Hate420 - You have angered all the 11 year old Irish OP. Good job.Because Gunnar is Irish and all
Damn.
What's so wrong with some fine horse meat?
(Jooooooooke)
In for before and after pics
Jack London -carcaju -Jack London -carcaju -something random -carcaju -Gunnar might be clean but Roger's veins had veins.
The same argument could be made for Roger Gracie too. I bet he didn't do a day of work in the weights room when he first started, instead focusing on mma skill acquisition and translating his bjj for mma, and just leaning down to middleweight where he looked shit. Now he is back at LHW and actually looks like he has done some weights. I had a similar transformation (albeit less veiny!) through doing cardio circuits, hiit training and training bjj 6 days a week and REAALLY sticking to a good diet. Got a six pack that was fairly visible, pecs got a bit bigger, traps and shoulders and arms all cut up. Dropped about 8kg but swapped a lot of fat with muscle too.
Gunni was always an undersized welterweight, and never looked like he did any form of weight based training, so it definitely could be just noob gains like I got.
Perhaps, but the actual transformation was hardly stunning. It's like dad bod to kinda toned and cut. Not like he was Uberreeming the place down. That shit was just insane.I met Roger Gracie back in his Strikeforce days, he was surprisingly big even back then. He looked lanky when I saw him on TV but was fairly thick solid and tight in person.
He must look like a fucking giant now?
Hardly. He was never ripped, infact never had any definition at all in his fights. Now, he just looks like he has leaned down and toned up, but still obviousl;y has his naturally big frame. He had all sorts of veins popping out of his upper chest and shit though, hence why people thought he has been on the sauce.Nah dude, perhaps I didn't phrase it right. When I met him he was a lot bigger in person than I'd expected. Big frame is correct, I'm 6'2 and about 215 pounds and I felt quite small next to him.
I'm just saying if he's bulked up now he must be a really big fella, cause he seemed pretty damn big to me years ago when I stood next to him.
I have no speculation on roids, none of my business what anyone else does or doesn't do.
Yeah, he is definitely a big guy. Always competed at heavyweight in BJJ. That's why I was stunned when he dropped to 185 for hs second UFC fight. Just too big of a cut for a guy that is so big.
As for the bulking up, he just looks cut, and swapped the flat physique for a toned look. Similar to Gunni. In fact his arms kinda looked really thin. It looks like he lost weight from eating super clean and started doing a bit of strength and conditioning and hiit training. Not heavy lifting.
superlurker2011 -rudiger - I never understood why this forum feels like big traps are so hard to buildI definitely don't think Gunnar is on roids, but traps are ridiculously hard to build. You either have them or you don't.....or you buy them.
As someone who was a personal trainer during college years, must disagree on this one- traps are usually among the fastest growing muscle group in almost every guy I trained, they fill out quickly.
The most common mistake people make is too much weight with crappy form. Or they're not doing any cleans/pulls.
Granted if you have unrealistic expectations (ie roided goldberg traps)then yeah your probably need more time and "supplements." Also muscle insertion points and muscle belly shapes are genetic.
Nahhhh
Jumping to assumptions faster than my ex's!!
semtex0809 - In for before and after pics.
carcaju -Fighting in Asia. Looking ridiculously different with what seemed like some body acne (stream was grainy) .Jack London -carcaju -Jack London -carcaju -something random -carcaju -Gunnar might be clean but Roger's veins had veins.
The same argument could be made for Roger Gracie too. I bet he didn't do a day of work in the weights room when he first started, instead focusing on mma skill acquisition and translating his bjj for mma, and just leaning down to middleweight where he looked shit. Now he is back at LHW and actually looks like he has done some weights. I had a similar transformation (albeit less veiny!) through doing cardio circuits, hiit training and training bjj 6 days a week and REAALLY sticking to a good diet. Got a six pack that was fairly visible, pecs got a bit bigger, traps and shoulders and arms all cut up. Dropped about 8kg but swapped a lot of fat with muscle too.
Gunni was always an undersized welterweight, and never looked like he did any form of weight based training, so it definitely could be just noob gains like I got.
Perhaps, but the actual transformation was hardly stunning. It's like dad bod to kinda toned and cut. Not like he was Uberreeming the place down. That shit was just insane.I met Roger Gracie back in his Strikeforce days, he was surprisingly big even back then. He looked lanky when I saw him on TV but was fairly thick solid and tight in person.
He must look like a fucking giant now?
Hardly. He was never ripped, infact never had any definition at all in his fights. Now, he just looks like he has leaned down and toned up, but still obviousl;y has his naturally big frame. He had all sorts of veins popping out of his upper chest and shit though, hence why people thought he has been on the sauce.Nah dude, perhaps I didn't phrase it right. When I met him he was a lot bigger in person than I'd expected. Big frame is correct, I'm 6'2 and about 215 pounds and I felt quite small next to him.
I'm just saying if he's bulked up now he must be a really big fella, cause he seemed pretty damn big to me years ago when I stood next to him.
I have no speculation on roids, none of my business what anyone else does or doesn't do.
Yeah, he is definitely a big guy. Always competed at heavyweight in BJJ. That's why I was stunned when he dropped to 185 for hs second UFC fight. Just too big of a cut for a guy that is so big.
As for the bulking up, he just looks cut, and swapped the flat physique for a toned look. Similar to Gunni. In fact his arms kinda looked really thin. It looks like he lost weight from eating super clean and started doing a bit of strength and conditioning and hiit training. Not heavy lifting.
If eye tests were the only criteria he fails 100%
The only reason one would assume Roger isn't on peds is simply because we didn't see him inject or a failed result from Asia.
Probably the most obvious case of visual ped use since Overeem, Lombard and Sherk.
Neither of us have drug tests to prove it but seriously what is more likely?
Its amazing what some strength and conditioning can do. If you train and eat right you will get jacked. You will be lean but definitely thicker and more defined. Only training and no strength training will keep you strong but you will get skinny
Keto Diet meng Keto Diet Joe Hogan on it too brah
Movement coaches bro...
It's gotta be diet and exercise because it's easy to have those gains at almost 28 in about 4 months time
shawarma -carcaju -Fighting in Asia. Looking ridiculously different with what seemed like some body acne (stream was grainy) .Jack London -carcaju -Jack London -carcaju -something random -carcaju -Gunnar might be clean but Roger's veins had veins.
The same argument could be made for Roger Gracie too. I bet he didn't do a day of work in the weights room when he first started, instead focusing on mma skill acquisition and translating his bjj for mma, and just leaning down to middleweight where he looked shit. Now he is back at LHW and actually looks like he has done some weights. I had a similar transformation (albeit less veiny!) through doing cardio circuits, hiit training and training bjj 6 days a week and REAALLY sticking to a good diet. Got a six pack that was fairly visible, pecs got a bit bigger, traps and shoulders and arms all cut up. Dropped about 8kg but swapped a lot of fat with muscle too.
Gunni was always an undersized welterweight, and never looked like he did any form of weight based training, so it definitely could be just noob gains like I got.
Perhaps, but the actual transformation was hardly stunning. It's like dad bod to kinda toned and cut. Not like he was Uberreeming the place down. That shit was just insane.I met Roger Gracie back in his Strikeforce days, he was surprisingly big even back then. He looked lanky when I saw him on TV but was fairly thick solid and tight in person.
He must look like a fucking giant now?
Hardly. He was never ripped, infact never had any definition at all in his fights. Now, he just looks like he has leaned down and toned up, but still obviousl;y has his naturally big frame. He had all sorts of veins popping out of his upper chest and shit though, hence why people thought he has been on the sauce.Nah dude, perhaps I didn't phrase it right. When I met him he was a lot bigger in person than I'd expected. Big frame is correct, I'm 6'2 and about 215 pounds and I felt quite small next to him.
I'm just saying if he's bulked up now he must be a really big fella, cause he seemed pretty damn big to me years ago when I stood next to him.
I have no speculation on roids, none of my business what anyone else does or doesn't do.
Yeah, he is definitely a big guy. Always competed at heavyweight in BJJ. That's why I was stunned when he dropped to 185 for hs second UFC fight. Just too big of a cut for a guy that is so big.
As for the bulking up, he just looks cut, and swapped the flat physique for a toned look. Similar to Gunni. In fact his arms kinda looked really thin. It looks like he lost weight from eating super clean and started doing a bit of strength and conditioning and hiit training. Not heavy lifting.
If eye tests were the only criteria he fails 100%
The only reason one would assume Roger isn't on peds is simply because we didn't see him inject or a failed result from Asia.
Probably the most obvious case of visual ped use since Overeem, Lombard and Sherk.
Neither of us have drug tests to prove it but seriously what is more likely?
Well given I have made the same gains in around 6 months through purely starting strength training via circuit and hiit training, as opposed to just bjj, and upping bjj to 6 days a week, I know 100% it can be done naturally. He looked very vascular though, which certainly raised some alarm bells. The honest truth is that I am just not well educated enough on the subject to really have an informed opinion. I would like to believe he is not using, am I suspicious, yes. But as I said, I made some impressive gains completely naturally through quitting drinking, eating super clean, and training hard/starting hiit and circuit and tonnes of walking on top of training 5 to 6 days a week bjj.
CRE - He started eating a piece of dark chocolate each night.
LMAO
carcaju -If you believe Roger wasn't on the special sauce, then I've got some Creatine ethyl Esther to sell you, my friend.
The same argument could be made for Roger Gracie too. I bet he didn't do a day of work in the weights room when he first started, instead focusing on mma skill acquisition and translating his bjj for mma, and just leaning down to middleweight where he looked shit. Now he is back at LHW and actually looks like he has done some weights. I had a similar transformation (albeit less veiny!) through doing cardio circuits, hiit training and training bjj 6 days a week and REAALLY sticking to a good diet. Got a six pack that was fairly visible, pecs got a bit bigger, traps and shoulders and arms all cut up. Dropped about 8kg but swapped a lot of fat with muscle too.
Gunni was always an undersized welterweight, and never looked like he did any form of weight based training, so it definitely could be just noob gains like I got.
carcaju -I can't divulge too much, but believe me when I tell you that Roger was on the special sauce brah.Jack London -carcaju -something random -carcaju -Gunnar might be clean but Roger's veins had veins.
The same argument could be made for Roger Gracie too. I bet he didn't do a day of work in the weights room when he first started, instead focusing on mma skill acquisition and translating his bjj for mma, and just leaning down to middleweight where he looked shit. Now he is back at LHW and actually looks like he has done some weights. I had a similar transformation (albeit less veiny!) through doing cardio circuits, hiit training and training bjj 6 days a week and REAALLY sticking to a good diet. Got a six pack that was fairly visible, pecs got a bit bigger, traps and shoulders and arms all cut up. Dropped about 8kg but swapped a lot of fat with muscle too.
Gunni was always an undersized welterweight, and never looked like he did any form of weight based training, so it definitely could be just noob gains like I got.
Perhaps, but the actual transformation was hardly stunning. It's like dad bod to kinda toned and cut. Not like he was Uberreeming the place down. That shit was just insane.I met Roger Gracie back in his Strikeforce days, he was surprisingly big even back then. He looked lanky when I saw him on TV but was fairly thick solid and tight in person.
He must look like a fucking giant now?
Hardly. He was never ripped, infact never had any definition at all in his fights. Now, he just looks like he has leaned down and toned up, but still obviousl;y has his naturally big frame. He had all sorts of veins popping out of his upper chest and shit though, hence why people thought he has been on the sauce.
And it's not the first time he has been either.
Fair play to him. Everyone is on it on ONE it seems, and even the time when he was on it (the Tim fight), everyone then was juicing (and I suspect Tim, but I can't say with proof at all).
Roger is a nice dude with a huge frame. I'm a heavyweight and he's got a bigger frame than me. Amazed he ever made middle.
But yeah, sauce brah.
Kmbmamba - Movement coaches bro...Surprised nobody else picked up on this.
I mean fair play people thinking he's natural, it might very well be the case. However, as others have pointed out, there is some mitigating factors to consider;
- As others have pointed out, traps are very androgenic and respond the quickest to PED use along with shoulders.
- I'm not sure why it's taken as a fact that he never did any sort of strength or functional training before; as if all he did was padwork and rolling. Dude trains near 24/7 with Connor, who also did a lot of functional and body weight training even before Ido came around.
- Had 5 months for transformation. Is it possible? Sure, for genetic freaks. Based on visual structure, Gunnar never struck me as one with a significant predisposition to muscle and hypertrophy aka your classic mesomorph. He's just basically gone Ecto to Meso in 5 months; gaining muscle and losing fight all at the same time, whilst fitting in all those martial arts training along with strength training. When you consider that amount of strength training needed for such changes, and factor in MMA training and conditioning on top, that's a lot or training and fatigue.
- Very vascular, which can also be a sign of PEDs.
- Had increased "muscle tonage" (muscle hardening), and that one is very tough to get quickly. You're either genetically predisposed to it (we all know at least one person who has that natural "hard rock" look to their muscle, whilst others don't, even after years of training) or not. It doesn't just appear out of nowhere.
- Training mainly in Iceland it seems. Haven't heard of WADA carrying out any random drug tests outside of the US and a few in Brazil. Certainly none in the EU, though I may be wrong.
- Let's not underestimate the wide use of PEDs in MMA anyways. We already know it's widely used, even till now.
So is it possible he's all natty? Possibly. There's always outliers. But factor in all the above, and the probabilities don't look too good.
Amagov_Couldve_Been_King -Kmbmamba - Movement coaches bro...Surprised nobody else picked up on this.
I mean fair play people thinking he's natural, it might very well be the case. However, as others have pointed out, there is some mitigating factors to consider;
- As others have pointed out, traps are very androgenic and respond the quickest to PED use along with shoulders.
- I'm not sure why it's taken as a fact that he never did any sort of strength or functional training before; as if all he did was padwork and rolling. Dude trains near 24/7 with Connor, who also did a lot of functional and body weight training even before Ido came around.
- Had 5 months for transformation. Is it possible? Sure, for genetic freaks. Based on visual structure, Gunnar never struck me as one with a significant predisposition to muscle and hypertrophy aka your classic mesomorph. He's just basically gone Ecto to Meso in 5 months; gaining muscle and losing fight all at the same time, whilst fitting in all those martial arts training along with strength training. When you consider that amount of strength training needed for such changes, and factor in MMA training and conditioning on top, that's a lot or training and fatigue.
- Very vascular, which can also be a sign of PEDs.
- Had increased "muscle tonage" (muscle hardening), and that one is very tough to get quickly. You're either genetically predisposed to it (we all know at least one person who has that natural "hard rock" look to their muscle, whilst others don't, even after years of training) or not. It doesn't just appear out of nowhere.
- Training mainly in Iceland it seems. Haven't heard of WADA carrying out any random drug tests outside of the US and a few in Brazil. Certainly none in the EU, though I may be wrong.
- Let's not underestimate the wide use of PEDs in MMA anyways. We already know it's widely used, even till now.
So is it possible he's all natty? Possibly. There's always outliers. But factor in all the above, and the probabilities don't look too good.
" As others have pointed out, traps are very androgenic and respond the quickest to PED use along with shoulders.
"
-what? Lots of bro science here.
Bro Science?
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10664066
This was literally posted on this page a few post above.
Just because you may not be aware about it, doesn't make it "bro science".