TimmyDome:
After I wrote the followingarticle for Bullshido.com, Seldon Marr went on the Bullshido.com forums about a year ago and claimed to have distanced himself from any association with the Pancration movement and from any claim to his own legitimacy through an association to the Pancration movement; however, he still makes the claim in the ads. He may be a great coach, but you can make any judgement about his character that you want according to his actions. I won't comment further, but here's the article:
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The Pancrase / Pancration Fraud
It must have been seven or eight years ago when I first heard the rumors about Pankrase (Pancrase, Pancration, Pankration, etc.) going to the Olympics. It was like a martial arts Messiah had arrived to save us from Olympic Tae Kwon Do and raise our respectability above non-Olympic activities like bowling and full-contact speed crocheting. There was shouting, praise for the organizers, and Kiai enhanced high fives everywhere. And then we waited, and waited, and waited.
Videos were released by "Olympic coaches", adds for seminars featured "Olympic coaches" and touted try-outs for national teams. Some instructors promoted their school or association through their "Olympic" association. And in the end where is Pankration? Who knows, but its not going to be in the Olympics.
The Pankration/Olympic connection is fraudulent. When the rumors of Pankration in the Olympics first surfaced they claimed Pankration would be in the Olympics as a demonstration sport, which was a lie flat out, no excuses, dishonest, purposefully misleading LIE! I personally contacted the US Olympic Committee and was informed that there would not be any demonstration sports in 2004 or at any Olympics to follow. Womens freestyle wrestling will be the only sport to debut at the 2004 Olympics but it will be as a regular sport, not a demonstration sport. Demonstration sports are dead and will remain so until the International Olympic Committee says otherwise.
Now, some members of the Pankration committee are finally recognizing that their sport wont be in the Olympics but they make a stake to legitimacy by claiming the sport will appear in the Olympic Youth Festival. Well, as someone from a former Olympic city (SLC 2002) I could have gotten competitive barbecue into the youth festival. So BIG deal. And, to top it off, where is the verification of participation in the youth festival? If someone has it, Id liked to see it (honestly, Im not trying to be sarcastic about it, I would).
Matt Hume of AMC Pankration was interviewed about the matter and here is what he had to say:
Matt Hume being interviewed by James Hirth
(http://www.primetimefighters.com/interviews/matt_hume.html)
[beginning of quote]
JH: It's not. Have you heard any recent speculation about it [Pankration in the Olympics]?
MH: I've heard speculation for years about it but when you contact the Olympic committees, they've never heard of it.
JH: Really? Nothing?
MH: As far as the Olympic committee's concerned there is never any Pankration planned in any Olympics.
JH: What would you attribute that to?
MH: Nobody's approached them with it and they've never taken it seriously. Nobody has made an effort really. I mean there are a lot of groups that say they have but the reality is that the Olympic committees have never heard of the people who say they're putting Pankration in the Olympics. (pause) So, it's not gonna be in there until the Olympic committees think it's for real and acknowledge it.
[end of quote]
Not only is there not going to be any demonstration sports in Athens, there hasnt even been an application made by Pankrations representatives to any known national Olympic committee, nor has their been an application to the International Olympic Committee.
(continue . . .)
( . . . continued)
Yet some people still claim a connection to the Olympics.
"Marr was also named to the National Coaching Staff of Team USA Pankration for the 2000 Olympic Games in Athens, Greece." Sheldon Marr: (http://www.grapplers-edge.com/instructors.htm)
Shamrock, Marr, and Hackney Olympic "Coaches" (image titled "Team USA Pankration Coaching Staff")
(http://www.grapplers-edge.com/images/dudes.jpg)
Jody Perry, a liar or just deceived? (http://www.perrysfullcircle.com/jodyperry/)
"&a certified Pankration referee for the 2004 Olympic Games, where Pankration is expected to be an exhibition sport."
Bart Vale still makes the claims in his adds that appear in most martial arts publications: http://www.2shoot.com/mag.gif
Honestly, if these people havent gotten the message that Pankration wont be in the Olympics then they are morons. And anytime a moron makes a claim to legitimacy in the martial arts it is instant McDojo red lights. And if they know that Pankration wont be in the Olympics then their claims are absolutely fraudulent. Theyre liars and thieves who have exposed themselves by using a fake connection to the Olympics to rip you and their students off.
To be fair, I couldnt find any recent claim by Shamrock to any association with Pankration or the Olympics. Additionally, Hackney (who was very visible in early Pankration/Olympic promotions) does not list any association on his web site. The above image is from Sheldon Marrs site and is a few years old.
Additionally, any sport trying to get accepted as a sport in the Olympics has many hurdles that they have to crest before their application can even be considered (Please note that this is a partial list of requirements, there are many, many more. I am trying to cut down all of the rules to a concise list for this discussion).
A sport must be practiced by:
1. Men in at least 75 nations and four continents.
2. Women in 40 nations and three continents.
And, a sport must:
3. Comply with the Olympic Movement Anti-Doping Code.
Does Pankration as a sport reach these numbers? No, and there has never been any claim that they do. Additionally, where is the structure necessary for compliance with the Olympic Movements Anti-Doping Code? Answer: it doesnt exist. Compliance implies enforcement. And there is no structure to enforce the anti-doping code.
Pankration will not be in the Olympics, not in 2004 and not for a very long time. Individuals and organizations that make claims to the contrary are either liars, con artists, or intellectually challenged and seriously misinformed.
Any honest, informed, intelligent instructor who has mistakenly associated themselves with the Pankration Olympic movement should distance themselves from said movement in a public vocal manner. Those who include claims to legitimacy through association to the Pankration Olympic movement need to remove those claims from their advertisements, websites, business cards etc. if they want to regain any legitimacy.
A little on the fallout over this . . . it has been reported that while pancration won't appear as an Olympic sport or a demonstration sport, it will be at the Olympics as part of the youth festival. People are still claiming legitimate ties between the Olympics and pancrase because of this.
Well, when the Winter Olympics were here in SLC. Utah they had quilting (as in hand sewn blankets) as part of the youth festival. I could have gotten competitive barbecue into the youth festival. The pancration movement is grasping at straws and those straws are getting shorter and shorter.
DJColdfusion thanks for your indepth report it was great. I'm also getting hungry and Barbecue sounds good.:) Master Bob
submission wrestling isn't going to get in the olympics either. the whole pankration thing is a scam.. glad people have finally wisened up this..it's not even in as an exhibition event.
MMA will NOT be in the olympics. Get over it.