#1 Thai National Pride is equal to or even more ingrained than Japanese Imperialism; I’ve seen people at cinemas beat up and arrested for not standing up to the video of the king. I’ve seen gamblers tear up rings and bottle westerners who won fights. I don’t think logically it could have happened. (besides the lack of proof)
#2 The thai’s wouldn’t have fought them without clinch and elbows - the Japanese would never have survived that (especially at the time too, watch footage of Kyokoshin at that stage). A few thai’s fought for money (dives) outside Thailand against japanese at that time and the government took it pretty damn seriously. The later Japanese used judo pretty effectively though, but that was not the first wave.
#3 The Japanese could barely beat the local thai champs they took to the world championships in Fighting Black Kings, under Kyukoshin rules. That was much later than Oyama claimed too.
It took a while till they were actually doing “Kickboxing”, produced Meijiro etc that they even started looking remotely competitive.
LOL, Rajadamnern is the other "major league" venue, and in fact is older and more prestigious than Lumpinee among the traditionalist. Elder and Dale both fought in Rajadamnern, so that shoots your no farang theory right to shit. I know it tilts your world view to have to face hard truths like the thais losing 2 of the three at lumpinee in 64'. Back up your claims. YAWN..... Let's see some of your documentation, i can produce plenty for my "imaginary" version that i cunningly produced 50 years ago in anticipation of this. YAWN....
#1 Thai National Pride is equal to or even more ingrained than Japanese Imperialism; I’ve seen people at cinemas beat up and arrested for not standing up to the video of the king. I’ve seen gamblers tear up rings and bottle westerners who won fights. I don’t think logically it could have happened. (besides the lack of proof)
#2 The thai’s wouldn’t have fought them without clinch and elbows - the Japanese would never have survived that (especially at the time too, watch footage of Kyokoshin at that stage). A few thai’s fought for money (dives) outside Thailand against japanese at that time and the government took it pretty damn seriously. The later Japanese used judo pretty effectively though, but that was not the first wave.
#3 The Japanese could barely beat the local thai champs they took to the world championships in Fighting Black Kings, under Kyukoshin rules. That was much later than Oyama claimed too.
It took a while till they were actually doing "Kickboxing", produced Meijiro etc that they even started looking remotely competitive.
This is the lone loser and founder of meijiro, kurosaki vs Rawee Dechachai. 1964-2-17, Lumpinee stadium. Meijiro was already a powerhouse by the time Elder and Kvalheim were fighting.
#1 Thai National Pride is equal to or even more ingrained than Japanese Imperialism; I’ve seen people at cinemas beat up and arrested for not standing up to the video of the king. I’ve seen gamblers tear up rings and bottle westerners who won fights. I don’t think logically it could have happened. (besides the lack of proof)
#2 The thai’s wouldn’t have fought them without clinch and elbows - the Japanese would never have survived that (especially at the time too, watch footage of Kyokoshin at that stage). A few thai’s fought for money (dives) outside Thailand against japanese at that time and the government took it pretty damn seriously. The later Japanese used judo pretty effectively though, but that was not the first wave.
#3 The Japanese could barely beat the local thai champs they took to the world championships in Fighting Black Kings, under Kyukoshin rules. That was much later than Oyama claimed too.
It took a while till they were actually doing “Kickboxing”, produced Meijiro etc that they even started looking remotely competitive.
For a second there I thought this was actually a reasonable discussion, where we read each others posts.
If you want to peddle BS, keep it up. When you started talking about Rajadamnern being the same as Lumpinee…well, that’s a dead give away. Good luck with your internet research.
School me on rajadamnern, please! Let's see a listing of the thai stadiums that denoted the "major league". LOL at internets research. How's that corroborating evidence of yours coming along? I've shown you two of the three matches from lumpini, complete with the kurosaki elbow K.O.
"#2 The thai's wouldn't have fought them without clinch and elbows - the Japanese would never have survived that (especially at the time too, watch footage of Kyokoshin at that stage). A few thai's fought for money (dives) outside Thailand against japanese at that time and the government took it pretty damn seriously. The later Japanese used judo pretty effectively though, but that was not the first wave."
LOL. I'll tell you a little story of how those fake matches really went down. They were much later than the beating the thais took at the hands of kyokushin in 64,(ouch!) and were arranged by a japanese impressario who insanely claimed that he had invented muay thai by combining savate and traditional karate, which resulted in death threats from the thais and them screaming bloody murder, which was of course, the whole point, The impressarios end game being a huge closed circuit showdown in Vegas, which obviously never took place. The "fights" took place in japan and were televised here in the states during one of the saturday sports programs, i think it was the wide world of sports but don't remember precisely. They were advertised as being "world championship" fights, which caused some thais living here to have a cow and they contacted the thai embassy about it, which was forwarded to their foreign secretary who brought it up to their cabinet.
I saw one of these matches where a big guy threw powder into the eyes of his smaller opponent to blind him but the small guy still landed a bunch of flying kicks and secured a neck crank submission for the win.
