“Real world” jiu jitsu was training and then going out with your buddies in Rio to pick fights with untrained dudes and having them jump in if you get in over your head.
When were rich guys running a country club martial arts gym finding themselves in these dangerous real life situations lol? Helio had to beat the shit out of a guy with a steel money box for embarrassing them. Definitely guys who were all about “defending” themselves lol.
Well I agree, but to say the sport BJJ giy is a tkd like martial artist is not accurate. Even against the wrestler the BJJ guy, if he is similar size and athletic could hold his own.
when I started juijitsu mid 90s it was at recommendation by my brst friend who was a cop and all his partners. We trained at station whenever I visited him. We had guys were former mil, 1 formerSEAL, competitive KB and all types of martial artists. Few of my partners taight were DT indtructors too.
I get thanked a few times from partners who are LE for what I taught.
So I dunno about real world juijitsu, but 
You make a good point…but can we trust what is being broadly taught?
I posted about my nephew training for 4-6 mos and at christmas dinner I asked him how training was going. His begiiners class eas doing xguard and dela riva. No clinch, no fighting based skill development…certainaly no boolshit SD crap.
I also posted about my friends daughters rape after 2yrs of bullshit BJJ
Jesus 
But it’s unfortunately relevant.
Also even an expert female marksmen might not have the stomach to kill someone like some men and for people like that a gun is just a liability. The disposition of the person carrying or defending themselves also matters. An extremely empathetic person probably shouldn’t be carrying if they’re not going to instinctually air a perp out.
Unfortunately for the some people compliance is the best survival strategy because they’d never be able to fight back hard enough to effectively defend themselves no matter how many jiu jitsu moves they get taught.
I was being a little hyperbolic.
Not to be confrontational, just because I’m too much of a smartass sometimes.
I train with a lot of the higher level guys here in Austin and the guys who wear me out aren’t doing “sport jiujitsu”. They are usually the younger guys who are extremely aggressive in their attacking, hand fighting, top position control and back control and going for the choke. I was rolling with Ethan Crelinsten one of the world class B team guys a month ago and it was like he was speaking a completely different language on the mats in terms of aggression, precision and attacks.
10th planet is generally regarded as the sport jiujitsu types but the 10p guys here are tough as fuck with their pressure and pace and they have a strong mma program at their gym. I got to roll with Cheick Kongo when he stopped in there. He’s as goddamn strong as you would expect.
I mean this whole discussion is a bit odd because jiujitsu/grappling isn’t MMA. We can do MMA with a grappling base.
Maybe I’m totally off base are we only talking about gi jiujitsu? If so you guys might be completely spot on with your comments.
What exactly are you looking for out of submission grappling training? Do you want it to be MMA? I guess I’m confused a little. Catch wrestling has a lot of very vicious stuff that jiujitsu doesn’t really push. Do you want it to be closer to that?
I guess I’m coming at it from a different perspective because I don’t train jiujitsu in a purely “sport” way. I’m definitely not a bad ass but I’ve been hit in the face far too many times on the mats to where I have to at least train with the mindset of protecting my face. I don’t just lay on my back and act like I’m jiujitsuing.
That said it is funny when I occasionally roll around with my wife who is a vicious little monster and will immediately start acting like she’s gonna bite me or grab for my balls lol. It definitely adds another element when someone is going spaz mode and doing that shit 
Add in biting, finger twisting, clawing, eye gouging, and ball twisting and we will definitely see some changes to the game 
how often do people drill guard passing positional drills, etc but one of your opponent’s objectives is to stand up? There’s nothing preventing this. Even within normal rolls where you both might not start standing… Once there is engagement, the guy on bottom might escape by standing, then one person sits as the roll continues if you don’t want to focus on takedowns or have the space with others around you… make your bjj what you want it to be
That was my point. Just because you’re playing guard doesn’t mean you need or want to stay down there, especially in a fight with striking involved.
I didn’t take offense. I like your posts, and I actually find Jiu Jitsu jokes funny.
I am careful not to get to used to using the gi in training. I think it hurts my gi game but I feel it is the best thing for me for self defense.
I always try to get the takedown and spend as little time on the bottom as possible
Not to be morbid, but could you link to these posts? I’d be interested in reading them.
How old was the girl and the perp? Unless the girl is a purple or above I don’t know how effective BJJ will be against a bigger man. Almost any martial arts will have limited use against a man.
Hope the rapist got punished
We train like this all the time in our comp classes. Top persons objective is to pass and/or prevent bottom from getting up, bottoms objective is to stand up and then shoot a takedown. It’s fucking tiring
i posted comments in some threads on the past…im not sure where/when
both around 16/17…not large disparity in size. Was more the comments how she couldnt even use anything she learned in training to defend herself, incliding the shit SD crap.
The underlying issue is that of training method, objectives, etc. All fugging lip service to defense.
I wonder what the best woman’s self defense class is
So I get that point. But if I get into a self defense altercation against a completely untrained guy, I have a decent enough single leg/trip to take the guy down. If I end up on my back I am closing distance and controlling posture with closed guard, butterfly or half. Im not “playing” guard
So you expect the lowest skilled opposition…is that wise?
I inderstand what you are saying, single opponent, not much physical disparity, in a situation that basically resembles a schooluard tussle…sure,what does it matter.
You point about ending up on your back…for many people that dont train for fighting, shot falls apart pretty fast when getting bombed. Ive seen it countless times in training.
And to go back to my friends daughter as an example…she did kindler-gentler jiujitsu, did a couple torneys, etc. I know the training she jad, my youngest daught got the same shit for several months til I pulled her out. Contrast that to what my daighter gets in a competitive judo club (despite not being into it and really kinda sucking), and my eldest daughters juijitsu training several years prior at my friends acadamy…smashing, grinding harder style training. I would hope my daughter could at least put up a fight because her DEFAULT training method was harsher. I know my eldest is tougher because I have seen her go with boys who were national level competitors…they sought her out to do newaza when prepping for comps and she smashed and took a smashing.
At least in a harsher training environment, people get tougher and can deal with more. If one goes a step further and make training include more elements of a fight…hopefully the person is even better equiped to uae their skills in a fight. Jijitsu is so full of shit…it markets itself toweds SD. If it didnt, I wouldnt give a shit and jave no critique of it. My nephew’s place also advertised that shit and wtf was he doing as a 4-6mo white belt!!!
Your example of what youd do if on your back…thats actually secondary. It is your default I guess because of training conditioning. Hence why I always make the point about defaults developed from training.
jujotsu has value…im not saying it doesnt. But if training methods and objectives dont support fighting at the fundamental level, then they are not serving their students honestly.