superior" is that religion which is true. which is Christianity of course. Biblical Christianity.
My religion is superior, or else I would follow another one :)
Why is it superior?
Any particular sect or just Christianity in general?
I say if they want a certain sect to lead their prayers, then they can pick a certain sect to lead their prayers. But is that Constitutional? why should they be forced to let her lead prayers when they don't feel comfortable with her religion. Why should they be the ones to determine what religions can be expressed in a public forum? Isn't that the kind of discrimination that I hear day in and day out by, well, rooster? How you can teach about Muslim studies in school but can't teach anything about Christianity. I wonder if the nonchalance would remain if you replaced "wicca" with "Jewish".
"If you want to be consistant. If you want to be a hypocrite then no. Why do you want special treatment?"
If not thinking a satanist or "wiccan witch" should be leading prayer in America makes me a hypocrite, then I will take hypocrite. How about I make up my own religion and then demand to lead an offensive and baseless prayer at a public gathering? Who will champion MY cause?
You know I am getting really sick of all of the asshole type comments on this board. If people don't start treating each other better, I'll just shut the whole thing down.
I am not an idiot, and I personally think prayer should not be in government meetings. However a group of people should be allowed to have whoever they want to say prayers for their meeting. If there was a wiccan member of the council, then he or she, should be allowed to have their minister come and lead prayers. So should the Jewish, or Muslim, or Hindu council members. If no one on the council is wiccan, why should they have a wiccan prayer? Just because they are public servants doesn't mean they have some obligation to practice another religion in public.
If they were making some law that say there is no acceptence of Wicca as a religion, or to not give the Wiccan church non profit status. Or not let them build their building, that would be un constitutional. But this doesn't seem like that at all. Maybe I am misunderstanding things, but it seems pretty simple.
I'm with rev about praying at the meetings, for the very reason that it brings out this hypocrisy. I would also agree that were the council to do the praying then the council could dictate the prayer.
However, the woman was going to the public forum as a citizen of the county. She would say her prayer as a citizen of the county, of which there is at least one wiccan. It wasn't necessarily only for the benefit of the council.
I didn't get that, I personally don't like that kind of thing at all.
What if I made up a religion that essentially was considered harmful (there are all kind of cults out there). Should I be able to walk into any public forum and request everyone give me the right to state my prayers etc and require that they LISTEN?
You guys...your ready to condemn someone like Judge Moore for having the 10 commandments in a public forum, but by God, let the Wiccan witch chant her incantations...sheesh.
this reminds me of the Romans...ban and kill Christians and make a horse a member of congress (go Peta, go earth worshippers)...