Is Mike Tyson the most overhyped fighter of all time?

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There are a few ways to view Tyson, but that view is most likely skewed by your age and whether or not you were old enough to appreciate what you were seeing at the time. It can also be skewed by whether you are a boxing fan in the sense of you watch the fighters of your generation, or if you saw the fighters of the past.

For me, Tyson COULD have been one of the, if not the best ever. However, he is not. I view him as I view Bo Jackson. I am glad to have been around to see it myself and not just highlights after the fact. Pre-injury, Bo looked like he could one day be in BOTH the NFL and MLB hall of fames. The potential was insane… but we will never know.

Tyson was similar, had Cus lived long enough to steer Tyson’s career through his entire prime and ALSO keep Tyson’s dumb ass away from the elements and out of prison, who the fuck knows how this conversation would be going right now. With Tyson’s head on straight and Cus in the corner, maybe Tyson walks through Buster and then tears Holyfield apart in the first round. Or maybe it goes just as it did… we will never know.

To ask if Tyson is one of the greatest should always be answered as “No, but he might have been…”
To ask if he is the most overhyped? Well, that depends on if the person you are asking was old enough to appreciate and understand what was happening at the time, and not just try to sift through the ashes of what could have been. I NEVER saw a match that got me pumped like a Tyson match.

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Yeah, I like the discussion so I keep commenting. We aren’t that far off in our view of Tyson.

I think that the same thing happens with Holmes that happens with Roberto Duran in the view of people that are my age or younger. I’ll be 53 this year. Most people my age had never really heard of Roberto Duran before he fought Sugar Ray Leonard. SRL was the babyface that brought gold home in the Olympics and had been fighting on television screens for years by the time he won his professional belts. Along comes Duran. Duran mugs him in their first fight and viewers see SRL lose for the first time. He gets the immediate rematch, “No Mas” happens and the rest is history.

What many people hadn’t seen was that Duran had been fighting professionally since 1968, was 72-1 and had NEVER lost at lightweight. He was jumping up TWO divisions to fight the world’s best and beat Ray soundly. Then everyone who hadn’t really known about Duran took notice and he fought with FAR less success going 31-14 the rest of his career winning some and losing some. He won two more belts but his All-Time status had already been cemented for the most part.

Now, you see Duran ranked higher than SRL in probably EVERY legit boxing historians account. People who really only paid attention to him after the first SRL fight would argue crazily that Duran shouldn’t be ranked above him but he should.

Same with Holmes. Yes Holmes had some great performances left in the tank but he was a FAR better fighter years before.

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This is a good post.

I don’t have time to unpack everything now…

I will say that it wasn’t just Cus.
Cus wasn’t even around to see Tyson’s beat years.

It was more about having solid people around him, and flowing Cus’s vision, than Cus himself.

And I’m not downplaying Cus D’Amato’s influence at all.
Cus recognized the potential, laid the foundation that capitalized on Tyson’s abilities, and mapped the path going forward.
Tyson loved Cus, and Camille.
But he also loved guys like Jim Jacobs, who was yet another member of Tyson’s support group who died.

And it wasn’t just that Tyson went from having “great people” behind him, to nobody.

He went from having great people behind him, to black supremacist street thugs.
Guys that would line up rails of coke for him,at the same time telling him he was the unstoppable KO king of the planet!

Not to mention filling his young mind with all kinds of destructive political bullshit that had nothing to do with boxing.

And I’m not even taking sides on that shit… Just saying that it wasn’t BOXING.

Tyson was undefeated as a professional under Kevin Rooney.
When Jacobs died and Don King MANIPULATED Tyson to fire Rooney…
Within 3 fights Tyson had his first loss, to a guy who is only remembered for derailing the Tyson train.

The rest is history.

And while we would see glimpses of a seriously focused Tyson later – the reality is he was mostly relying on his power – instead of the superior winning gameplan and discipline that made him the youngest HW champ ever.

It wasn’t just the lack of Cus D’Amato man…
It was the introduction of manipulative, money hungry, thugs.
Not to mention Robin Givens and her mom and whatever “shrinks” were prescribing him “don’t give a fuck” pills.

Tyson in the 90s was a shadow of his former self.
The defense, the head movement, the consistent and HARD body work… All diminished.
You would see flashes of it…but never consistent.

People who didn’t actually watch him come up… Don’t really understand the extent to which he devolved.
They think it was all power and intimidation… And they don’t understand the more technical side of it.

Mike Tyson was like a gun.
In the right hands he was a well oiled machine, that when aimed at the enemy was deadly powerful and accurate.
In the wrong hands, his technical ability wasn’t understood and he wasn’t maintained.
He was still extremely dangerous – just not nearly as reliable.

A lot of great trainers and managers might have coached Tyson through at least the first half of the 90s.

Unfortunately, he got gangster Don King and the crew of Yes-men.

Just being a great waste of potential, doesn’t mean he was never great.
He absolutely was.

Also a big “what if”.

We cannot honestly discuss Tyson without looking at the events in his life.

Sure… We can argue that some had it tougher, and maybe they did.

Point is, it’s not a simple story to tell.

Fighters are human beings, and their lives echo in the ring.

Tyson had a hell of a run.

He isn’t the GOAT… But those who underrated him are ignorantly misinformed.

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Have to get to this one later…

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Lee Murray vs Securitas Depot

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Spinks was semi-retired? He must have been semi-retired a while then…he fought twice in 83, once in 84, 3 times in 85, twice in 86, once in 87, then Tyson in 88. Layoffs of 7-9 months appear to be pretty common for most of his run as champion.

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I get what you’re saying about Tyson and Bo Jackson, but Bo played 4 years total in the NFL, and had a COMBINED 1000+ rushing and receiving yards once. Mike won something like 10 title fights before jail and was the consensus best boxer in the world during that time…then came out of jail and still won title fights even though he looked to be a shell of his former self.

So yes, Bo did some amazing shit when he was in the league, but it was so fast. Even though Tyson didn’t realize his true potential, he actually still has a bunch of wins in title fights.

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It wasn’t mean to be an apples to apples comparison, but since you insist on throwing stats out to highlight Bo’s “COMBINED” yardage… next time you hit the caps lock, toss an asterisk next to it.

Point out that Bo NEVER played a full season, missed his true rookie year completely, only played 7 games in his technical rookie year after a year off football, and was also a dual sport player and never got the same carries as other leading rushers.

But for an apples to apples comparison… Bo’s worst average was 4.3 per carry, the same as Barry Sander’s worst. His best… 6.8. Barry’s best was 6.1 and that was in his only season that broke 2000 yards. Emmitt’s lowest avg was 3.8 in Dalls (not counting the 2.5 he put up in Arizona) and his best was 5.3.

But anyway, back to Tyson. I made the comparison to Bo because they were there long enough to show the potential they had, but leave us wondering just how high that ceiling was. Bo was pissed at Tampa and was willing to walk away from the sport since they jacked up his college baseball standing. He also never focused on only football alone.

Tyson, while being champ, never had that rivalry to cement an era. He was somewhat between eras and ruled alone for a short time. Sure, he beat a couple solid named fighters, but by the time he was truly tested, his head was so far from on straight it no longer mattered. I remember the Bruno fight being very interesting, but other than that, every fight I truly remember pre-Buster felt like lambs lead to the slaughter.

For the record, I think even a focused Tyson would have had a hell of a time with Lennox and possibly still Holyfield down the road… but at the time of going to prison, I think had Cus not died and all the shit with Robin not happened, THAT Tyson would have been too much for Holyfield as he first moved up in weight. Evander seemed to get better with age and size and in my opinion was near his best when he got Tyson, who was not far from his worst mentally, and maybe at a 6 or 7 on a 1 to 10 scale physically.

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I don’t think he’s that over hyped in terms of boxing. But he definitely is to the general public in terms of being the baddest man on the planet. People always make comparisons to people street fighting mike Tyson like he couldn’t lose. I feel this way about the sport of boxing as a whole though.

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I agree with what you’re saying about the guys Tyson fought felt like lambs to slaughter, but that’s not really his fault. He took the belts from the guys who happened to be world champs, and beat every legit contender at the time, over a 4 year window. There was no top contender he ducked, he fought the guys who deserved it at the time.

The Holyfield fans act like Tyson ducked him…but Evander wasn’t even at HWT most of Tyson’s run. He moved up shortly before Tyson fell apart. Someone like Spinks was also a champ at a lighter weight, but had a bunch of wins at HWT, was a current world champ at the weight etc…so it’s not like Tyson ducked Evander to fight Spinks…and lots of people fuck up their timelines there.

As for Tyson and Lewis…that one is tough to me, because their primes didn’t line up. Stylistically Lewis is the type to give him trouble, but he made his pro debut in June of 1989, like 8 months before Tyson lost to Doulas. So Tyson’s real run was like Nov 1986-Feb 1990…and Lewis was in title fights from May 1993-Nov 2001. Though they’re the same age, their “prime” was off by a bit. Tyson won his first title fight almost 7 years before Lewis, so I feel like even without jail, Lennox would have gotten an older/shittier version of Mike. If we’re talking prime vs prime, I still think Lewis is about as bad of a matchup as you can find for Mike.

On the Jackson vs Tyson thing…I get your point, but I guess all I really was saying is that Tyson proved much more than Jackson did IMO. We saw Bo’s potential, and he was amazing…but we actually saw Mike do it. I think someone like Terrell Davis might be a better comparison. Short career, but he looked fucking amazing from 96-98, league MVP in 1998, superbowl champ etc. I get what you meant with your comparison, I just think Mike was even more impressive than Bo because he won a bunch of title fights and was the best fighter in the world for several years…so he did realize his full potential, even if it was only for a few years.

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Lewis is indeed a tough matchup for Prime Tyson.

But some things to think about…

Lewis poured it on Tyson for 8 rounds when Tyson was farther past his prime than he was vs Holyfield.
So if it took 8 rounds for Lewis to finish that version of Tyson – how different would it look vs focused prime Tyson?
I can see Lewis getting the decision by avoiding those dangerous exchanges inside.
Not sure he finishes prime Tyson though.
I can also see prime Tyson being much more effective with his counters and hurting Lewis to the body early, changing the flow of the fight.

Lewis was KOd twice by lesser fighters than Tyson.

Styles make fights – but this is another matchup I think there would be more to than many seem to think.

BTW… I heard they are fighting again.
Another exhibition??

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I don’t know that prime Tyson with his head movement and foot speed would have that much problem with Lennox. Tyson didn’t run out of gas and had that mentality that he was the baddest motherfucker on the planet. He was ferocious and had the defensive skill, and chin, to bully Lewis. I would see Tyson as the favorite.

On the other hand, Tony Tucker won a handful of rounds against Tyson and was never in danger so who knows?

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I agree, Lewis got touched and finished multiple times by guys who had no business being world champions. Him losing to Tyson wouldn’t be shocking. I don’t know if Tyson would have been the better fighter, but I could see him stopping Lewis.

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It’s an interesting debate, and I guess that’s the point…so many people think it’s a clear cut “Lewis beats any version of Tyson” and I don’t think that’s the case.

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