I agree with Sothy on this.....
I hope you are not being serious
Who me? I couldn't possibly be more serious. This is 2005, not the fucking Middle Ages or something. We're well past the Enlightenment and the realization of the freedom of the individual. So far past it that we (humankind) are starting to forget those realizations.
Governments have no power or authority to rule, except that which is granted to them by the ruled. And those being ruled may choose to take back that power and authority anytime they wish. In short, government is based on the consent of the governed... and in the United States our system of government was founded based on the recognition of principles of "natural law" and "inalienable rights." Rights which extend to the very point of overthrowing the government at gunpoint if it begins to infringe our rights (the ultimate act of civil disobedience).
"The law" means nothing... it was "legal" to own slaves from the framing of the Constitution until the passing of the 13th Amendment to the Constitution... does that mean that blacks who escaped or fought for their freedom before that date were in the wrong? No, because the fundamental principles of freedom override any written body of law. Inalienable rights are just that.. in-fucking-alienable. Period, end of story.
I like that and think that if someone is NOT getting paid, they shouldn't be exposed to the same risks as someone getting paid.
Whether you get paid or not is irrelevant. You as an individual (I'm using "you" in an abstract sense, here) have free will... you get to choose whether or not to accept the risks of stepping into the ring / cage / octagon under any given set of rules. Nobody is putting a gun to anybody's head and forcing them to fight.
I'd like to see knees on all fours in the UFC of course, but I also don't want to see amateur MMA fighters being exposed to the same rules as current UFC fighters.
I appreciate your sentiment, but what you want is also irrelevant. If I, as a free individual, want to step into a cage and fight, that is MY choice... I couldn't care less what your desires are.
Once they get paid, sure. They are professionals, they can take risks if they choose to.
Pay has nothing to do with this... Sovereignty of the individual does. No man has any dominion over another man to tell him what he may or may not do to his own body.
It really is too bad another internet yuck-yuck is going to mess up an important thread about a very real issue...
Dear lord, just read your web page, what a goof ball...
lkfmdc, did you get my email?
Swamp, it's probably on computer at work, obviously, I'm home by now, Ill try and answer you tomorrow
It really is too bad another internet yuck-yuck is going to mess up an important thread about a very real issue...
Right, lkfmdc, after all, we all know that little things like freedom and liberty are complete non-issues. But hey, if you guys are happy with being subjects of the State and have no interest in fundamental principles, that's your choice - however sad it may be.
Dear lord, just read your web page, what a goof ball...
I'm glad you found something amusing on my webpage... or was just a pathetic example of an ad-hominem attack? I would have expected better from somebody with a quote of " mind is a terrible thing to waste keep it open and learn what you can."
See if you can follow this
It's pretty clear your politics make you less than 1% of the population. You're an extremist and pretty darn irrational. You group Ralph Nadar in with Bush and Kerry, ie he's too "conventional" for you and your extreme views. So let's just politely suggest to you that your extremist views and political agenda are not wanted here. You're cluttering up the place while we discuss something real and important. Take it to your own thread, better yet, to the otherground. We're not buying what you're selling
Rather than buying a bunch of firearms, starting a compoud and trying to overthrow the government, we need to build a real network of amateur events patterned on successful organizations like Shooto
They allow those just starting out to get experience without being exposed to danger, to compete against similarly experienced people.
By showing we're rational and normal people, that we DO care about things like safety and public well being, we an work with commissions, not become on the run, fly by night outlaws.
Amateur shows that put inexperienced players in some safety gear, limit extremely dangerous techniques and bring them along with a "class system" will win commission support and approval.
If we're outlaws, no venue is going to have us, no sponsor is going to give us money. Anyone remember the UFC cable ban?
Also, more people are going to be willing to try it, with them comes their friends and family who are going to come and watch them do it. Think the average MMA event has a lot of spectators? Go to a NASKA sport karate event!
This is the future, not some "boston tea party rebellion" BS by some yuck yuck
See if you can follow this
lkfmdc, I doubt you could frame a discussion that I couldn't "follow." But what I will do is happily bow out of this thread so you guys can continue your discussion... there is a time and place for working "within the system" and there is a time for taking a different approach. Obviously we differ on the details of that, which is OK. I put an alternative position out there for people to evaluate and hopefully someone (obviously not you) finds some benefit in it.
We're not buying what you're selling
Maybe one day you'll realize that I'm not even selling anything.
Rather than buying a bunch of firearms, starting a compoud (sic) and trying to overthrow the government,
LOL, I can't let that one go. Nobody suggested doing any such thing, lkfmdc. If you want to have rational discussions with people, and have your opinion gain respect, you really should drop the ad-hominem attacks and straw-man arguments. Resorting to that stuff just makes you look silly; and is going to lead people to question whether your own positions have substance.
If you have something well reasoned and logically sound to say, just say that. Insults and 4th grade stuff add nothing of value.
Dear sir, despite what Llyod Eastman wrote, Maria Hsia Chang later demonstrated without a doubt, in both pathology and effect there is no difference between Fascists and Communists. Regardless of the direction you are, or think you are coming from, you are an extremist. And I speak for many of us when I say that we have no need for extremists. If you weren't selling it, you wouldn't interject it here. Now, I do hope you follow through on your promise and bow out, it's for the better, trust me
we need to build a real network of amateur events patterned on successful organizations like Shooto
They allow those just starting out to get experience without being exposed to danger, to compete against similarly experienced people.
By showing we're rational and normal people, that we DO care about things like safety and public well being, we an work with commissions, not become on the run, fly by night outlaws.
Amateur shows that put inexperienced players in some safety gear, limit extremely dangerous techniques and bring them along with a "class system" will win commission support and approval.
If we're outlaws, no venue is going to have us, no sponsor is going to give us money. Anyone remember the UFC cable ban?
Also, more people are going to be willing to try it, with them comes their friends and family who are going to come and watch them do it. Think the average MMA event has a lot of spectators? Go to a NASKA sport karate event!
I think the idea of amateur MMA is stupid. Should be pro only imo. I'm not gonna get my ass beat and potentially injured for free.
other sports have amateur leagues...soccer, football, rugby, baseball, basketball....why cant we have it in MMA? People make the decision to fight, they sign wavers that present to them what they are getting themselves into. If amateur MMA is gonna be taken away, take away golden gloves boxing too.
Ken, you're missing the point I think, if you're a beginner, you want to have the choice of all or nothing? Heck, you want to try it, full UFC rules against someone like Mark Coleman?
Why not have a safer version you can try tht you most likely won't get hurt doing and you can get some experience and actually ENJOY it...
Yup, vengence, exactly, we don't see talk of getting rid of amateur boxing, why would we want to get rid of amateur MMA?
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