Kizer: Why Open Scoring is not ideal

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                                Kizer: Why Open Scoring is not ideal 
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                    <p>In most sports, you know the score. Sunday night, the Patriots were down 24-0 at the end of the first half. The Pats ended up winning the game in overtime 34-31, because it is the destiny of all Boston teams to rule the entire world, from California to, well, Boston. </p>

However, imagine the game if no one knew the score, and instead some guys who never played in a football game were making a determination as to who was playing better football. It would have made for a weird game.

By that logic, many people call for open scoring in mixed martial arts, where after each round judges scores are made public. However, if you check around with professionals in the field, you will find little enthusiastic support for the idea.

MMAJunkie's Ben Fowlkes spoke with the Nevada Athletic Commission's Executive Director Keith Kizer, who detailed two great reasons why Open Scoring is not optimal for the world's fastest growing sport. The first is the potential effect of open scoring on the judges.

Imagine an important fight for a hometown fighter in front of a highly partisan crowd... after three rounds of a five-round title fight, the scores are announced and the judges have it unanimously for the visiting fighter.

“First of all, you could have people throwing beer bottles and all that,” Kizer said. “Secondly, even if they don’t throw beer bottles, the judges – and I’ve talked to some of them about this – they’d be afraid. They’d be looking behind them during the next round. Then the rest of the fight after that, there’s the potential for the judges to be distracted.”

There’s also the potential for the judges to be influenced by hearing one another’s scores, Kizer said. If you’re a judge who scored the first four rounds for one fighter while your colleagues have it more evenly split, “There’s going to be some pressure on you to feel like you should give the fifth round to the other guy.”

The second is the potential effect of open scoring on a fighter. Playing it safe when you are comfortably ahead is not so much the problem. But unlike say Tennis where if you hurt your ankle you are out, in MMA, if sufficient rounds have passed, if you get injured due to an accidental clash, it goes to the judges score cards.

Say, for example, a champion is battering the challenger for the first three rounds of a title fight. Then in the fourth he runs out of gas, fades in the face of an onslaught from his opponent, and barely survives the round. Heading into the final round, we hear the scores announced. It’s 39-37 for the champion. At the start of the fifth, there’s an accidental clash of heads or an inadvertent eye poke. The champ says his vision is blurry. He can’t continue. Even if the judges score that incomplete round for the challenger, the champ still wins a technical decision. Now what are fans supposed to think?

“Either he’s telling the truth, but, you know, you and I won’t believe him,” Kizer said. “Or he isn’t telling the truth, and he managed to keep the belt because he knew he was ahead on the scorecards.”

That potential for abuse, along with the potential for judges to be distracted, might make open scoring a situation where “the cure would be worse than the disease,” according to Kizer.

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If you have no grappling credentials you should be able to judge.
Judges also don't need to be ring side. Judging is better via video feed because of angles.

Also fire Kim Winslow Phone Post 3.0

duckhuntgangsta - Open scoring is a horrible idea. It takes point fighting to a whole new level.

What the sport needs is more dynamic scoring. 10-7 for a one sided beating. 10-8 for a clear victory. 10-9 for a close victory. 10-10 if there was no clear victor.

In this scenario you could be down two 10-9 rounds and come back to and win or draw in the final. If there was a 3:00 or 5:00 sudden victory round all the better. Phone Post 3.0
This, and judges that are better trained and educated. Phone Post 3.0

caseharts - If you have no grappling credentials you should be able to judge.
Judges also don't need to be ring side. Judging is better via video feed because of angles.

Also fire Kim Winslow Phone Post 3.0
Shouldn't **** Phone Post 3.0

duckhuntgangsta - Open scoring is a horrible idea. It takes point fighting to a whole new level.

What the sport needs is more dynamic scoring. 10-7 for a one sided beating. 10-8 for a clear victory. 10-9 for a close victory. 10-10 if there was no clear victor.

In this scenario you could be down two 10-9 rounds and come back to and win or draw in the final. If there was a 3:00 or 5:00 sudden victory round all the better. Phone Post 3.0

This. Dynamic scoring is a good term for it.

Also, it only makes sense to hire non-partial former professional fighters as judges.

I'd also like to see more accountability, and have more of a transparent scoring (post fight, not during) with a 1 or 2 line narrative, something like "10-9 for GSP by positional dominance for 4 1/2 minutes."

caseharts - If you have no grappling credentials you should be able to judge.
Judges also don't need to be ring side. Judging is better via video feed because of angles.

Also fire Kim Winslow Phone Post 3.0
This, they should be watching the fights in a quiet location, not ringside where fans can away their vote and they should have replays and a time to discuss their scores after the fight and change their scores if they were way off, a lot needs to be changed and there should be officials that watch the fights and oversee the ref and judges making shitty calls Phone Post 3.0

Had to throw the lucky win by the Patriots in there...smh Phone Post 3.0

Open scoring is a nice little strawman for Kizer to attack whilst completely avoiding the more serious arguments around the caliber of judges and the undeniable inadequacy of the ten-point must system.

THE CURRENT SCORING SYSTEM IS NOT SUITABLE FOR DETERMINING THE WINNER OF A 3/5 ROUND MMA BOUT.

Until the above fact is acknowledged, terrible decisions will continue to ruin fights and adversely affect fighter's livelihoods.

Libero21 -
caseharts - If you have no grappling credentials you should be able to judge.
Judges also don't need to be ring side. Judging is better via video feed because of angles.

Also fire Kim Winslow Phone Post 3.0
This, they should be watching the fights in a quiet location, not ringside where fans can away their vote and they should have replays and a time to discuss their scores after the fight and change their scores if they were way off, a lot needs to be changed and there should be officials that watch the fights and oversee the ref and judges making shitty calls Phone Post 3.0
Good idea in theory, but taking them away from ringside opens up problems. Like any technical malfunction with the video feed and suddenly there's no way for a judge to score the fight. Phone Post 3.0

I just want the scoring system they had in PRIDE.


You can open it, close it, do whatever the fuck you want to do with it, as long as the fighter that delivered the ass whooping wins..

da Vinci 81 -
Libero21 -
caseharts - If you have no grappling credentials you should be able to judge.
Judges also don't need to be ring side. Judging is better via video feed because of angles.

Also fire Kim Winslow Phone Post 3.0
This, they should be watching the fights in a quiet location, not ringside where fans can away their vote and they should have replays and a time to discuss their scores after the fight and change their scores if they were way off, a lot needs to be changed and there should be officials that watch the fights and oversee the ref and judges making shitty calls Phone Post 3.0
Good idea in theory, but taking them away from ringside opens up problems. Like any technical malfunction with the video feed and suddenly there's no way for a judge to score the fight. Phone Post 3.0
Judging should have to take two watch throughs so that wouldn't matter. As passionate as I get you need a chance to rewatch it before making a decision and they should possibly discuss it too Phone Post 3.0

MrFluffyHippo -
duckhuntgangsta - Open scoring is a horrible idea. It takes point fighting to a whole new level.

What the sport needs is more dynamic scoring. 10-7 for a one sided beating. 10-8 for a clear victory. 10-9 for a close victory. 10-10 if there was no clear victor.

In this scenario you could be down two 10-9 rounds and come back to and win or draw in the final. If there was a 3:00 or 5:00 sudden victory round all the better. Phone Post 3.0
This, and judges that are better trained and educated. Phone Post 3.0
Thats a bingo! Phone Post 3.0

caseharts -
da Vinci 81 -
Libero21 -
caseharts - If you have no grappling credentials you should be able to judge.
Judges also don't need to be ring side. Judging is better via video feed because of angles.

Also fire Kim Winslow Phone Post 3.0
This, they should be watching the fights in a quiet location, not ringside where fans can away their vote and they should have replays and a time to discuss their scores after the fight and change their scores if they were way off, a lot needs to be changed and there should be officials that watch the fights and oversee the ref and judges making shitty calls Phone Post 3.0
Good idea in theory, but taking them away from ringside opens up problems. Like any technical malfunction with the video feed and suddenly there's no way for a judge to score the fight. Phone Post 3.0
Judging should have to take two watch throughs so that wouldn't matter. As passionate as I get you need a chance to rewatch it before making a decision and they should possibly discuss it too Phone Post 3.0
Huh? So you think people and fighters should have to wait for judges to rewatch a fight before they determine a winner? Phone Post 3.0

da Vinci 81 -
caseharts -
da Vinci 81 -
Libero21 -
caseharts - If you have no grappling credentials you should be able to judge.
Judges also don't need to be ring side. Judging is better via video feed because of angles.

Also fire Kim Winslow Phone Post 3.0
This, they should be watching the fights in a quiet location, not ringside where fans can away their vote and they should have replays and a time to discuss their scores after the fight and change their scores if they were way off, a lot needs to be changed and there should be officials that watch the fights and oversee the ref and judges making shitty calls Phone Post 3.0
Good idea in theory, but taking them away from ringside opens up problems. Like any technical malfunction with the video feed and suddenly there's no way for a judge to score the fight. Phone Post 3.0
Judging should have to take two watch throughs so that wouldn't matter. As passionate as I get you need a chance to rewatch it before making a decision and they should possibly discuss it too Phone Post 3.0
Huh? So you think people and fighters should have to wait for judges to rewatch a fight before they determine a winner? Phone Post 3.0
I wouldn't mind if it meant more accurate and through judging.

If not that then they need more judges. 3 isn't enough. 5 would be good.

All judges need to have competed or currently training to be a judge. A good example would be ricardo almedia Phone Post 3.0

Always been against open scoring. All the concerns kizer has are accurate and very likely to happen if such a system where implemented. The real issue is not the system, although it could stand to be improved. The problem is the quality of judges/refs and nevedas reluctance to look at their past performances and still give them high profile shows to work at. Theres not enough accountability for them when they make big mistakes.

duckhuntgangsta - Open scoring is a horrible idea. It takes point fighting to a whole new level.

What the sport needs is more dynamic scoring. 10-7 for a one sided beating. 10-8 for a clear victory. 10-9 for a close victory. 10-10 if there was no clear victor.

In this scenario you could be down two 10-9 rounds and come back to and win or draw in the final. If there was a 3:00 or 5:00 sudden victory round all the better. Phone Post 3.0

This.

And judges need to start scoring a takedown as OCTAGON CONTROL, not some devastating strike.

they should just make an app and let the
fans decide :p

duckhuntgangsta - Open scoring is a horrible idea. It takes point fighting to a whole new level.

What the sport needs is more dynamic scoring. 10-7 for a one sided beating. 10-8 for a clear victory. 10-9 for a close victory. 10-10 if there was no clear victor.

In this scenario you could be down two 10-9 rounds and come back to and win or draw in the final. If there was a 3:00 or 5:00 sudden victory round all the better. Phone Post 3.0
Voted up for great reasoning Phone Post 3.0

Open scoring? lol
What you need are judges that were fighters. That is all.

Kizer has never covered why he thinks using boxing judges is still his best option for MMA, until he does, nothing he says is worth a mouse turd.