"Jiu-jitsu practice differs from either boxing or Western systems of wrestling in that it proceeds on the assumption that in ordinary life, should one be so unfortunate as to become involved in a personal encounter, one would usually be fully dressed. For that reason many, though not all, of the tricks taught necessitate holds upon portions of one's advesary's clothing - sleeves, lapels, belt, etc. - in contradistinction to say catch-as-catch-can or Greco Roman wrestling, in which the contestants, if not naked, wear such close-fitting garments that it is impossible to clutch them. It would, however, be a grave error to suppose that the jiu-jitsu man is necessarily at a loss even when the antagonist is nude from the waist up."
Professor Yukio Tani, circa 1910.
Winner of over 500 challenge matches in London after the catch as catch can and greco roman wrestlers refused to believe that jiujitsu was real from mere demonstrations
I ascribe to the school of thought that prefers techniques not dependent on clothing (though they're certainly worth learning) because these techniques work with and without the extra handhold, whereas clothing dependent techniques are a bit more limited in application.
I have used hip toss before in 1 fight...it was more of a headlock hip toss back in my HS days. I think the HIP/HEADLOCK toss and the DOUBLE LEG takedown are the most useful and USED techniques in real fighting. Even guys that don't know how to do it can pull it off.
the hip/headlock is the the dumdest move/tech ever
but it is the must commonly used move/tech too
i dont think it is very effective but it is good to know especially how to counter it
A buddy of mine did a Sayoc imitation where I carried 8 knives on me, then we hit the ground, to see how to position myself in order to get to one of my folders, while he tried to get one of them.
He gets the takedown, I go to guard and...ALL my knives fall out of me (my pants, my boots, my jacket, etc.). So much for weapons-retention.
This Yukio Tani guy must have seen Chris Haueter's Street Jits tape, ripped off his idea, and gone back to 1910!
Yeah, good to train both, but gi is very applicable, especially since guys usually go out with a jacket at night... at least up in the frigid North where I live...
This just made me think... in pro fights I see there are guys who fight wearing only trunks and maybe shoes... but I've never seen a gym where people habitually train topless. I mean, that would be really weird, wouldn't it? Going out two nights a week to wrestle with the guys, just wearing spandex shorts?
lol! true story though! Funniest part was that they all fell out simultaneously. Just remembering it makes me laugh. Makes me laugh too when I remember the look on Armando's face (my instructor) when all the knives fell out.
As funny as it was it taught a great lesson: the number of weapons you carry has an inverse relationship with the ability to retain those weapons in a fight.
In other words, the more you carry, the lesser your ability to retain what you're carrying.
Ironmongoose: I'm not trying to be a dick, but when someone mentions Yukio Tani and Chris Haueter in the same sentence, I have to put my 2 cents in and state that they were at VERY different levels.
Ironmongoose: I'm not trying to be a dick, but when someone mentions Yukio Tani and Chris Haueter in the same sentence, I have to put my 2 cents in and state that they were at VERY different levels.
"A buddy of mine did a Sayoc imitation where I carried 8 knives on me, then we hit the ground, to see how to position myself in order to get to one of my folders, while he tried to get one of them.
He gets the takedown, I go to guard and...ALL my knives fall out of me (my pants, my boots, my jacket, etc.). So much for weapons-retention."
Wow. They should make some sort of clip or something to hold the knives in place. It might actually make some money.
You have to give him credit though, 4 Ranges has his imitations down. All of the knife situations I have ever seen / trained stop as SOON as all the knives fall out. We then put all of our knives back and try again. It is rare that people go for knives after they have been taken down and the knives fall onto the ground. I say screw the knives and go for the tap or nap. Then the ref will break you apart once your opponent has tapped and you get your hand raised. O wait, I got sport fighting mixed up with survival training again.
Yeah go for it! I have no background in Sayoc whatsoever, but I've done some research on their methodology and just thought "hey, why the heck not?" So I invented this drill to see how feasible it was to carry 5-7 knives. I think I was carrying 5 of varying sizes. All had clips.
The idea behind the drill was that I was supposed to be moving against a wrestler, pummeling, avoiding takedowns, etc. I could only go for any of my knives once we clinched or hit the ground.
He wasn't supposed to know where my knives were, while I tried to go for them while retaining them. He could, however, frisk for them, and get them if he found them.
It was just so eye-opening when he went for the double, my back hit the ground, and ALL my craftily hidden knives fell out (yes, even the one I hid in my Timberland boots). We stopped the drill because we couldn't stop laughing LOL!!
Armando came walked by us with this look of "What cocka-mamey drill are you doing now?" Before he could say anything, he picked up one of my knives off of the ground and said "wow, nice knife!" Put it in his pocket and walked away.
Lesson learned in multiple-carry and multiple opponents.
FatBuddha, no argument from me. I was just amused because I heard the same comments on the Haueter Street Jits tape, which I'd been looking at just last week.
the jujutsu gi single weave alone tucked in some jogging pants is da bomb or also short shave your head this alone will improve you as a person like the buddha guy who digged simple robes and the simple life jkd,karate,etc. should not just be a sport,xtraining,mma,selfdenfence,it has to be a way life or its all for nothing thats why if your blackbelt in whatever dosnt matter u should restart from square one just like a videogame by doing something stationary like yoga and slo like taichi to fully live for the moment wich is the luv of ma